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outsider
Trustworthy Freedom Fighter
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 Posted: Tue Dec 29, 2009 10:33 pm Post subject: |
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I prefer to let the expert, David Ray Griffin, deal with the 'debunkers'.
I have to earn a living, and squeeze my keyboarding in where I can; I cannot go into great detail, researching and posting supporting links etc.
But there is plenty of evidence out there, and on these Forums, for you to check out.
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Frank Freedom
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Posts: 413
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| Posted: Tue Dec 29, 2009 11:35 pm Post subject: |
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| outsider wrote: | I prefer to let the expert, David Ray Griffin, deal with the 'debunkers'.
I have to earn a living, and squeeze my keyboarding in where I can; I cannot go into great detail, researching and posting supporting links etc.
But there is plenty of evidence out there, and on these Forums, for you to check out. |
I agree,and the earlier work of Steven E Jones.
I say that as I think imo, thermite is disinfo,as may well be pools of molten metal under wtc's 1,2 and 7 (images supplied by NASA?) images
showing JCB lifting molten metal is a stretch too due to hydraulic oil/lines
in that environment would not stand up to the temps.
David Ray Griffin (another Griffin) has spoken about the need for one world government?
Sure there's much info to be had from various alternative media presentations,but imo when I revisit them I see much disinfo within the material presented.
That said (and helicopters apart) Rick Siegel's 9/11 Eyewitness shows
the demise of WTC 1 very well:
http://www.911eyewitness.com/samples/google_ejected_debris.php
Full online video site:
http://www.911eyewitness.com/videos01.html
Last post to Sam on this thread.
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Andrew Chapman
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Joined: 29 Dec 2009
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Location: Newcastle upon Tyne
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 4:04 am Post subject: |
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Why not both? Nano-thermite plus DEW or other advanced technology - scalar comes to mind although I have only a very hazy conception of what that is.
I had a look at AJ's response (in his book) to the Niels Harrit paper and he seems simply to say that it doesn't explain certain features of what happened on 9/11. He doesn't seem to make much effort to explain what Niels discovered. for example, those photos with the red layers at http://www.bentham-open.org/pages/content.php?TOCPJ/2009/00000002/0000 0001/7TOCPJ.SGM seem to my non-expert eye to be very unusual and man-made. Also somewhere Niels says that nano thermite appeared in the literature around 1999, which is suggestive too. Is it not also the case that thermite is used in normal controlled demolitions, so it could be expected that they might well use it to bring down the towers? Andrew does suggest that a small amount of thermite might have been used in the clean-up operation but Harrit had said that the total amount used was large, going by the proportion found in the dust samples, and Andrew doesn't attempt to counter this point
On the other hand, there is that footage of the remnant of the North Tower apparently turning to dust. I know that other explanations have been put forward but it still looks like that to me I must say. And I agree with what has been said about the level of technological advance that we might expect after 60 years of clandestine research.
So why not both?
Andrew |
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Frank Freedom
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 9:30 pm Post subject: |
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Why not all 3?
Explosives- visualised
Thermite (thermate et al)- found in the dust
and
Directed energy weaponry-explaining the anomalies found on site.
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outsider
Trustworthy Freedom Fighter
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Frank Freedom
Mind Gamer
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| Posted: Fri Jan 01, 2010 11:31 pm Post subject: |
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Internet Explorer cannot display the webpage
What you can try:
Diagnose Connection Problems
More information
Zapped by the power of electro-magnetic pulse resonant frequencies,do you think?
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outsider
Trustworthy Freedom Fighter
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Location: East London
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| Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 5:40 am Post subject: |
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| Frank Freedom wrote: |
Internet Explorer cannot display the webpage
What you can try:
Diagnose Connection Problems
More information
Zapped by the power of electro-magnetic pulse resonant frequencies,do you think?
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I also have Internet Explorer; I just clicked on both links, and they both came up straight away. Probably a temporary glitch with your computer.
I suggest you try again, and if they still don't come up, copy to Google search.
