| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
mason-free party
Moderate Poster
Joined: 30 Jul 2005
Posts: 765
Location: Staffordshire
|
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
ian neal
Angel - now passed away
Joined: 26 Jul 2005
Posts: 3140
Location: UK
|
 Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 8:44 am Post subject: |
 |
|
| elvis wrote: | .....
If any of you believe that the truth will ever be known about 911, you'll probably be in the same boat as me re JFK when you reach my age, if you're not already there. |
Of course you may be right, but I doubt it. The world is very different from 40 years ago and 9/11 is different to the JFK asassination
How the world is different
The internet and ability to produce and share information cheaply
Broadband, you tube and google video
Wider awareness of proven conspiracies past and present and far greater public scepticism of the honesty of officialdom now than then
The new world order vision and modus operadi of the globalist psychos is better understood: Problem-reaction-solution, opposames, etc
How 9/11 is different
Considerably more complex apparently involving far more people and with more loose ends, questions and damning evidence challenging the official truth than even JFK's assassination
Directly led to the war on terror, Iraq and Afghanistan, erosion of civil liberties, etc... so the issue won't be dying away any time soon and the issue is of global significance and interest
If I thought it would take 40 years for the truth to come out and if I thought the unravelling would start and finish with 9/11 I personallly wouldn't be doing this |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Skeptic
Validated Poster
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 485
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mason-free party
Moderate Poster
Joined: 30 Jul 2005
Posts: 765
Location: Staffordshire
|
| Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 7:12 am Post subject: |
|
|
received Dean's interview with Dave Starbuck on CD yesterday just prior to his death...not sure what to make of it especially regards the missing children.He reckons around 7 children are found in the New Forest every week with their throats slit and skin peeled off and their flesh eaten into while still alive.Now that it one hell of a claim from a Dorset police officer.
He also reckons Huntley did not murder the Soham girls.He mentions quotes in the bible 'and they ate the flesh of the children' and goes on to discuss this saying that terrorised children produce a substance in the flesh that has mystical properties if devoured...like being able to read the minds of people. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
suspecta
Minor Poster
Joined: 19 Jul 2006
Posts: 87
|
| Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 9:33 am Post subject: |
|
|
[quote="Justin"] | Quote: | Justin wrote:
I can quite understand your concern about my advice for not going near practitioners of conventional cancer treatments, but once you have done the in depth research into Rife, frequency healing, B17, essaic tea and the many other treatments that have been ignored and deliberately suppressed by the criminal cartel made up of the pharmaceutical industry, politicians and leading doctors, you will see, as with 9/11, how the bulk of the people have been totally hoodwinked. Please look at all the evidence - like 9/11 it all becomes obvious when the veil is lifted. |
I've already read a lot about alternative cancer treatments as well as known a lot of people who have suffered, survived and succumbed to cancer. Amongst that number some have tried only alternative methods, some only conventional treatment and some have used a combination. Some have lived but most have died. Three of the people who have used only alternative methods have died; one of them did the 'Gerson' method. Everybody I've known who has been treated with chemotherapy has died in the end but this may have been because they tend to use chemotherapy more on people whose cancer has already spread.
I think it's revealing that three of the people I've known who have had radiotherapy only went on to survive. Two of them are vegetarians who eat a lot of organic food so their excellent diet may have something to do with their survival. Chemotherapy seems to be used largely to prolong lifewith terminal cancer rather than actually cure it from what I've noticed.
I just think it's a bit dangerous to emphatically advise only alternative treatment when there are people who go on to lived decades after lumpectomies followed by radiotherapy. If they had used only alternative methods they could all have been dead by now like my friends who shunned conventional treatment, so all I'm saying here is that we should be responsible in what we say here in the absence of careful, controlled research regarding alternative methods.
Suspecta |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
suspecta
Minor Poster
Joined: 19 Jul 2006
Posts: 87
|
| Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 10:13 am Post subject: |
|
|
| mason-free party wrote: | received Dean's interview with Dave Starbuck on CD yesterday just prior to his death...not sure what to make of it especially regards the missing children.He reckons around 7 children are found in the New Forest every week with their throats slit and skin peeled off and their flesh eaten into while still alive.Now that it one hell of a claim from a Dorset police officer.
