Joined: 25 Jul 2005 Posts: 18335 Location: St. Pauls, Bristol, England
Posted: Mon May 03, 2010 12:40 pm Post subject:
Fintan, this fake 'exposer of truth' is great because he points us towards some brilliant commentators, who he singles out for condemnation, and web sites that we may have missed.
He does say some sensible stuff about GHW Bush being a Nazi though for those who haven't read Webster Tarpley's book.
This is a weird site.
Fintan 'posing' as a radical Irish?
He says this rather silly quote....
"The entire 9/11 Truth movement was a creation of the intelligence agencies who had conspired with one another to carry out the attacks".
First individual he dicredits is Daniel Hopsicker who may have been he victim of a sting, or not.
I do admit that it can be hard to face up to the fact
that you've been conned for years by a very slick
intelligence operation commensurate to covering up
the crime of the century.
Think these people didn't see you coming?
But you either face that or else continue to be run
around in ever decreasing circles by intel goons.
Quote:
TonyGosling:
First individual he dicredits is Daniel Hopsicker
who may have been he victim of a sting, or not.
Aren't you being rather too generous to Hopsicker, for someone
who is supposed to be a hard-nosed 9/11 investigator?
"May have been a victim of a sting" ?!?
Amanda Keller and Hopsicker were an intel operation. Wake Up.
What is this? Amateur hour?
If so, against professionals you don't stand a chance of cracking 9/11.
Quote:
16th August, 2005
And so it is with great honour that we nominate Ms. Amanda Keller,
reputed long-term girlfriend of 9/11 'mastermind', Mohammed Atta
for the award in the category of 'Best Supporting Actress in a 9/11 Coverup.'
That extract above is me outing Keller/Hopsicker
as an intel operation on 16th August, 2005.
Then 13 months later, this happens:
Quote:
September 10. 2006
"It was my bad for lying. I really didn't
think about it until after I did it."
By HEATHER ALLEN
For five years, Amanda Keller has been portrayed by conspiracy theorists as Mohamed Atta's lover.
But the former Venice stripper now says her boyfriend was another flight student not connected to 9/11. And, for the first time, federal investigators say she's right.
"There's nothing there to corroborate the relationship between the two," a New York-based FBI counterterrorism agent said recently after reviewing 9/11 case files.
The agent got clearance to talk from the U.S. Attorney's Office and the FBI, but only agreed if his named was not used.
Among other things, the government checked Atta's phone records and found the two had never called each other.
In 2002, Keller granted an interview with Daniel Hopsicker, a Venice self-published writer who maintains the government has covered up facts about 9/11.
In a taped interview that has circled the Internet, Keller casually discusses intimate details about her relationship with "Mohamed." She claimed it was Atta, but changed her story soon after.
"It was my bad for lying," Keller said. "I really didn't think about it until after I did it."
Keller, 24, is engaged and is studying to become a nurse. She moved to Ohio in early 2002 and said she hoped that by getting married and changing her name, she could finally leave the rumors behind.
Then there's the case of Wayne Madsen.
I posted here on another thread about how he was spreading tinfoil
disinfo to cover Bush's tracks after the stolen election of 2004:
Wayne Madsen? The guy who outed Mueller over the Murrah building cover-up? Hmm, do you mean that Wayne Madsen?
I'll see your fifteen and raise you another thirty, Mr Dunne. C'mon, they're all only human, all have agendas to grind, all part of the Brotherhood, wittingly or otherwise - but they have ALL shed more light into the darkest spaces than the rest of us, so where does that leave you?
Up triple, nay, quintuple-agent alley - without a paddle, IMO...
Go look up Mike Vreeland - if you can convincingly untangle that precursor then you probably have extra-terrestial friends ;-)
9/11 Vuja De is no longer needed - sufficient evidence is already in. Just add willpower...
. _________________ "We will lead every revolution against us!" - attrib: Theodor Herzl
"Timely Demise to All Oppressors - at their Convenience!" - 'Interesting Times', Terry Pratchett
Let me quote from my CIA Fakes article so we can fully appreciate
the role people like Madsen play at pivotal moments. That's when
their carefully built reputation is used to at a vital time. Like this:
Quote:
Remember back in the summer of 2004. Everybody Knew Bush was going down. Despite the official polls, true sentiment in the U.S. was running 60:40 against the president. Actual votes on the day were likely to run around Kerry 55/Bush 45.
Nobody expected Karl Rove to take this lying down, so when pundits predicted he was about to stage the 'capture' of Osama, or was plotting a fake terrorism attack to boost Bush, it seemed credible.
This perception was reinforced by the like of Wayne Madsen's confidential 'sources', who in the closing stages of the election campaign reported that the terror strike was imminent.
It never happened. The elite didn't ensure Bush's reelection by means of a fake terror strike.
They stole the election instead. As they had always planned to do. While carefully misdirecting us to look elsewhere during the run up. Now that's good quality disinformation. Notice the emotional surface appeal of the terror attack spin. Always the appeal to the emotions -to get reason looking the other way.