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'And he (the devil) said to him: To thee will I give all this power, and the glory of them; for to me they are delivered, and to whom I will, I give them'. Luke IV 5-7. |
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Frank Freedom
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| Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 5:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Active Thermitic Material Discovered in Dust from the 9/11 World Trade Center Catastrophe
pp.7-31 (25) Authors: Niels H. Harrit, Jeffrey Farrer, Steven E. Jones, Kevin R. Ryan, Frank M. Legge, Daniel Farnsworth, Gregg Roberts, James R. Gourley, Bradley R. Larsen
doi: 10.2174/1874412500902010007
Abstract
We have discovered distinctive red/gray chips in all the samples we have studied of the dust produced by the destruction of the World Trade Center. Examination of four of these samples, collected from separate sites, is reported in this paper. These red/gray chips show marked similarities in all four samples. One sample was collected by a Manhattan resident about ten minutes after the collapse of the second WTC Tower, two the next day, and a fourth about a week later. The properties of these chips were analyzed using optical microscopy, scanning electron microscopy (SEM), X-ray energy dispersive spectroscopy (XEDS), and differential scanning calorimetry (DSC). The red material contains grains approximately 100 nm across which are largely iron oxide, while aluminum is contained in tiny plate-like structures. Separation of components using methyl ethyl ketone demonstrated that elemental aluminum is present. The iron oxide and aluminum are intimately mixed in the red material. When ignited in a DSC device the chips exhibit large but narrow exotherms occurring at approximately 430 °C, far below the normal ignition temperature for conventional thermite. Numerous iron-rich spheres are clearly observed in the residue following the ignition of these peculiar red/gray chips. The red portion of these chips is found to be an unreacted thermitic material and highly energetic.
Keywords: JScanning electron microscopy, X-ray energy dispersive spectroscopy, Differential scanning calorimetry, DSC analysis, World Trade Center, WTC dust, 9/11, Iron-rich microspheres, Thermite, Super-thermite, Energetic nanocomposites, Nano-thermite
Affiliation: Department of Chemistry, University of Copenhagen, Copenhagen, DK-2100, Denmark.
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Has this evidence been put forward in any court or legal proceedings?
Sorry, I haven't been following developements with thermite/thermate nano,super or other names they may have labelled this since I last looked some time ago!
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outsider
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| Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 8:42 pm Post subject: |
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@FF: Court, Shmourt. Our people would love to get this stuff in Court, but it's easier to get some crackpot cases, like 'The Martians did 9/11', into Court.
Also remember, the **sholes have the Supreme Court sewn up. At the end of the day, all we can do is spread the Truth through the internet.
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'And he (the devil) said to him: To thee will I give all this power, and the glory of them; for to me they are delivered, and to whom I will, I give them'. Luke IV 5-7. |
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PookztA
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Joined: 07 Mar 2010
Posts: 73
Location: Illinois
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| Posted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 11:40 pm Post subject: |
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according to the video by Lee Woudberg, the word thermite only appears ONCE in the RFC sent in to NIST by Dr. Jones 3 weeks after Dr. Wood sent in her RFC. The only time it is mentioned is in a long URL. Not once in the paper is the word "thermite" used to discuss why the RFC was filed, nor to discuss Dr. Jones's thermite findings. He simply provides a link to his paper. If Dr. Jones was actually filing his thermite findings with NIST in his RFC, the word would have been found several times.
WOW.
Why wouldn't Dr. Jones discuss his thermite findings and his thermite conclusions in the NIST RFC? Why wouldn't he bring up thermite repeatedly in the RFC?
Very telling in my opinion.
XI. Lastly, I should let you know that I recently messaged Richard Gage and AE911Truth to ask him to contact Dr. Judy Wood, and as a result, I have been removed from the Petition Signers list on AE911Truth.org, despite the fact that I have donated over $100 dollars to Richard Gage and his organization over the past several months. As of the morning of March 4th, my name was removed from the AE911Truth petition, so it appears that I have been removed from the petition simply for asking about Dr. Judy Wood. This is very concerning, because I have not done anything wrong by asking Richard Gage to talk to Dr. Judy Wood and consider her research, yet AE911Truth.org has removed me from their petition simply for asking about her once in a private email. In addition, Richard Gage has never replied to any of my emails over the past several months, not even one of them, but Dr. Judy Wood has responded to several of my emails in just the last week. Oddly enough, Dr. Wood predicted that Richard Gage and Dr. Jones would ‘blacklist’ me for mentioning her, and she was right.
Peace to all,
-Abe
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Abrahm
Spreading Psytrance & Love in the Midwest USA
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GodSaveTheTeam
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Joined: 30 Nov 2006
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Location: the eyevolution
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| Posted: Fri Mar 12, 2010 2:25 am Post subject: |
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| PookztA wrote: | according to the video by Lee Woudberg, the word thermite only appears ONCE in the RFC sent in to NIST by Dr. Jones 3 weeks after Dr. Wood sent in her RFC. The only time it is mentioned is in a long URL. Not once in the paper is the word "thermite" used to discuss why the RFC was filed, nor to discuss Dr. Jones's thermite findings. He simply provides a link to his paper. If Dr. Jones was actually filing his thermite findings with NIST in his RFC, the word would have been found several times.
WOW.
