Split from "BBC Complaints thread"-No 7x7 Comments

[blackcat]

[Andrew - Split from this thread http://www.nineeleven.co.uk/board/viewtopic.php?t=3720.

By bringing up No 7x7's on the above thread, blackcat MAY have been defeating the object of his own posts... so I moved it here - just trying to be helpful...]

The way the BBC reporter referred to the conspiracy theorists in the Muslim world being "those are the ones who believe there were no planes on 9/11" as if it was a condition of membership is a clear indication of the bias that the BBC has. It was a deliberate smear and anyone who continues to push the "no planes theory" is giving ammunition to them. When are they going to learn??!! If someone believes that Elvis is still alive it is possible they might be right but it does not matter. It is the association with nutters that matters. For the sake of the 9/11 truth movement, whatever you believe, drop the "no planes" angle!!!

[Andrew Johnson]

Thoughts:

Most are agreed we can focus on CD as primary evidence. If the debate becomes ill-informed and mentions "no planes", then it can be shifted back by sticking with gravity. However.

1) Distinguish carefully between "evidence" and "theory"

2) Do we say "Demolition Theory"? No, we say "demolition evidence".

3) Almost no one is "pushing no plane theories" - what they are mainly saying is there is EVIDENCE to suggest something other than 7x7 passenger jets may have WTC 1 & 2. Please, please make the distinction properly in your mind before rant mode is switched on.

This "new" scenario requires careful examination and thought, not automatic "you're damaging the movement" statements.

Further:

4) If ABC and FOX news footage show different flight paths when analised, that's pretty good evidence that the plane stories need close scrutiny.

5) These images show a wheel from one of the aircraft at the WTC:




If this is indeed a picture from the scene, how can this wheel have survived the fireball of the plane impact? Is it made of the same material as one of the passports?

As I have said before, those outside the 9/11 Truth reject CD evidence. Many INSIDE the movement won't even look at the evidence which suggests somehting other than 7x7's hit the towers. (Partly because of bad labelling of the proposed scenario)

This the real issue - it requires careful consideration in the movement - to those "outside", it doesn't really matter. It SHOULD matter to those that wish to investigate the truth, however.

[blackcat]

To those outside the movement it most definitely DOES matter!! A huge percentage of Americans still believe Saddam Hussain was involved with the 9/11 attacks. Mention to them that 9/11 truthers believe there were no planes that day and they will switch off immediately. It is people like them we have to convince!!! The sophistry of "no Planes" meaning different planes does not wash. Some people are peddling holograms and "projections" etc. It is obvious bunkum! I do not believe that a 757 hit the Pentagon but this does not make me a "no planer". The "no planes" suggestion is hugely damaging and seized gleefully by 9/11 truth detractors.

[Andrew Johnson]

[blackcat]

There is a big difference between those who dispute what kind of planes hit the twin towers and those who say there were NO PLANES! The latter contend that the footage was rigged and/or that holograms were used. That may turn out to be absolutely correct just as Elvis might announce himself to be fit and well. It matters that the belief in "No Planes" (and I do not mean different planes) is damaging the 9/11 truth movement. It is a complete turn off to outsiders and associates those in the movement with people who are perceived as complete nucases. It is an unneccessary indulgence.

[THETRUTHWILLSETU3]

I don't know what your worrying about Blackcat.

The takeup of new people to 911 truth is now growing at an exponential rate on a global basis.

The fact is there are plenty of inconsistencies that will not go away and people will continue to ask questions.

For me there are as many if not more inconsistencies with the events at the twin towers as there are with the Pentagon.

I didn't see Gloria Hunniford and other on Heaven and Earth call anybody a crackpot when no plane at the pentagon was mentioned

Just as we are on a learning curve with 911 - don't think the perps haven't learnt anything also - for the next major atrocity they will be even more devious and learn from their mistakes with 911 and so we need to explore every possibilty of what could have gone on that day.
If we stick only to what is currently provable and ignore the rest there will not be much to discuss

911 must have took many years of planning, and on this basis the planning for the next event must be well advanced

[THETRUTHWILLSETU3]

When the politicians and police chiefs say that another event is inevitable - the only reason they know is because they are involved in orchestrating it and covering it up

[blackcat]

[Andrew Johnson]

[JimB]

[MiniMauve]

[ian neal]

[blackcat]

[fixuplooksharp]

the 9/11 movement is NOT robust as ian said.

it is still fragile and needs nurturing. shayler was saying we need to embrace new ideas etc... im not having it, if he and others insist on the no planes theory, then i think a division in the movement is warranted. people who do actually want to see the 9/11 movement progress will realise what the right thing to do will be. the no planes thing is bad, that simple. i personally f**king hate it and i know what effect it will have...no amount of trying to convince me will change my mind. i cannot help but think that a) they are plants or b)just not thinking about the consequences of their actions properly.

if this no planes bolloks continues...then im buggering off and going solo.

simple as.

[Andrew Johnson]

[Andrew Johnson]

[andyb]

I really can't understand how people don't see this no 7x7 stuff as being damaging. It is. Why are people researching it and not going out and getting the message out? It has been and will be used to discredit us all. By all means discuss it privately but I think big long ranting threads isn't a constructive use of time at the moment. We all believe 9/11 to be an inside job and we have a wealth of evidence for this, why do people need to find any more, especially controversial stuff like this?

Getting people to believe that their governments could do this to their own people proves hard enough at times and any mention of holograms or no planes allows them to dismiss us as loons and keep their blinkers on. We are getting to a very crucial time for the movement and should be building on this and getting the messgae out as quickly as possible. The longer it takes to raise awareness the less chance we'll have of finding out what really happened.

I know I'm now going to be called a gatekeeper but IMO these other theories are gatekeeping.

[Bicnarok]

There are employed people out there who through advanced propaganda techniques do all they can to damage "divide and conquer" the 9/11 truth seeking community. Label them as Nutcases, Elvis´s alive believers and the like.

And it is very successfull. a large % of people are gullable and trust and believe everything the news or papers say, another large % just don´t give a toss as long as thier team wins the Premiership, NHL, F1 etc. The % of people who want to know the truth, willing to face the truth and want to change the "cosy little world" is very low. This is the largest problem, not the info being spead about Airplane holograms emitted from minute multi node diodes in cruise missiles or helicopters.

[JimB]