...and they went Whoaaa. "This guy is ex-NSA!" Then they read how his
story of a multi-million-dollar check to an offshore Bush trust fund being
used to steal the election was a red herring and they went Whoaaa again.
And finally, being as how they were reeling from the Bush "victory" and
trying to figure how they got screwed soooo bad..... when they read that
Madsen had helped to decoy them into expecting an October Surprise
attack on Iran --just days before the election (when Bush actually was
going to steal the vote like in 2000 ) they went Whoaaa for a third tiime.
( http://www.lebanonwire.com/0410/04102002LW.asp )
Then they went back to Whoaaa number 1, and they said "ex-NSA, Eh?"
And they dumped him faster than a pneumatic trash van empties bins.
I was there. I wrote the article. I saw him go down in flames.
Here's a more recent missive
I wrote about him on 17 May 2009:
So, Madsen also has a career on Russia Today, having now featured in
a dozen reports on the station --which is an arm of state-owned propaganda
agency RIA-Novosti.
Here's some 'agitatsiya' featuring Madsen on on Russia Today
at the time of outrage over the assassination by poison of Alexander Litvinenko.
His reassuring words, (letting Russia off the hook ) were:
Quote:
“There was no interest by the Russian government in creating a potential
martyr in an individual, especially in Mr Litvinenko, who had links with all
kinds of unsavoury characters,” says Wayne Madsen, a Washington-
based investigative journalist. “To do this would actually hurt the Russian
government.”
Link
And Russia Today also aired Madsen's tinfoil claims that the recent
Swine Flu outbreak was due to a virus that might have been built in
a laboratory:
Quote:
28 April, 2009, 07:13
Investigative journalist from Washington Wayne Madsen says
the outbreak of the swine flu virus is raising suspicions. The sources
quoted by him say it could be manmade.
Of course, Madsen based that report on 'sources' he never named in print
or on air. But that M.O. is pretty much par for the course for Madsen, who
specializes in sourceless reports that could never make it into print in any
reputable publication.
That's not a problem for Russia Today, which has no reputation to
speak of anyway:
Quote:
Russia Today sets out to present the Russian point of view on events in
Russia and its 'near abroad' and give the viewers an opportunity to get
acquainted with Russian views on world and domestic events. Margarita
Simonyan, Russia Today's editor-in-chief, says the station was born out
of the desire to present an "unbiased portrait of Russia".
Western state and commercial media claim that Russia Today has close
ties with the Russian state authorities and a few years after the channel
started broadcasting, for being a "cheerleader" of the Kremlin, applying
positive spin to reports about governmental institutions and refraining
from criticizing Prime Minister and former Russian president Vladimir
Putin or the government......
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russia_Today_TV
Interesting that someone who is formerly(ahem) of the NSA is
now comfortably providing services to Russian propaganda TV!
FintanDunne wrote:
Amanda Keller and Hopsicker were an intel operation. Wake Up.
TonyGosling:
No,
You wake up.
Who said otherwise?
Who said?
You said:
"Daniel Hopsicker who may have been the victim of a sting, or not."
So, I'm saying there's no "may or not" about it.
No biggie. Maybe you agree.
I wrote this below in June 2006, laying out
"Keller" and Hopsicker's game in full:
Like Lee Harvey Oswald, ol' Mohammed Atta ain't around
anymore to chat about things. They're both classic patsies,
either dead or permanently AWOL.
But such patsies are more than just a convenient fall guy.
A good patsy also has a well-laid back story. (So he is
invariably an agent/employee which means he can be sent
hither and thither to build up his background.)
The idea is that not only does the patsy take the fall
for the Op as it is presented in the mainstream media,
but the patsy is dripping with enough shady associations
to keep the "conspiracy theory" crew busy chasing after
the patsy's back story trying to find out where these
associations lead. The more promising these associations
look on the surface, the more time people are going to
spend.
Which is beautiful. Because this guy is the patsy, after all.
He is by definition a complete waste of time. Mere fall guy.
Every moment that the "conspiracy" brigade spend chasing down
this guy is a bonus. They could be off doing something useful.
A patsy with a well-designed back story can keep everybody
diverted for years, especially if you slowly leak out info,
dangling these shady links with the promise that they will
eventually lead somewhere.
Mohammed Atta is 9/11's quintissential red herring.
He leads us all nowhere but where he is designed to lead.
Which is nowhere.
It's easy to lose sight of that fact as the tales of
drugs 'n guns and wild parties and coke sniffing are
dangled before us.
But a patsy is a patsy, is a patsy. Period.
He's an agency boy, designed from the ground up to waste your time.
THE PROMO CREW
However, the patsy is, by definition, very dead (or missing) quite
early on in the Op. He isn't around to talk about himself. So others
have to be put in place to do the talking.
And so we have Amamda Keller, poised and waiting with tales of a
spaced-out psycho, who ran drugs and just loooooved pork chops.
Yeah. Keller is so obviously agency that it's painful.