Why wouldn't Dr. Jones discuss his thermite findings and his thermite conclusions in the NIST RFC? Why wouldn't he bring up thermite repeatedly in the RFC?
Very telling in my opinion. |
The point you have missed along with many others in other posts is that Judy Wood's apprentice, Johnson, made a glaring schoolboy "error" that grates harshly against the fact that he claims to have a background in "Software Engineering"...and has a website which claims to be "Always Checking the Evidence".
Rating nearly as highly as using the cherry-picked picture claiming there was no debris at Ground Zero on the "ooops, errr...well"...list.
Also, Wood's RFC does not mention The Hutchison "Effect" or Hurricane Erin once, two of the main parts of her own research.
It's tit for tat as usual with the Woodcult.
Sending an RFC with the word "thermite" mentioned in it a zillion times saying "it was this what done it" after every inclusion would not help to obtain a correction from NIST. Nor does including the word DEW.
The whole point of an RFC is to ask NIST to correct THEIR OWN scientific approach and not just swap their analysis for someone else's.
The Jones RFC includes a link to.....wait for it....A PEER REVIEWED paper which mention "thermite" 57 times. Is that enough times for you?
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Frank Freedom
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GodSaveTheTeam
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| Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2010 9:37 pm Post subject: |
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The article linked to contains heavy pro-OCT bias
Is this what the Woodcult are using to debunk the Jonescult? An article written by people who believe the official story?
Is that what it's come to?
In the end there are grave doubts about both parties.
Jones' ties to the Cold Fusion legend. Wood's use of easily debunkable pseudo-science.
I tend to wonder, are we all being led up the garden path?
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outsider
Trustworthy Freedom Fighter
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| Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2010 10:31 pm Post subject: |
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| GodSaveTheTeam wrote: | The article linked to contains heavy pro-OCT bias
Is this what the Woodcult are using to debunk the Jonescult? An article written by people who believe the official story?
Is that what it's come to?
In the end there are grave doubts about both parties.
Jones' ties to the Cold Fusion legend. Wood's use of easily debunkable pseudo-science.
I tend to wonder, are we all being led up the garden path? |
Only if we allow ourselves to be; we all make mistakes; 'Cold Fusion' would appear to be Jones's; but the thermite/ thermate/nanothermite/ate is peer review'd; Wood's boloney would get laughed out of court (unless, of course, they had an 'Agenda', frinstance discrediting us Truthers).
So Jones was mistaken on 'cold fusion'; that makes him wrong on anything else he touches, already? Follow the evidence he provides; seek in vain for Wood's 'evidence'.
_________________
'And he (the devil) said to him: To thee will I give all this power, and the glory of them; for to me they are delivered, and to whom I will, I give them'. Luke IV 5-7. |
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gruts
Major Poster
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Posts: 1050
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| Posted: Sun Mar 14, 2010 11:49 am Post subject: |
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by doing a quick google search on the titles of the threads you posted here I noticed that you've been simultaneously spamming the exact same stuff on pretty much every forum on the internet.
wow indeed....
are you the new CB Brooklyn?
and how on earth do you find the time to study?
especially as you're also a dj - have you got any nice mixes to share?
| Quote: | | Abraham Hafiz Rodriguez (Abrahm) is a co-founder of the Mindoutpsyde non-profit organization, and he is currently studying medicine in pursuit of his dream of becoming a neurosurgeon. In addition to his scientific understanding of the Universe, Abrahm also has a strong understanding of music due to many years of classical piano lessons during his youth. Combining his deep understanding of the physical Universe with a strong desire to catalyze positive changes for our planet, Abrahm sends waves of positive energy rippling throughout the dance floor. This positive intention allows Abrahm to release an enormous amount of optimistic energy during his sets, transforming the dance floor into a tribal stomping frenzy. Leaving a crater of positive impact wherever he performs, this psyentist is devoted to stimulating every neuron in your body with some of the most powerful Psytrance available today. |
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Frank Freedom
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Location: South Essex
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| Posted: Sun Mar 14, 2010 2:49 pm Post subject: |
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| GodSaveTheTeam wrote: | The article linked to contains heavy pro-OCT bias
Is this what the Woodcult are using to debunk the Jonescult? An article written by people who believe the official story?
Is that what it's come to?
In the end there are grave doubts about both parties.
Jones' ties to the Cold Fusion legend. Wood's use of easily debunkable pseudo-science.
I tend to wonder, are we all being led up the garden path? |
It certainly is the case that the Woodcult are using very relevent research pertaining to the peer review system of the Jonescult ,
despite being from a OCT biased source.