He also reckons Huntley did not murder the Soham girls.He mentions quotes in the bible 'and they ate the flesh of the children' and goes on to discuss this saying that terrorised children produce a substance in the flesh that has mystical properties if devoured...like being able to read the minds of people. |
I've just listened to some of Dean's stuff - unfortunately though the file said it had been downloaded it refused to play the final part of either interview - annoying.
Anyway, I balked a bit when he described the many thousands of disappeared British as 'children'. He was talking about 16 to 24-year-olds when surely anyone above the age of 18 is officially an adult. And at risk of using my own experience as representative data I met a lad just the other week aged 22 who told me he hasn't seen or contacted his parents since he was 19. If he has been reported as missing by his parents would he feature in Dean's statistics? He's not living on the streets but trying to make a go of things in a bedsit and going to college; he fell out with his parents and has no wish ever to see them again and they haven't even split up. There must be legions of lads like him who have cut off from their parents for reasons of abuse or hated step-parents etc etc. It's just irresponsible to assume all these disappeared young people have been kidnapped. I've known plenty of other people who cut off from their parents in their 20's - two ex-boyfriends for a start!
I also chat to the homeless people who abound in my home town from time to time and have found that most of them have cut off entirely from their parents. The police are under no obligation to return any of these people to their families once they are past the age of 18 and there is currently more family breakdown in this country than ever before so it's unsurprising there are lots of missing young people.
This isn't to say young people aren't being kidnapped - I'm sure it does happen, but he shouldn't have called 12 to 24-year-olds children and he should have recognised how many of them must have 'disappeared' deliberately.
Suspecta |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Pikey
Banned
Joined: 25 Jul 2005
Posts: 1491
Location: North Lancashire
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
suspecta
Minor Poster
Joined: 19 Jul 2006
Posts: 87
|
| Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 8:54 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I think we should always try and be alert to the hidden sympathies of any website we visit. I just took a look at the truthseeker site and immediately saw an article about Jewish cannibalism. Who believes in that? The extreme (anti-Semitic) far right, that's who. Now I'm as anti-Zionist as the next right-thinking person, and am well aware that most of the neo-cons who are behind this phony 'war on terror' are Zionist, but it's one thing to dislike Zionism and everything they currently stand for, but something else altogether to believe in the idea of Orthodox Jews going in for child sacrifice. Yes there are people everywhere who abuse children and god forbid even worse, but to single out Jews as a people who routinely go in for child sacrifice is just blatant anti-Semitism.
To be honest I'm more worried about Islamophobia than anti-Semitism at the moment but that doesn't mean it's OK to start going on about Jews and blood sacrifice. The Nazis did that.
So we should be wary of any site that pushes this sort of thing, in my view.
Violinia |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
IronSnot
Relentless Limpet Shill
Joined: 07 Jul 2006
Posts: 595
Location: Australia
|
| Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 1:14 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Well said, suspecta. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
utopiated
Validated Poster
Joined: 09 Jun 2006
Posts: 645
Location: UK Midlands
|
| Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 3:41 am Post subject: dvd sales |
|
|
Will someone tell me if they know how the site revelation media sales site works? He's selling every DVD in the alt. media scene for £10 or £15.
The fact he's charging doesn't really bother me although many of us here and elsewhere just give some of that content away regularly and make a healthy loss. My point is do sites like that [there are ones on Ebay also] give a donation/prcentage of income to the people who's DVDs they are duplicating.
I'm not on about the local UK home grown one's like Casbolt's "Special Ops" tosh but the other DVDs like Beyond Treason etc. etc...
I suppose could phone him up and ask.
_________________
http://exopolitics.org.uk
http://chemtrailsUK.net
http://alienfalseflagagenda.net
-- |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
James C
Major Poster
Joined: 26 Jan 2006
Posts: 1046
|
| Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 8:49 am Post subject: |
|
|
As a self-employed plumbing & heating engineer, I looked at the ampliflair website with great interest. Unfortunately, I found it to be very confusing and in some places the figures quoted appear hard to swallow. It's laid out almost like the oilempire website and that is a very contentious site.
Anyone know anymore about this product? It doesn't look any different to or appear to work in a way which is groundbreaking to a number of other products on the market.