And Amamda's wild stories come to us via Dan Hopsicker --who just
happens to have the 'exclusive' on interviewing Amamda. She's got
a story that's worth milions if put in a book, but Hopsicker's
the only conduit.
She and Hopsicker are the core of the 'Patsy Tale' promo brigade.
Hopsickler interviewing Keller is a sick joke where one agency
op interviews another. Scripted revelations, scripted dialog,
scripted drip-drip-drip of salacious details. A wild party here,
a planeload of dope there. Atta aboard a shady offshore casino,
Atta dipped in Huffmann Aviation and drugs.
Ty Rauber's "Who Killed John O'Neill" is regurgitated Hopsicker.
It's a prefect piece of promo for the "Atta Flying circus". In one
unforgettable line of the movie, Atta is even referred to as
"the new Barry Seale."
It's 'Atta the drug baron' in all his agency-inspired glory.
So it's not surprising that in June 2004:
Quote:
"Filmmaker Ty Rauber and writer Ryan Thurston, this week guests
at a party with Daniel Hopsicker in New York, currently promoting
their movie ""Who Killed John O'Neill?".
Hopsicker has reasons to party. He had just been awarded "Guerrilla
of the Week" by the George Soros-backed Guerilla News Network.
The night out was sponsored by INN, who brought us Nico Haupt,
architect of the MIHOP/LIHOP schism.
Quote:
INN World Report will throw a party with Daniel Hopsicker,
Sander Hicks and our co-producer Tom Kiely at Sugar,
Downtown Manhattan.
Sugar: 311 Church Street, New York (just one block south of Canal and our TV studio)
Friday, June 11th * 7:00 PM - 8:30 PM Complimentary Fruit, Cheese and Sangria!
Guest of Honor: Daniel Hopsicker, who will speak on subjects
related to Welcome to Terrorland.
Leaving aside the question of whether a "party" is the appropriate
venue to discuss the mass murder of a few thousand people, this
is clearly a patsy promo event.
But the movie is derivative, in that it regurgitates Hopsicker.
So the only worthwhile question is whether Ty Rauber just got
suckered into this agency op..... or not.
That's why I asked Ty to say if, on reflection, he accepts that
the whole "Atta" thing is an agency sucker pitch.
Joined: 30 Nov 2006 Posts: 575 Location: the eyevolution
Posted: Mon May 03, 2010 10:15 pm Post subject:
Your assertion that the truth movement has been controlled from the beginning may be true but I think the Hopsicker detail that you're outlining here is a bit of non issue with most "truthers". Especially in the european side of the "movement".
I'd say that the majority of people here have probably not even seen the under-produced "flying circus". I could be wrong of course.
I'd definitely agree with something that you said in your broadcast that people focus too much on the physical evidence. That issue gets batted back and forth by the Jones and Wood crowd endlessly around here.
I've been saying for a few years now that there's so much more to 9/11 than "freefall speed" and "dustification" like the Genoa G8 "Bush on a boat" scandal, Able Danger and the "hijackers" ties to intelligence agencies.
However, if you think the 9/11 movement has been controlled from the beginning then you probably discount the points I just raised as bogus as they're discussed by many of your "suspects" and featured in films made by those in your list.
GodSaveTheTeam:
I think the Hopsicker detail that you're outlining here is a bit of non issue
with most "truthers". Especially in the european side of the "movement".
Agreed. I'm just detailing the Hopsicker/Keller issue
to show how slick their red herring setups have been.
Way back when in 2003-2005 I interviewed Hopsicker a number
of times and back then he was linking his deception angle about
Atta the Drug Runner with what Sibel Edmonds was saying.
The line was that 9/11 was a drug war between Osama & Bush.
A lot of people on the left were buying Hopsicker/Keller/Edmonds.
It was smoke and fog.
Quote:
GodSaveTheTeam
I've been saying for a few years now that there's so much more to 9/11 than "freefall speed" and "dustification" like the Genoa G8 "Bush on a boat" scandal, Able Danger and the "hijackers" ties to intelligence agencies.
However, if you think the 9/11 movement has been controlled from the beginning then you probably discount the points I just raised as bogus as they're discussed by many of your "suspects" and featured in films made by those in your list.
Yeah, the movement has been plagued by free fall, no planes,
spacebeams, pentagon missile BS and nanothermite nonsense.
Anyone who thinks these people designed an Op which
would leave physical evidence is underestimating them.
Physical evidence trails are dead ends.
Consider how much of our time that's eaten up!
I'm well inclined to follow issues like the European intel agencies:
UK, Dutch and German etc. But Able Danger just reinforces LIHOP
or negligence spin on events.
I'm just using a few of the Fakes like Hopsicker/Edmonds/Keller/Edmonds
to illustrate some points about the scale of the operations prepped to
feed to the 9/11 Truthers.
I can and have made the same kind of case about many others.
These Ops needed to look promising, because that allowed them
generate control of the agenda by building loyalty to their controlled
alternative media who were giving these lines airtime.
But, as I said, the real issue is how deep the rot goes.