I agree,Wood doesn't speak in very scientific terms,there again neither does Jones, both involve belief in huge chunks of their of "evidence".
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Micpsi
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Posts: 505
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| Posted: Sun Mar 14, 2010 7:46 pm Post subject: |
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| outsider wrote: | | GodSaveTheTeam wrote: | The article linked to contains heavy pro-OCT bias
Is this what the Woodcult are using to debunk the Jonescult? An article written by people who believe the official story?
Is that what it's come to?
In the end there are grave doubts about both parties.
Jones' ties to the Cold Fusion legend. Wood's use of easily debunkable pseudo-science.
I tend to wonder, are we all being led up the garden path? |
Only if we allow ourselves to be; we all make mistakes; 'Cold Fusion' would appear to be Jones's; but the thermite/ thermate/nanothermite/ate is peer review'd; Wood's boloney would get laughed out of court (unless, of course, they had an 'Agenda', frinstance discrediting us Truthers).
So Jones was mistaken on 'cold fusion'; that makes him wrong on anything else he touches, already? Follow the evidence he provides; seek in vain for Wood's 'evidence'. |
Er, where's the evidence other than what he claims to have found (it really amounts only to a contestable interpretation)? You have to take his word for it that his data is unbiased by contamination and his scientific protocols sound. There has been NO replication of his own results - the sine qua non of scientific research. He never told you that he got his dust samples from the very company that cleared up Ground Zero. Published in a peer-reviewed journal? Big deal! I have seen dozens of papers published in such journals that were so bad they should never have seen the light of day. It does NOT mean that the paper is sound.
Ask Jones why he never analyzed his samples for high-explosives and refuses still to do so.........
(P.S. He won't tell you).
Both the Woodcult and the Jonescult are cul-de-sacs for the scientifically uneducated. Their "work" would be laughed out of any scientific conference. They get away with their travesties being unchallenged because so few well-qualified scientists have the courage to become involved in the 9/11 movement. |
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outsider
Trustworthy Freedom Fighter
Joined: 30 Jul 2006
Posts: 6060
Location: East London
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| Posted: Sun Mar 14, 2010 9:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Micpsi wrote: | | outsider wrote: | | GodSaveTheTeam wrote: | The article linked to contains heavy pro-OCT bias
Is this what the Woodcult are using to debunk the Jonescult? An article written by people who believe the official story?
Is that what it's come to?
In the end there are grave doubts about both parties.
Jones' ties to the Cold Fusion legend. Wood's use of easily debunkable pseudo-science.
I tend to wonder, are we all being led up the garden path? |
Only if we allow ourselves to be; we all make mistakes; 'Cold Fusion' would appear to be Jones's; but the thermite/ thermate/nanothermite/ate is peer review'd; Wood's boloney would get laughed out of court (unless, of course, they had an 'Agenda', frinstance discrediting us Truthers).
So Jones was mistaken on 'cold fusion'; that makes him wrong on anything else he touches, already? Follow the evidence he provides; seek in vain for Wood's 'evidence'. |
Er, where's the evidence other than what he claims to have found (it really amounts only to a contestable interpretation)? You have to take his word for it that his data is unbiased by contamination and his scientific protocols sound. There has been NO replication of his own results - the sine qua non of scientific research. He never told you that he got his dust samples from the very company that cleared up Ground Zero. Published in a peer-reviewed journal? Big deal! I have seen dozens of papers published in such journals that were so bad they should never have seen the light of day. It does NOT mean that the paper is sound.
Ask Jones why he never analyzed his samples for high-explosives and refuses still to do so.........
(P.S. He won't tell you).
Both the Woodcult and the Jonescult are cul-de-sacs for the scientifically uneducated. Their "work" would be laughed out of any scientific conference. They get away with their travesties being unchallenged because so few well-qualified scientists have the courage to become involved in the 9/11 movement. |
And, of course, 1,000 plus Architects and Engineers have put their livelihoods (and perhaps more) on the line, to support this interpration?
Strange brew? Who, among the Architects and Engineers, is willing to back up Woods & Hutchison?
If it looks like disinfo, walks like disinfo, quacks like disinfo, and smells like disinfo, well, chances are pretty good it is just that.
Not that some well-meaning people can't be swayed by such baloney, but baloney it most assuredly is.
Get Woods or Hutchison to debate this issue, in a public forum, with our guys and gals.
Go ahead, get your champions to take up this challenge (which I offer off the cuff, secure in the knowledge that our people are ready, willing and able to make account for their views and opinions).
_________________
'And he (the devil) said to him: To thee will I give all this power, and the glory of them; for to me they are delivered, and to whom I will, I give them'. Luke IV 5-7. |
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