Murdoch propaganda - The Sun - Torn to shreds

[Snowygrouch]

WOW!
Thats real top notch "getting his ass visably kicked".

IronSnot: I exchanged several emails with Kavanagh and although still negative the tone was considerably different that that he puts across in his articles. I suspect you may be right.

Otherwise its pretty brave leaving that on the site when he is obvioulsy coming off by far the worse in the echange.

Regardless, I can see cracks in the dam folks!!!!!!!!

[ian neal]

[Serge]

Anyone got an e-mail from the sun showing Kavanaghs difference of personal view as opposed to the one in the sun?. Would lay to rest a huge argument going on elsewhere.

[ian neal]

My invitation that I have just emailed to Trevor

An invitation to debate the evidence

Dear Trevor,

My name is Ian Neal and I have been instrumental in building up the primary 9/11 truth website in this country (www.nineeleven.co.uk). Here you will find your recent article on the 9/11 truth movement is being discussed. It is important to note that the website's forum is an on-line community of campaigners who all speak in an individual capacity.

Your article contains a series of school boy errors and I find it shocking that a journalist of such an influential paper as the Sun could be so apparently ill informed on such a crucial issue. I would like to extend an invitation to you (or any other Sun journalist) to publicly debate the evidence and our united call for a further investigation at a time and place of your choosing, either at a public meeting or through an exchange of emails.

Yours sincerely

Ian Neal

[kbo234]

I won't be holding my breath either, Ian.

[Pikey]

[ian neal]

[ian neal]

I just received this reply from Trevor to my earlier email. In its entirety...

[dry kleaner]

Hi all
Got a touch pissed off with that Trevor Kavanagh bloke at the sun and sent him this letter. It's not my best by I hope it gets the point across.
Lol

Peace and love

DK

David Quayle is my pen name if anyone was wondering who that was.
Richmond, Surrey is quite a nice place.

Quote:
Dear Trevor
I have read your article on 9/11 with great interest. I have decided to take the time to point you towards a few sources that I have drawn upon whilst considering the possibility of the 9/11 attacks being allowed to happen or made to happen by the United States Government.
In a reply to a reader of yours you asked:
‘is it really feasible that a US President would order the mass murder of his own citizens; that he would be able to even begin organising such a complex act of destruction requiring split-second coordination, in full view of the billions watching live on TV and get away with it for five years without a single shred of actual (as opposed to presumed) evidence emerging from anyone of what must have been many people involved?’
First of all I hope you are familiar with Project Northwood’s from 1962. On page 10 point 8 of the Northwood’s documents it proposes a faked incident in which the Cuban air force appear to have shoot down a US airliner. With reports to the effect and with fake funerals of the victims to be shown on television. The airliner that was shot down would have been a ‘drone’ that would have the same markings as the airliner. The original airliner would be filled with individuals under ‘carefully prepared allies’ which would be swapped in midflight with the drone aircraft. Now you’re above assertion about the feasibility of the US President or any member of the US Government would not being capable of being involved in such an event is a matter of opinion. The Northwood’s documents clearly show that a mentality has existed in the United States Military to fake terror attacks to such an elaborate extent as we have witnessed.
Also the CIA and the British intelligence services are well known and documented with fighting wars and committing acts of espionage via proxy. Proxy being the use of a party other than themselves directly. May I draw your attention to the concept of False Flag operations. This is an extract from a book called 'Spy' by Harry Ferguson. This page deals with how False Flag operations work and why you would need one. Harry Ferguson worked with MI6 as an analyst and later worked for HM Customs in the Kilo and Lima units. He was one of the presenters and trainers on the BBC show Spy in 2004.
False Flag Recruitments

In the case of a False Flag recruitment, deniability is not even an issue since the agent himself thinks he is working for another country. In some cases services may even recruit under a False Flag, get the agent to commit an atrocity, then expose the agent to make it look as though some other country is responsible. The other country takes the blame. For instance, suppose Mossad were to recruit a number of Arabs who believed they ewer in fact working for al Qaeda. If they then committed an atrocity in the USA, the benefits for Israel in terms of increased funding and political support would be considerable.
A False Flag recruitment is used for one of two reasons:

1. The target would never agree to work for your country for some national, religious or personal reason.
2. You want the agent to believe that they are working for another country so that if they are ever caught, another country will get blamed.