Don't get me wrong, I am interested in whether this product really works as claimed. Guess I'll just have to contact some of his clients. But to work out fuel saving costs based on buying scrap wood from sawmills @ £5/ton is not really fair. I live near Longleat forest and it supplies so called scraps at about £40/ton or £70/cord of cut wood. That will last about one month in winter in a very efficient stove if used exclusively for whole house heating. The site does go on to suggest how other heating appliances can be linked but again there is nothing new here. A Dunsley Baker Link Up or a plain old thermal store will integrate any standard boiler with a wood burning stove, solar panels etc etc. It even suggests that electricity can be produced. Again, a small stirling engine will do this fine and you can buy books on making these for home use. Just look on Amazon. In all there is nothing new here.
The site goes on to reveal the real efficiencies of different stoves and boilers without once reffering to SEDBUK. The claims appear to be based on flue temperature versus water flow temperature without explaining what this means. Again, the figures are misleading and have been taken out of context. It doesn't discuss the efficiency of air to air heating and how the human body responds to air tempertaures versus radiant temperatures. It makes claims that the product could compete with a 52KW oil boiler which has got to be an absolute joke - at best, when fully fired at max, the biggest amplifalair stove has an ouput of 24KW which means for most of the time it will only be half this unless one is attending to it every hour of every day.
The lack of trusted sources and quoted figures concerns me about the authenticity of the claims. There is no mention for the need to insulate a building properly first - which should always be the priority for any solid fuel heating system, or the massive cost of installing 'banks of hot water cylinders', as it refers to, which for wood burning boilers need to be massive at 1000-2000 litres to be effective. This will set you back a few thousand before you've even started. You might not need a plumber to attend to the ampliflair product itself, as the site claims but then again what wood burning appliance does need much attention, but you sure as hell will for installing it and maintaining all the other parts of the heating system such as pumps, flue, water cylinders, water tanks in the loft and so on and so on. Which is all good for me of course.
....and if we were all to switch to burning wood? Peak wood within the decade, even if coppiced. Which won't be a conspiracy, you just have to look at history for that. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
catfish
Validated Poster
Joined: 24 Apr 2006
Posts: 430
|
| Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 12:56 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I had just recently been in touch with this guy but he was very wary. He was also making hydrogen gas machines for cars.
_________________
Govern : To control
Ment : The mind |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ian neal
Angel - now passed away
Joined: 26 Jul 2005
Posts: 3140
Location: UK
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Skeptic
Validated Poster
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 485
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 9:54 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ian neal
Angel - now passed away
Joined: 26 Jul 2005
Posts: 3140
Location: UK
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 10:56 am Post subject: |
|
|
Hi Skeptic
Personally I don't know anything about the court case, but given the degree of doubt expressed by Eugene Mallove over Stanley Meyers claims I wouldn't automatically assume Stanley was genuine.
http://www.rexresearch.com/meyerhy/meyerhy.htm#obit
The difficulty is that both Meyers and Mallove faced a similar dilemma. In such a controversial, economically unproven and yet potentially highly rewarding market, there is obvious scope for charlatans to enter the market with all kinds of exciting claims of revolutionary technologies that are pure scams. Yet equally there is undoubted evidence of the oil/energy business (for what ever reasons) have suppressed the market in alternative and renewable energy technologies and energy conservation that would threaten their own dominance of global energy markets. Part of this suppression is to ridicule the possibility of alternative technologies such as cold fusion or ZPE
This then sets up a catch 22. Exciting claims of new energy technologies are not invested in precisely because they are seen to be too high risk and too 'unproven' in the marketplace (regardless of their actual merits). Yet the major obstacle to inventors in 'proving' their inventions in the market place is a lack of investors to provide capital to take a prototype to market and scale up production.
I think the answer is to follow James C's advice and Catfish's example and that is to try and develop working prototypes in order to prove there are genuine alternatives out there and then to take these prototypes out to the alternative/green gatherings to generate wider interest. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
catfish
Validated Poster
Joined: 24 Apr 2006
Posts: 430
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 10:58 am Post subject: |
|
|
From http://www.angelfire.com/sd/paulkemble/stan3.html
| Quote: | The classic high-tech takeover schemes generally consists of three basic elements: the money man, the disrupter (better known as the bag man), and the third party man that has no formal written agreement with the inventor...the circumstances herein disclosed is no exception...a Historygram of Events.
