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Ignatz
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 Posted: Mon Sep 18, 2006 5:52 pm Post subject: Pulverised concrete at WTC 1+2 |
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Here's a question that has always bothered me.
For the sake of argument let's assume:
1. The TT were prewired for CD
2. They had to be wired throughout, as a top-down collapse was needed to mask the CD. And also the plane impact area could not be predicted that accurately
3. The core structure was accessed - (in about 1000 locations, absolute minimum - rough estimate) - by conspirators. Drywalling and fireproofing removed, charges placed with radio receivers (say) linked to detonators. It was put back together well enough to cover anything incriminating , and was ready to be blown.
4. On 9/11 it was indeed blown. The CD was a spectacular success.
The question - why so much powdered concrete flying all over the place, even from the very beginning of the collapse(s) ? |
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telecasterisation
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| Posted: Mon Sep 18, 2006 7:42 pm Post subject: Re: Pulverised concrete at WTC 1+2 |
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| Ignatz wrote: | Here's a question that has always bothered me.
For the sake of argument let's assume:
1. The TT were prewired for CD
2. They had to be wired throughout, as a top-down collapse was needed to mask the CD. And also the plane impact area could not be predicted that accurately
3. The core structure was accessed - (in about 1000 locations, absolute minimum - rough estimate) - by conspirators. Drywalling and fireproofing removed, charges placed with radio receivers (say) linked to detonators. It was put back together well enough to cover anything incriminating , and was ready to be blown.
4. On 9/11 it was indeed blown. The CD was a spectacular success.
The question - why so much powdered concrete flying all over the place, even from the very beginning of the collapse(s) ? |
You pose something of a strange question.
The first point I would like to raise is in relation to your point 2.
You say 'They had to be wired throughout, as a top-down collapse was needed to mask the CD'. To which I would say this isn't the case. The top down collapse was needed to make it look like legitimate structural failure and not the mask anything. The building/s couldn't exactly start collapsing halfway down or near the bottom - it would have to be on or near the seat of the impact and/or fire/s.
I would next guess that as both buildings only direction of travel was strictly vertical, each floor impacted the one below, there being no leeway or sideways motion, hence the only action that could take place was powdering.
As an associated aside, I would just like to test the water with regard to the following.
September 11th arrives and along comes a fully fuelled passenger jet that flies squarely into the first tower. There is enormous damage to a number of floors caused by the actual impact, engines, landing gear et al, go through and out the other side of the building. There is an explosion and a resulting fire.
The second plane impact was somewhat less positive, in that the plane did not hit so evenly, much of the fuel burning outside of the building.
I am not an expert in placing demolition charges/explosives placed to bring down a building, but what really puzzles me is this;
There you are, having placed your explosives, but then you fly a huge heavy, explosive aircraft into the same building. Could you be certain to fly both planes into the ‘right place’?
Now by ‘right place’ I mean any pieces of the plane could simply tear your explosive charges straight out of the other side of the building and down onto the street below, severe any connections, damage any electronics crucial to the sequence of events, not to mention setting them off early. Then the fire – this again could just as well fry any fundamental bits designed to bring the buildings down.
The plane adds a huge number of variables that simply couldn’t be planned for, so if you were placing the charges (I really doubt there was much actual wiring involved, particularly between floors), what safeguards could be built in to ensure that your demo charges were not simply neutralised by the planes' impact?
You press the plunger or light the fuse or flick the switch and nothing happens. Time for plan B perhaps?
_________________
I completely challenge the official version of events - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC -I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC |
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Ignatz
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| Posted: Mon Sep 18, 2006 7:46 pm Post subject: Re: Pulverised concrete at WTC 1+2 |
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| telecasterisation wrote: |
You pose something of a strange question.
The first point I would like to raise is in relation to your point 2.
You say 'They had to be wired throughout, as a top-down collapse was needed to mask the CD'. To which I would say this isn't the case. The top down collapse was needed to make it look like legitimate structural failure and not the mask anything. The building/s couldn't exactly start collapsing halfway down or near the bottom - it would have to be on or near the seat of the impact and/or fire/s.