If you can pull it off the rewards can be great. The agent will work for you quite normally, but if he is ever captured, even if he is tortured or given truth drugs, he will swear to his dying day that he is working for someone else. It is not even that difficult to pull off - most people are so surprised to be asked to spy in the first place that it never crosses their mind that the people who are recruiting them aren’t who they say they are. With a little careful ‘set dressing’ to carry off the subterfuge, most agents are easily hooked.

The downside of such an operation is that if you are ever caught doing it the consequences for relations with the other country are likely to be severe, so this sort of operation is unlikely to be undertaken without very high level government approval and probably only against a country which is already your enemy.

Ferguson 2004:115
(Sorry about the text size, Yahoo mail is not my strong point.)

With the existence of such concepts as False Flag operations should we take anything the intelligence or security services tell us at face value?
What the majority of people seem to take for granted as natural within the context of their culture has in fact been artificially constructed by a dominant belief system that operates on a common sense level. Italian philosopher Antonio Gramsci believed that ‘Common sense’ is the site on which dominant ideology is constructed, but it is also the site for the resistance to that ideology.’ (Simon, 1991: 26-27). There is a danger that when concepts, ideas or thoughts operate on a common sense level, that critical thought no longer takes place.
War with Iran is imminent and the leaders on both sides are attempting to polarize the world by using the construct of religion and race to divide mankind and force a war upon us. As we know a war needs two sides to be fought and with out the polarization you will not have two conflicting sides. In such times we are not encouraged to question the worth or logic behind a war, instead we are encouraged to trust in our leaders and rally behind them. With documents such as ‘The Project for the new American century’ which is a blue print for political and economic domination by the United States that was written in September 2000 asking for a ‘New Pearl Harbour’ to unite the American people in a quest for political dominance, one must ask what is the war on terror really about?
I find articles like yours some what disturbing as you seem to be knowingly or unknowingly trying to paint a very complex subject with a brush that seems reeked in cultural bias. We seem to understand our world through the filters that our cultures provide for us. If we are to make this world a better place for future generations then we should work on ourselves before trying to right the wrongs of our external world. We must educate ourselves better in the external forces such as culture that shape our views of the world. If we took greater personal responsibility for our actions and how our actions affect others we may start to make this world a better place. As long as we let extremists be the sole voice for Muslims in the main stream media and have articles such as yours stir up further fear and discontentment in the general population towards Muslims we run the risk of creating a ‘self fulfilled prophecy’ and creating the force that we fear. Remember the energy you put out will return to you. So if you are negative to others they will be negative towards you.
You are an intelligent and opinionated man and I respect you for having the ability and the knowledge to write such an article, but please look out of the box of culture.

Thank you for your time.

Peace and love

David Quayle

(Richmond, Surrey)

[iro]

nice job! funny how your pen name is an amalgamation of David Shayler and Dan Quayle

[dry kleaner]

David you got right but I prefer your Quayle to the one it was originally based. So Dan Quayle it is. Lol

It was Justin Quayle from
The Constant Gardener, my favourite John Le Carre novel to date.

Cool

Peace and love

DK

[dry kleaner]

Off to bed.

Night all

[Jane]

[Dr Doom]

[ian neal]

I thought that might happen.

Technical glitch, I'm sure

Here is the content for prosterity

[ian neal]

Background on Kavanagh

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trevor_Kavanagh

Interestingly possibly through his high placed contacts in government he exclusively received a leaked advanced copy of the Hutton report

Now why would that be helpful?

Come on Trevor. Take me up on my offer to a public debate of the evidence challenging the official fairytale