I've been saying since 2005 that they control the agenda and talking
points of the 9/11 Truth movement --and have done since the get go.
Joined: 30 Nov 2006 Posts: 575 Location: the eyevolution
Posted: Mon May 03, 2010 11:46 pm Post subject:
FintanDunne wrote:
Able Danger just reinforces LIHOP
or negligence spin on events.
I agree and disagree. The official line on Able Danger from someone like Shaffer does put a certain LIHOP spin on things.
But someone so immersed in the official intel-world (depending on rank/level) as Shaffer was/is may not doubt the higher-up's spin that Al-Q are a real threat and that Able Danger is a credible outfit with a true purpose. The top-down nature of intel keeps a lot of plates spinning as well as the heads of the lower ranking operatives.
What the official line of A.D. does outline though is that it was called off just when the system was "blinking red" and that Shaffer's concerns to meet with top intel operatives and ask "why!" was turned down with no justifiable reasons given.
It's a piece of the jigsaw. Along with others, like Edmonds' assertion that intel was in communication "with OBL and Al-Q right up to 9/11" and Richard Wright's claims that his work was being undermined before 9/11 it shows that intelligence agencies were being deliberately misled and blocked from doing their jobs properly.
I dont see how these pieces of evidence are misleading when considered as a whole.
FintanDunne wrote:
But, as I said, the real issue is how deep the rot goes.
I've been saying since 2005 that they control the agenda and talking
points of the 9/11 Truth movement --and have done since the get go.
Would you expect them to do anything less?
I think it's a big leap to suggest everyone in your list has been presented to us by "Them".
Sure They'd want to throw us off the scent but as you say they have the mainstream for that. Most people dont even know anyone from your "list" anyway.
On the one hand your claiming to be one of the few to grasp the bogus nature of the "movement" and on the other you say that they'd never leave any evidence behind... _________________ http://www.youtube.com/user/bobzimmerfan?feature=mhum#p/a
I agree that Able Danger has some merits for us. It just that due to their effective media compartmentalization, it is spun in mainstream as mere accidental screw-up and then in alternative as mere LIHOP.
As to Edmonds saying intel was in contact with "OBL and Al-Q right up to 9/11", that's got a sting in the tail. In that it helps persuade you OBL was alive at the time of 9/11.
Yes, it is a big leap that everyone on the CIA Fakes list "has been presented to us by Them". But then, I never said that.
From day one the CIA Fakes article has carried this rider:
Quote:
"Note: We do not contend that everyone associated with these websites are knowing intelligence operatives. Some have been professionally manipulated, others merely misled. In any event these are promoting the psyop agendas and disinformation themes of the covert controllers."
GodSaveTheTeam:
Most people dont even know anyone from your "list" anyway.
Well I should clarify that 9/11DejaVu is mostly aimed at wising up
the dedicated members of the truth movement itself and not at the
general public or the horde of YouTube 9/11 idiots.
Quote:
GodSaveTheTeam:
Sure They'd want to throw us off the scent but as you say they have the mainstream for that.
For sure, they have the mainstream for that. But we are wary enough
to view mainstream coverage with a high level of skepticism. Also bear in
mind that they can't very well use the mainstream to push say, LIHOP
or other angles which admit 9/11 was a covert Op.
Far better for them to control the entire direction of
the movement, and entrench within it their covert Ops,
via what we regard as our own "alternative" 9/11 media. _________________ The CIA Fakeshttp://911DejaVu.com
I also wonder why you concentrate on the messengers rather than the message, however distorted? As I said before, the concrete evidence is already there for all to see.
I note you 'have it in' for Sybil Edmonds twice above - why her particularly? Can you see only one reason why ex-govt operatives choose to become whistleblowers? They can't all be manchurian candidates, surely?
BTW, you seem to have missed out Patrick Fitzgerald and the 'special prosecutor' fiasco... _________________ "We will lead every revolution against us!" - attrib: Theodor Herzl
"Timely Demise to All Oppressors - at their Convenience!" - 'Interesting Times', Terry Pratchett
Thermate911:
I also wonder why you concentrate on the messengers rather than the message
Well, If you identify the suspect mesengers you can then look
at the message they are promoting --knowing that the truth
is in a direction opposite to which they are pointing you.
Quote:
Thermate911:
I note you 'have it in' for Sybil Edmonds twice above - why her particularly?
Big topic, but see the post below this one
for analysis of Fitzgerald and Edmonds:
Also read:
Quote:
Some people have wondered why I have
a downer on Sibel Edmonds.
So here's a compliation
that nails it good:
In the CIA Internet Fakes, released 4th August, 2005, we outed
a host of websites --either controlled by the CIA/FBI/KGB/ETC,
or hopelessly compromised by willingly gushing out heaps of Intel-
designed 9/11 Tabloid Crud. Then, in 9/11 Rats Nest: Part 1
we identified the people trying so hard to fool you.
Now, let's see how the same crew of CIA Fakes have staged
'PlameGate,' and other pivotal CIA-managed operations.
Ed Note: This article was written before the Libby trial result.