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That's exactly what I meant by "mask" i.e. that it had to look like a legitimate structural failure. Bad choice of word on my part perhaps. |
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MiniMauve
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Joined: 24 Aug 2006
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 3:25 am Post subject: Re: Pulverised concrete at WTC 1+2 |
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| telecasterisation wrote: | | Ignatz wrote: | Here's a question that has always bothered me.
For the sake of argument let's assume:
1. The TT were prewired for CD
2. They had to be wired throughout, as a top-down collapse was needed to mask the CD. And also the plane impact area could not be predicted that accurately
3. The core structure was accessed - (in about 1000 locations, absolute minimum - rough estimate) - by conspirators. Drywalling and fireproofing removed, charges placed with radio receivers (say) linked to detonators. It was put back together well enough to cover anything incriminating , and was ready to be blown.
4. On 9/11 it was indeed blown. The CD was a spectacular success.
The question - why so much powdered concrete flying all over the place, even from the very beginning of the collapse(s) ? |
You pose something of a strange question.
The first point I would like to raise is in relation to your point 2.
You say 'They had to be wired throughout, as a top-down collapse was needed to mask the CD'. To which I would say this isn't the case. The top down collapse was needed to make it look like legitimate structural failure and not the mask anything. The building/s couldn't exactly start collapsing halfway down or near the bottom - it would have to be on or near the seat of the impact and/or fire/s.
I would next guess that as both buildings only direction of travel was strictly vertical, each floor impacted the one below, there being no leeway or sideways motion, hence the only action that could take place was powdering.
As an associated aside, I would just like to test the water with regard to the following.
September 11th arrives and along comes a fully fuelled passenger jet that flies squarely into the first tower. There is enormous damage to a number of floors caused by the actual impact, engines, landing gear et al, go through and out the other side of the building. There is an explosion and a resulting fire.
The second plane impact was somewhat less positive, in that the plane did not hit so evenly, much of the fuel burning outside of the building.
I am not an expert in placing demolition charges/explosives placed to bring down a building, but what really puzzles me is this;
There you are, having placed your explosives, but then you fly a huge heavy, explosive aircraft into the same building. Could you be certain to fly both planes into the ‘right place’?
Now by ‘right place’ I mean any pieces of the plane could simply tear your explosive charges straight out of the other side of the building and down onto the street below, severe any connections, damage any electronics crucial to the sequence of events, not to mention setting them off early. Then the fire – this again could just as well fry any fundamental bits designed to bring the buildings down.
The plane adds a huge number of variables that simply couldn’t be planned for, so if you were placing the charges (I really doubt there was much actual wiring involved, particularly between floors), what safeguards could be built in to ensure that your demo charges were not simply neutralised by the planes' impact?
You press the plunger or light the fuse or flick the switch and nothing happens. Time for plan B perhaps? |
My guess is that the explosives were set by remote control with each floor having it's own frequency plus one overall frequency to arm the explosives. You are correct, they couldn't be sure in advance where the planes would strike, thus they would wait to see where they hit, allow the fires to burn for a time, set off preparatory explosives in the core of the buildings, then blow the floor nearest the bottom of the damaged area of the towers to iniate the 'collapses'. I speculate that when the top of the one tower appears to begin to fall sideways before it miraculously turns to dust in midair, that explosives have actually failed causing the beginning of an assymetrical collapse. Realizing what's happening, the person(s) at the detonation array triggers the explosives in all the floors in the portion that is collapsing sideways. Very speculative, I agree, but plausible IMHO.