In the end, Bush commuted Libby's 30-month prison sentence
Some of this ground, I have covered before, as you will see if you follow
the key hyperlinks. But developments in the Scooter Libby's 'PlameGate'
case mean that an overview of events is going to be very informative.
It's going to show you how the CIA Fakes are singing dumb on the most
blatant piece of political engineering since... well, since WaterGate!
The CIA Fakes are careful never to clue you in to the really key 'Ops.'
God forbid you should figure out what is really going on. And it doesn't
take the wisdom of Solomon to discern it. As you will see.
Speaking of Solomon, and as a good starting point, consider this article
from Norman Solomon on the usually, rather unsurprising AlterNet.
Can you read between these lines? This is about as close as anyone
besides yours truly has come to outing Judith Miller as a CIA agent.
Here's goes Norman Solomon, sailing as close to the wind as the
mainstream allows, in this commentary on PlameGate:
Quote:
Judith Miller, the Fourth Estate and the Warfare State
By Norman Solomon, AlterNet. October 17, 2005.
During the propaganda buildup for the invasion of Iraq, Judith Miller and the New York Times served as a key asset of the warfare state.
Judith Miller is a reporter for the New York Times. After the invasion, on assignment to cover a U.S. military unit as it searches for WMDs in Iraq, she's given "clearance" by the Pentagon "to see secret information" -- which she "was not permitted to discuss" with Times editors.
"There's nothing wrong with this picture if Judith Miller is an intelligence operative for the U.S. government. But if she's supposed to be a journalist, this is a preposterous situation..."
http://alternet.org/columnists/story/26947/
Well! If that isn't dropping a big hint that Miller is one of the legion of CIA
hacks spattered across mainstream and alternative media, then Solomon
must be just exercising his writing talent to uselessly pad out sentences.
I've been saying since early Fall 2005, that the Plame affair is a contrived
scandal. Just as 'MonicaGate'' was. Just as WaterGate was.
All these are CIA/Establishment constructions to keep the masses amused
and befuddled, while arranging political earthquakes which signal planned
shifts in the landscape of the monotonous, two-in-one-party US political
monopoly. And the more it changes, the more it stays the same.
And if even Solomon can point to the tip of that iceberg, then surely that
begs the question of why we are so vocal about the rest of the iceberg --
while the CIA Fakes are buzy singing dumb.
Because this is much bigger than just Judith Miller. (Who only did jail time
because that was necessary to give legs to the PlameGate scandal. All part
of the carefull coreography of this well-managed "scandal.")
SEE NO EVIL
First they promised the Democratic heartland the head of George Bush.
It never happened. Kerry's deep roots in the D.C. establishment saw to that.
Then it was Karl Rove's head which was dangled as bait to keep the left
clinging to the delusion of real politics. But GannonGate never paid off.
Now it is Dick Cheney's head which is the latest lure. That prospect has
always been the subtext of the PlameGate issue. It won't happen.
But that must never be even hinted at by the left's disinformation crew.
To illustrate, here's some calculated spinning by Justin Raimondo, who
clearly buys all this BS - or appears to anyway:
Quote:
"Before Fitzgerald is done, we'll see the warlords of Washington hauled before a court of the people. We'll hear the whole sordid story of how a band of exiles, at least two foreign intelligence agencies, and a cabal of neoconservatives inside the Pentagon and the vice president's office bamboozled Congress and the American people into going to war."
http://www.antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=7681
Note the persistent "Blame it on the Neocons" angle. They "bamboozled
Congress," you see. Their tail wagged the world superpower dog.
( According to this prefabricated "fall-guys" routine, the invasion of Iraq and
the preceeding mass-murder on the 9/11, were NOT the bright idea of the
Washington Establishment and their G8 henchmen. They are peace-loving
diplomats who were simply fooled by the nasty neocons. ROTFLMAO! )
The latest Plamegate developments are being hyped by the left media, as
if the heads of both Libby and of Cheney are already on the block -
awaiting the coup-de-grace.
Forget it............
Note that Judge Reggie Walton is presiding over the Libby case.
He is sitting on the case, by arrangement.
The Libby case is a fake.
Ponder the implications of this:
Walton was appointed to the Superior Court of the District of Columbia by
President Reagan from 1981 to 1989. And by President George
H. W. Bush from 1991 to 2001.
He was nominated as a United States District Judge for the District of
Columbia on October 29, 2001, by President George W. BushLink
Grab a load of that, and get your bets down with the bookies.
And it gets worse. Far worse.
GOODNIGHT JON BOY
Reggie Walton is the judge who handled the Stephen Hatfill anthrax case.
In March, 2004, Walton granted the FBI's request to postpone Hatfill's
defamation suit, claiming that the investigation was in a sensitive phase.
Which is a bit of a sick joke, as the FBI's investigation has always
been in a "sensitive" phase. Just like all other government Ops.
And it was Walton who upheld the government's right to state secrets in
the Sibel Edmonds case! Another contrived 'scandal' which went nowhere.