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Stick to what you KNOW. All else is disinformation, intended or not. |
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chipmunk stew
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 10:27 am Post subject: Re: Pulverised concrete at WTC 1+2 |
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| MiniMauve wrote: | | My guess is that the explosives were set by remote control with each floor having it's own frequency plus one overall frequency to arm the explosives. You are correct, they couldn't be sure in advance where the planes would strike, thus they would wait to see where they hit, allow the fires to burn for a time, set off preparatory explosives in the core of the buildings, then blow the floor nearest the bottom of the damaged area of the towers to iniate the 'collapses'. I speculate that when the top of the one tower appears to begin to fall sideways before it miraculously turns to dust in midair, that explosives have actually failed causing the beginning of an assymetrical collapse. Realizing what's happening, the person(s) at the detonation array triggers the explosives in all the floors in the portion that is collapsing sideways. Very speculative, I agree, but plausible IMHO. |
You should run that by every demolitions expert you can find. You'll discover just how plausible it is. |
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Ignatz
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 11:17 am Post subject: |
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It went very quiet over here suddenly.
Did the CT'ists actually go away to check timelines and seismic records?
Are they away researching the (non) use of high explosives in the demolition of steel buildings?
Learning a little about the construction methods used in those WTC buildings?
Checking testimonies and photographs?
Learning that "to pull" does not mean execute a demolition with explosives or incendiaries?
Stuff like that?
It's a lot to hope for, but always possible  |
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SHERITON HOTEL
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 11:35 am Post subject: |
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| The impact points of both 'planes' were clearly marked by pre-impact explosion/flashes in both towers. Static electric charge release and reflections have been eliminated,video frame evidence shows they were not caused by the impact. This all suggests the impact points were pre-ordained to coincide with the collapse points. My theory is the flashes were something to do with the homing mechanism used,after all it was imperitive these drone planes hit their target and at precisely the right point, but, to qualify this, as I said, it's only my theory, the Islamic terrorists may have done it with their bolt cutters for all I know. |
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Ignatz
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 12:17 pm Post subject: |
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| SHERITON HOTEL wrote: | | The impact points of both 'planes' were clearly marked by pre-impact explosion/flashes in both towers. Static electric charge release and reflections have been eliminated,video frame evidence shows they were not caused by the impact. This all suggests the impact points were pre-ordained to coincide with the collapse points. My theory is the flashes were something to do with the homing mechanism used,after all it was imperitive these drone planes hit their target and at precisely the right point, but, to qualify this, as I said, it's only my theory, the Islamic terrorists may have done it with their bolt cutters for all I know. |
Ah. They were "drone planes"
I didn't realise you held to that theory.
So what happened to all the people - people of all different ages,backgrounds,family connections etc that actually boarded those flights before they were replaced by drones?
Were they taken away to lead secret lives elsewhere? |
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SHERITON HOTEL
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Joined: 18 Jun 2006
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 3:13 pm Post subject: |
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Do you have a theory on those 9/11 mystery twin towers pre impact/impact point explosions/flashes?
We'll never know for certain what hit the twin towers 9/11 if the flight recorders were never recovered. |
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Jay Ref
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Joined: 20 Jul 2006
Posts: 511
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 3:38 pm Post subject: |
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| SHERITON HOTEL wrote: | Do you have a theory on those 9/11 mystery twin towers pre impact/impact point explosions/flashes?
We'll never know for certain what hit the twin towers 9/11 if the flight recorders were never recovered. |
More evidence of dreamy moronism amongst troofers:
"We'll never know for certain what hit the twin towers 9/11 if the flight recorders were never recovered."
So you're basically saying that a government able to fly planes into buildings, do CD's killing thousands, all in broad daylight and on live tv...these evil guys drew the line at faking up some black box data?
So the thousands of eye witnesses and myriad videos showing the aircraft hitting...the recovered wreckage...the recovered body parts...all of that stuff doesn't convince you...but a transcript of the black boxes would?
Tell me this; did the CVR recording from United 93 convince you?? Or are you among those who ridicule the last fight of the passengers? If you are then your assertion about the CVR's from the TT crashes is just another lie. Another troofer lie. Is there no end to them?