Does this guy turn up in all the right places, or what? When the Establishment
run these kind of Ops, they need a judge who is a safe pair of hands.
Or to put it another way: they need a judge who is in on it.
But, now you are in on it too.
But this is not just about Walton. Not by a long shot. He's just one player.
Already, there is enough here that, even in their own terms, the CIA Fakes
should be sounding alarm bells about Walton's presence in the Libby
case --rather than blindly cheerleading the chances of Cheney's and
Libby's downfall.
The reason they are not being up front, is that you are suppposed to be
sucked into yet another fruitless substitute for effective political opposition
to the Washington elite and their international corporate buddies.
And the Fakes' job is to make sure you are.
But they are not the only ones on the job. And there are other jobs too.
Nobody is drawing out the barely hidden links. But we are.
RAT'S NEST 2
Here are the links nobody wants to highlight, because they give the game(s) away.
Patrick Fitzgerald, who is prosecuting Libby, handled the 1993 World Trade
Center bombing prosecution of Sheik Omar Abdel Rahman. Another, shall
we say, "sensitive" case.
And if you accept our proposition that the Neocons are programmed fall guys,
then you might deem it significant that it is Fitzgerald who spearheaded
the downfall of Lord Conrad Black from his chairmanship of the
Neocon-ridden Hollinger Group - of which Richard Perle is a director.
Like Walton, Fitzgerald pops up in all the right places.
But, again this is not just about those two political hacks. Let's plow on.
Representing Sibel Edmonds in that "State Secrets" gag order case
presided over by Walton was long-time, legal hack for disgrunled CIA
officers -Mark Zaid. If you are on the outs with the Agency, then Zaid is
your man.
On the other hand, if you are pretending to be on the outs with the CIA,
Mark is definitely your man.
In the case of such tried-and-trusted ploys for establishing some flimsy
street cred as an "opponent" of the CIA, the last thing you, or the agency
need is a lawyer who might take the whole thing too seriously and actually
expose things the Agency might not want you to think you had "found out"
anyway (-as part of the deception).
Much better to have a pet lawyer, who can huff and puff with the best of them
but blow nobody's house down in the process. And what better cover to
use to pose as a whistleblower than to be conveniently silenced by the
government -with the help of a CIA lawyer and a Bush judge.
Sibel would love to spill the beans on Mohammed Atta. Really, she would!
But unfortunately she can't. Go figure.
Here's Zaid, commenting on the gag order Walton imposed on Edmonds:
Quote:
FBI Whistleblower Edmonds Files New Lawsuit - March 17, 2005
"The FBI has done nothing but cover up its own incompetence and wrongdoing throughout its efforts to unconscionably
and unlawfully silence Ms. Edmonds through excessive secrecy," said Mark S. Zaid.
http://www.antiwar.com/edmonds/?articleid=5233
Zaid is getting good at those kind of comments. He gets practice, you see.
Because the exact same MO applies in another high-profile case he is handling.
Here's Zaid again:
Quote:
National Security Watch: Disquieted whistle-blowers
By Kevin Whitelaw 10/11/05
One of the biggest names of the conference never even uttered a word. Lt. Col. Anthony Shaffer is the military intelligence operative who recently went public with a controversial claim that a year before September 11, his top-secret task force "Able Danger" was able to identify the man who later turned out to be the lead hijacker as being connected to al Qaeda.
9/11 Anthrax
Reggie Walton as Hatfill case presiding judge.
9/11 Mohammed Atta / FBI
Mark Zaid representing Sibel Edmonds.
Reggie Walton as presiding judge.
9/11 Mohammed Atta / Pentagon
Mark Zaid representing Tony Shaffer.
Now, let me put it to you that all these are either sensitive cases the
government wants handled the right way, or intelligence operations the
Agency wants handled the right way -or the intersection of the two.
Let me put it to you that the people involved in the intelligence operations
are run/employed by the CIA. A cozy crew, who can run a tight ship.
Let me put it to you that if PlameGate is a contrived scandal, then Valerie
Plame is not the only CIA agent involved. Outsiders do NOT get to play a
part in such high-level Ops. Who knows what a real journalist might do.
Or a real prosecutor or judge, for that matter. PlameGate is stacked with
players who each know exactly what to do, and when.
Let me put it to you that top-quality agents with good street/media cred
don't grow on trees. And so, for key moves you reuse the same personnel
and simply rely on the Fake alternative media to fail to draw attention to
the fact the same players keep coming up.
Like birds of a feather, they stick together.
Finally, let me put it to you that the failure of any other reporter to detail
these links to you is clear confirmation of our warning in August of last year
that the CIA are deeply entrenched in the alternative and 'conspiracy' media,
and they effectively run the 9/11 movement.
Enough already. I have laid the facts out clearly.
Take a leaf out of Reggie Walton's book...
But surely if you wanted to control the "truth movement" you would place someone whose job it is to call out your assets. And then also call out people who aren't your assets to provide guilt by association.
Quote:
Anyone who thinks these people designed an Op which would leave physical evidence is underestimating them.
Stop right there. How long have you been at this game? Given your site is many years out of date now, it must be quite some time. There is a vast amount of physical evidence, everyone with half a brain knows that. You can't blow up 2 of the tallest buildings in the world without physical evidence.
Quote:
Anyone who thinks these people designed an Op which would leave physical evidence is underestimating them.
KP50:
Stop right there. How long have you been at this game?
Given your site is many years out of date now, it must be quite some time.
Been at it since the afternoon of Sept 11th, 2001.
The site's not years out of date.
It just has years of analysis.
The homepage of 9/11DejaVu.com has 5 new audios from 2010.
Quote:
KP50:
There is a vast amount of physical evidence, everyone with half a brain
knows that.
Yeah but what about the people with a full brain, not half a brain?
( old joke )
Quote:
KP50:
You can't blow up 2 of the tallest buildings in the world without physical evidence.
You're right. You can't.
And there's no physical evidence of demolition.
So, maybe they didn't blow them up to bring them down.
Before you come back and tell me about nanothermite etc.,
check out this post by Hawkwind in the topic thread following
my interview of Richard Gage.
It demolishes the whole nanothermite argument.
Quote:
The Abstract of the peer-reviewed scientific paper by Harrit and colleagues states: “We have discovered distinctive red/gray chips in all the samples we have studied of the dust produced by the destruction of the World Trade Center. Examination of four of these samples, collected from separate sites, is reported in this paper. These red/gray chips show marked similarities in all four samples. One sample was collected by a Manhattan resident about ten minutes after the collapse of the second WTC Tower, two the next day, and a fourth about a week later. The properties of these chips were analyzed using optical microscopy, scanning electron microscopy (SEM), X-ray energy dispersive spectroscopy (XEDS), and differential scanning calorimetry (DSC). The red material contains grains approximately 100 nm across which are largely iron oxide, while aluminum is contained in tiny plate-like structures. Separation of components using methyl ethyl ketone demonstrated that elemental aluminum is present. The iron oxide and aluminum are intimately mixed in the red material.
Hawkwind
OK, a quick set of observations about the "nanothermite" paper.
"The most common thermite is aluminium-iron(III) oxide."
and
"Thermites with nanosized particles are described through a variety of terms, such as metastable intermolecular composites, superthermite[1] nanothermite,[2] and nanocomposite energetic materials.[3][4]"
This confirms what our "Swedish meatball" friend found by analyzing the dust at the site.
"Yamasaki's design called for the building facades to be sheathed in aluminum-alloy.[38]"
and
"The thickness of the plates and grade of structural steel varied over the height of the tower, ranging from 36,000 to 100,000 pounds per square inch[49] (260 to 670 MPa). The strength of the steel and thickness of the steel plates decreased with height because they were required to support lesser amounts of building mass on higher floors.[48]"
So where does this leave us ...
1) Thermite is made of iron and aluminum.
2) The Trade Center buildings where made of iron and aluminum.
3) The dust on site contained iron and aluminum.
4) The microscopic analysis confirmed iron and aluminum.
Hmmm, earth shattering evidence of explosives and don't forget that the same thermite to bring down towers 1 and 2 in under an hour took over 5 hours to bring down a substantially smaller tower 7.
I'm convinced ...
- Hawk
PS - I am not a materials scientist ... I just play one on this forum.
But surely if you wanted to control the "truth movement" you would place someone whose job it is to call out your assets. And then also call out people who aren't your assets to provide guilt by association.
You ignored this part ...... the weakness of your argument is that if you are right, then you are playing the part that would be required as part of the very scheme that you claim to be the sole source of revealing.
I'm not here to propose nanothermite either - you just presumed I was - I'll leave that to the many assets you have identified.
But the fact that you are proposing that rather bizarre forum post as demolishingo the nanothermite issue adds fuel to the fire of the 9/11 debates being waged - I now consider everything on your websites to be compromised. Whether wittingly or unwittingly, you must be a CIA asset.
I ignored it because it's such a weak argument it didn't seem worth
responding to it.
The fatal weakness is that you are alleging I'm playing a part in the
9/11 Truth movement. If that was the case, then my assertions would
be featured on the Alex Jones show and/or widely circulated in the
truth community.
But that's not the case. You will find no mention of me or Breakfornews
or 9/11 DejaVu among the intel cartel leading the movement around
in fruitless circles. There is a 100% shut out ever since I nailed the
deception operation in 2005, and unless someone is lucky enough to
come across our analysis they will never know it exists.
As to the nanothermite issue, what's bizarre?
The poster points out that Stephen Jones et al are claiming the presence
of iron/steel and aluminum are proof of nanothermite. lol.
But the Twin Towers were built of steel, clad with aluminum, so it's
guaranteed that their dust will be full of..... ....iron and aluminum!
No brainer.