-z
_________________
"Knowledge is good"
-Emil Faber
"God in heaven. Here's the hard-headed, evidence-only freak who will not, like we CTers, indulge himself in self-inflating, utterly misconceived fantasies." -kbo234 (who is NOT a nazi) briefly makes sense |
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SHERITON HOTEL
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 3:53 pm Post subject: |
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Well were the blackbox flight recorders recovered from the twin towers? I understand a terrorist saudi passports survived the fires and collapse, weren't the flight 77 black boxes recovered 3 days after and at 4 in the morning or something?
Can you explain how these flight school flunkout islamists flew their "hijaccked" planes directly into those pre-impact explosions in both towers with uncanny identical timing being as you are a zealous advocate off the official 9/11 story? |
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Jay Ref
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 4:17 pm Post subject: |
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| SHERITON HOTEL wrote: | Well were the blackbox flight recorders recovered from the twin towers? I understand a terrorist saudi passports survived the fires and collapse, weren't the flight 77 black boxes recovered 3 days after and at 4 in the morning or something?
Can you explain how these flight school flunkout islamists flew their "hijaccked" planes directly into those pre-impact explosions in both towers with uncanny identical timing being as you are a zealous advocate off the official 9/11 story? |
It's been explained ad nauseum to 99.99% of the world's satisfaction. Matter of fact it is perhaps history's most documented event...and yet that moronic quote from you.
Really, that quote explains your mind set and this movement better than anything. You are a silly self parody...a Python skit sans humor.
-z
_________________
"Knowledge is good"
-Emil Faber
"God in heaven. Here's the hard-headed, evidence-only freak who will not, like we CTers, indulge himself in self-inflating, utterly misconceived fantasies." -kbo234 (who is NOT a nazi) briefly makes sense |
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chipmunk stew
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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"pre-impact explosions"?
Mate, you're on the fringe of the fringe. You'll gobble up just about any regurgitated vomitous mass from anything calling itself a Truth site, won't you? |
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marky 54
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 5:00 pm Post subject: |
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| Jay Ref wrote: | | SHERITON HOTEL wrote: | Well were the blackbox flight recorders recovered from the twin towers? I understand a terrorist saudi passports survived the fires and collapse, weren't the flight 77 black boxes recovered 3 days after and at 4 in the morning or something?
Can you explain how these flight school flunkout islamists flew their "hijaccked" planes directly into those pre-impact explosions in both towers with uncanny identical timing being as you are a zealous advocate off the official 9/11 story? |
It's been explained ad nauseum to 99.99% of the world's satisfaction. Matter of fact it is perhaps history's most documented event...and yet that moronic quote from you.
Really, that quote explains your mind set and this movement better than anything. You are a silly self parody...a Python skit sans humor.
-z |
99.99 of the worlds satisfaction? where did you get this figure, im intrsted to know your source. most poles i have seen show a divide of almost 50/50. and thats just america. if your 99.99% is correct then some sort of information to back it up would be nice. unless of course you were lieing? or assuming?. |
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aggle-rithm
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 5:07 pm Post subject: |
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| marky 54 wrote: | | 99.99 of the worlds satisfaction? where did you get this figure, im intrsted to know your source. most poles i have seen show a divide of almost 50/50. and thats just america. |
So 50% of Polish-Americans don't think commercial aircraft flew into the towers? What does ethnicity have to do with it, ya racist? |
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marky 54
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 5:17 pm Post subject: |
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| mmmm your a strange chap arnt you aggle. firstly where do i mention the polish or where am i racist for asking for the 99.99% figure to be shown? you accuse me of stuff with no reason to assume it. your repulsive. |
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marky 54
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 5:19 pm Post subject: |
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| sorry the penny dropped. hehe that was funny. poles as in voting not people. |
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telecasterisation
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 5:22 pm Post subject: |
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| marky 54 wrote: | | mmmm your a strange chap arnt you aggle. firstly where do i mention the polish or where am i racist for asking for the 99.99% figure to be shown? you accuse me of stuff with no reason to assume it. your repulsive. |
Spend tomorrow at the zoo and buy yourself an ice-cream, forget all this for a while - you take it all too seriously.
_________________
I completely challenge the official version of events - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC -I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC |
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marky 54
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 5:36 pm Post subject: |
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| telecasterisation wrote: | | marky 54 wrote: | | mmmm your a strange chap arnt you aggle. firstly where do i mention the polish or where am i racist for asking for the 99.99% figure to be shown? you accuse me of stuff with no reason to assume it. your repulsive. |
Spend tomorrow at the zoo and buy yourself an ice-cream, forget all this for a while - you take it all too seriously. |
yes i do take finding out the truth seriously. regardless of if it was a conspiracy. as usual you cannot enlighten me with your pointless comments that prove nothing. as you have nothing to offer. (im expecting another comment that has nothing to do with 9/11 inorder to make us go of track and divert our attention from 9/11, into a arguement about nothing). this is my final reply to you your not worth the time or trouble as you never have anything to offer other than stupid comments. |
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SHERITON HOTEL
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 5:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Jay Ref wrote: | | SHERITON HOTEL wrote: | Well were the blackbox flight recorders recovered from the twin towers? I understand a terrorist saudi passports survived the fires and collapse, weren't the flight 77 black boxes recovered 3 days after and at 4 in the morning or something?
Can you explain how these flight school flunkout islamists flew their "hijaccked" planes directly into those pre-impact explosions in both towers with uncanny identical timing being as you are a zealous advocate off the official 9/11 story? |
It's been explained ad nauseum to 99.99% of the world's satisfaction. Matter of fact it is perhaps history's most documented event...and yet that moronic quote from you.
Really, that quote explains your mind set and this movement better than anything. You are a silly self parody...a Python skit sans humor.
-z |
Can't answer huh? (ahem)... this parrot has ceased to be (beautiful plumage) |
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SHERITON HOTEL
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 5:47 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="chipmunk stew"]"pre-impact explosions"?
Mate?
You are being ironic?(former and latter)
should I rise to the bait with a link? nah, can't be @rsed |
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aggle-rithm
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Joined: 22 Aug 2006
Posts: 557
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 5:59 pm Post subject: |
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| SHERITON HOTEL wrote: |
Can't answer huh? (ahem)... this parrot has ceased to be (beautiful plumage) |
What the heck, I'll do it.
| Quote: | Well were the blackbox flight recorders recovered from the twin towers? I understand a terrorist saudi passports survived the fires and collapse, weren't the flight 77 black boxes recovered 3 days after and at 4 in the morning or something?
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Black boxes are heavier than passports and less likely to be thrown clear of the building.
| Quote: |
Can you explain how these flight school flunkout islamists flew their "hijaccked" planes directly into those pre-impact explosions in both towers with uncanny identical timing being as you are a zealous advocate off the official 9/11 story?
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There were no pre-impact explosions. The fact that you believe there was "uncanny identical timing" suggests that what you saw was an artifact of the video medium, or was a consequence of the crash itself.
Of course, I will ignore your racist insinuation that Islamists are too stupid to pass flight school. |
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Jay Ref
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Joined: 20 Jul 2006
Posts: 511
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 6:13 pm Post subject: |
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| aggle-rithm wrote: | | marky 54 wrote: | | 99.99 of the worlds satisfaction? where did you get this figure, im intrsted to know your source. most poles i have seen show a divide of almost 50/50. and thats just america. |
So 50% of Polish-Americans don't think commercial aircraft flew into the towers? What does ethnicity have to do with it, ya racist? |
Gee and I thought he was talking about all the poles he's seen (and I bet he's seen a few right up close.)
(not that there's anything wrong with that) Wink-wink, nod-nod, say-no-more, say-no-more....