Amazing that this useless nanothermite claim has
been pawned off as "proof" for years by these goons. _________________ The CIA Fakeshttp://911DejaVu.com
Joined: 30 Nov 2006 Posts: 575 Location: the eyevolution
Posted: Wed May 05, 2010 11:08 am Post subject:
FintanDunne wrote:
I agree that Able Danger has some merits for us. It just that due to their effective media compartmentalization, it is spun in mainstream as mere accidental screw-up and then in alternative as mere LIHOP.
As to Edmonds saying intel was in contact with "OBL and Al-Q right up to 9/11", that's got a sting in the tail. In that it helps persuade you OBL was alive at the time of 9/11.
No not necessarily. "Right up until" is a loose term it could mean up until a week before or even a day before. Do you have proof that OBL was dead before 9/11?
It was mainstream news in Sep and Nov 2001 that OBL was getting kidney treatment on Sept 10th. This is hardly a watertight intel/mainstream op to keep us persuaded that OBL was alive during 9/11 is it?
It casts doubt on the credibility of OBL's heath and therefore his ability to plan and carry out 9/11 and the video/audio of him thereafter. Therefore it's a good piece of evidence against the official story.
You may be right about a lot of Truthy representatives being knowingly or unknowingly compromised but inherant in that premise is that you yourself are knowingly or unknowingly the same. To treat you with any less suspicion would be unwise anyway. _________________ http://www.youtube.com/user/bobzimmerfan?feature=mhum#p/a
I ignored it because it's such a weak argument it didn't seem worth responding to it.
The fatal weakness is that you are alleging I'm playing a part in the
9/11 Truth movement. If that was the case, then my assertions would
be featured on the Alex Jones show and/or widely circulated in the
truth community.
Right .. weak argument huh. And you respond with
"Today on the Alex Jones show, we feature Fintan Dunne who alleges that I am a CIA asset. Well Mr Dunne, I must say you have me there, I am on the payroll of the CIA and have been for years."
Do you even think before you type?
Quote:
But that's not the case. You will find no mention of me or Breakfornews or 9/11 DejaVu among the intel cartel leading the movement around in fruitless circles. There is a 100% shut out ever since I nailed the deception operation in 2005, and unless someone is lucky enough to come across our analysis they will never know it exists.
Obviously you don't think before you type. You allege they are all compromised and then expect them to promote you? Seriously? Wow.
The forum description of this section of the forum says:
Quote:
"Discussion of the most controversial 9/11 theories.
Evidenced discussions over whether particular individuals are genuine
9/11 Truthers or moles and/or shills and other personal issues."
Surely that's exactly what I'm presenting here.
Evidenced discussion about whether particular
individuals are genuine 9/11 Truthers. And surely
this is exactly where you invite such type of comment.
And when I do present such evidence I get called a shill?!?
Sort of a Catch 22, eh?
Maybe that was a loose and untypical comment and does not
reflect on your journalistic integrity, but it did surprise me.
KP50
Obviously you don't think before you type. You allege they are all
compromised and then expect them to promote you? Seriously? Wow.
I don't expect them to promote me.
Of course they won't, and wouldn't.
Aren't you arguing against yourself now?
How can I be part of anything, if by definition
as you say, I have no profile in the movement.
I like the good cop, bad cop.
My point is that in your scenario, I can see a place for someone like yourself pointing out that all the assets are assets because that can help to spread even further division. And it also enables one such as yourself to tar lots of non-assets, thereby gaining some useful guilt by association.
I do personally believe that there are many people "playing a role" out there. You only have to look at the many flip-flops taking place on certain truth websites where, like the pigs in Animal Farm, they are becoming more like debunkers than the debunkers themselves.
But then any Truth Movement is doomed to failure anyway, as it attempts to use the very mass media which is complicit in 9/11 in the first place. Once you realise the full scale of 9/11 and how many institutions would need to be compromised for it to take place, then you know that we are all pretty much doomed to accept whatever "they" have in store for us. Our only privilege is that we know we are being lied to, enabling us to lose sleep over it instead of having the propaganda soothe us to a secure sleep. All of the lies contain grains of truth, the truth is well hidden by multiple layers of lies. Can you blame any of us for trying to chip away at the first layer of lies and try to weaken the edifice just a little?
Correct me if I'm wrong Fintan but I thought Niels claims to have found spheres of 'nano-thermite', meaning the oxide was liquid then formed into solid spheres upon cooling as liquid fell through the air. Surely the presence of spheres is incompatible with the types of debris/dust that would be expected to be created from the aluminium cladding of the towers if the collapse had occured as NIST would have us believe?
Joined: 26 Apr 2006 Posts: 1850 Location: Currently Andover
Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 12:10 pm Post subject:
ian neal wrote:
Correct me if I'm wrong Fintan but I thought Niels claims to have found spheres of 'nano-thermite', meaning the oxide was liquid then formed into solid spheres upon cooling as liquid fell through the air. Surely the presence of spheres is incompatible with the types of debris/dust that would be expected to be created from the aluminium cladding of the towers if the collapse had occured as NIST would have us believe?
DRG discusses the case of the Deutsche Bank hired the R J Lee Group to study the dust and the discovery of iron spherical particles.
Link _________________ Currently working on a new website
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