-z
_________________
"Knowledge is good"
-Emil Faber
"God in heaven. Here's the hard-headed, evidence-only freak who will not, like we CTers, indulge himself in self-inflating, utterly misconceived fantasies." -kbo234 (who is NOT a nazi) briefly makes sense |
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marky 54
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 7:20 pm Post subject: |
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 lets move on please  |
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SHERITON HOTEL
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 7:34 pm Post subject: |
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| aggle-rithm wrote: | | SHERITON HOTEL wrote: |
Can't answer huh? (ahem)... this parrot has ceased to be (beautiful plumage) |
What the heck, I'll do it.
| Quote: | Well were the blackbox flight recorders recovered from the twin towers? I understand a terrorist saudi passports survived the fires and collapse, weren't the flight 77 black boxes recovered 3 days after and at 4 in the morning or something?
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Black boxes are heavier than passports and less likely to be thrown clear of the building.
| Quote: |
Can you explain how these flight school flunkout islamists flew their "hijaccked" planes directly into those pre-impact explosions in both towers with uncanny identical timing being as you are a zealous advocate off the official 9/11 story?
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There were no pre-impact explosions. The fact that you believe there was "uncanny identical timing" suggests that what you saw was an artifact of the video medium, or was a consequence of the crash itself.
Of course, I will ignore your racist insinuation that Islamists are too stupid to pass flight school. |
Of course you'll ignore ...what?!? he/she/other really is daft enough to buy the official 9/11 story and is additionally fixated with attacking 911 truth messengers with false racialist slurs rather than attack the message, common tactic. |
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Ignatz
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 7:40 pm Post subject: |
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| SHERITON HOTEL wrote: |
Can't answer huh? (ahem)... this parrot has ceased to be (beautiful plumage) |
an answer to
"Ah. They were "drone planes"
I didn't realise you held to that theory.
So what happened to all the people - people of all different ages,backgrounds,family connections etc that actually boarded those flights before they were replaced by drones?
Were they taken away to lead secret lives elsewhere?"
would be interesting, if you have the time |
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marky 54
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 7:57 pm Post subject: |
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| that isnt anyones question to answer here, we didnt say a plane hit the building. why dont you look for that evidence at the scene? afterall there must be stuff there, if the dna survived then surely alot of the plane did to. |
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SHERITON HOTEL
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Posts: 988
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 8:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Ignatz wrote: | | SHERITON HOTEL wrote: |
Can't answer huh? (ahem)... this parrot has ceased to be (beautiful plumage) |
an answer to
"Ah. They were "drone planes"
I didn't realise you held to that theory.
So what happened to all the people - people of all different ages,backgrounds,family connections etc that actually boarded those flights before they were replaced by drones?
Were they taken away to lead secret lives elsewhere?"
would be interesting, if you have the time |
Nope, you've got me there I don't know what happened to the alleged below average size for that day alleged flight 11 and 175 passenger list, the neocons have shown few qualms in sacrificing innocent people including their own country men and women in the past five years in pursuit of their PNAC stated aims, the most recent example perhaps being the difference between the will shown to get bombs to Israel for use in Lebanon compared to the will shown in getting American x-patriots out of the Israeli bombers front line in the Lebanon.Then there's the 3K US service men and women reduced to dead meat for a lie, why do you ask?
Now about those mystery pre-impact/impact point twin tower explosions?..... |
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chipmunk stew
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 8:14 pm Post subject: |
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| marky 54 wrote: | | that isnt anyones question to answer here, we didnt say a plane hit the building. why dont you look for that evidence at the scene? afterall there must be stuff there, if the dna survived then surely alot of the plane did to. |
I showed you about a dozen links and pictures of wreckage. Your response was essentially "wull, yeh bu' how d'you know dey's tellin da troof?"
You are a lost cause. |
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marky 54
Mega Poster
Joined: 18 Aug 2006
Posts: 3293
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| Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 8:22 pm Post subject: |
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| why lie? no one has shown me good evidence at the pentagon of anything other than a few pieces of wreckage at the pentagon that dosnt seem to match a 757. one engine that is a lot smaller and a few scraps of metal. and you lie about my reply to. the only wrekage ive been shown is from flight 93. and i took that into consideration although i dont trust if it is genuine. but i did take it into consderation hence i dont ask for that evidence anymore. |
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