1. Ill-fated attempts to take over WFC by whatever means, legal or otherwise.
The pupose of this report is to detail the ill-fated attempts to take over the Water Fuel Cell (TM) Technology of Inventions since 1990, to show WFC countermoves and to describe the current status of WFC. It is quite obvious that a technology that will change the world's energy and economic base is a prize that the world system would want to control, exploit, and/or suppress. One man's desire to follow the Lord Jesus Christ's plan to bring a new ecological safe energy supply into the world would put him in conflict with those whose goals are to create a New World Order under their control or who desire to increase their wealth at the expense of the general welfare. This report lists the names and times and is validated by investigative WFC "Evidence of Records," affidavits, documentation and the actual experience of the inventor of the WFC Technology, Stanley A. Meyer. This report contains only a small fraction of the attempts to control the WFC Technology, since to list them all would require several books. It covers only the highlights to keep it short and easily read.
The Rick Schneider Affair
2. Rick Schnieder falsely claiming to be a certified FAA agent and fully qualified FAA master aircraft machinist.
On 30 October 1990, Stan Meyer approved a WFC Dealership Contract Agreement requiring a $40,000 deposit and other expense monies to be paid by Rick toward project expenses and signed by Richard (Rick) Schnieder, owner of the Bushmaster Management Company. This WFC Dealership work performance agreement was for the sole purpose of obtaining a Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) certification of the WFC Water Fuel Injection System (R) on an Alaskan Bushmaster Aircraft with a Mazda Internal Combustion (IC) engine. Rick had purported himself to be a master machinist and one of only six certified FAA agents who could certify the Bushmaster for airworthiness once changes were made to the fuel supply system of the aircraft.
3. Gilvesy, Brooks, and Dockweiler being business affiliated with Rick on A55/A21 Gunderman project, a competitive fuel additive product out of Reno Neveda.
In return for his assistance for FAA certification, Rick would receive the WFC Dealership rights to install the WFC Water Fuel Injection System (R) on the Mazda aircraft I.C. Engine for the U.S. market only. The deposit payment on behalf of Rick Schnieder was provided by check by William (Bill) Brooks, wealthy race car driver, who also expressed (later) an interest in retrofitting the WFC Injection System (R) to a specially designed Corvette that had held the world's land speed record and posibly a turbine jet aircraft. A third party, John Gilvesey, a Canadian businessman, wanted the right to manage WFC Central Operating for Canada for land transport, namely cars. However, no subsequent agreements with Bill Brooks were ever signed with WFC. John Gilvesey had no assigned aviation rights to WFC. Gilvesey and Brooks are also, business affiliated with Rick on the A55/A21 Gunderman fuel additive project. The Jet Commander was titled to Brooks and his wife and not belonging to Rick as rick claimed on BBC video tape.
4. FAA official notification that Bushmaster aircraft not permitted to fly due to Rick uncertified modification.. causing Alaskan pilot passenger death.
Rick had moved to Washington Courthouse (WCH), Ohio from Alaska and, subsequently, rented hangar space at the WCH Airport to machine WFC parts from drawings provided by Stan Meyer in supposed preparation to fly the Bushmaster with the WFC Water Fuel Injectors (R) at the Oshkosh, Wisconsin Air Show in late September 1992 or possibly in 1993. This could occur if Rick could officially obtain FAA certification of the WFC Water Fuel Injectors (R) on behalf of WFC. In a later investigation with the FAA, it was found that Rick was not associated with the FAA, and was involved in a $1.3 Million lawsuit concerning a September 1991 Bushmaster crash that caused the death of a passenger. It was alleged that Rick had made uncertified modifications to ther Bushmaster which he sold to the plaintiff/pilot, Daniel Herman. Consequently, FAA in January 1992 notified Rick that the Bushmaster was officially grounded and not permitted to fly. WFC investigations revealed that other alleged litigations against Rick involved claim jumping titles to aircraft, claim jumping the development rights of Tundra Tires, claim jumping the development rights of the Alaskan Bushmaster aircraft out of Canada, claim jumping development rights of the Mazda I.C. Engine for aircraft out of Japan, claim jumping the rights of a goldmine, and claim jumping FAA type cast certificates by falsifying US Government documents.
5. Rick Motive: defame WFC publicly but secretly to sell out WFC for gain of profit.
By signed affidavit, Linda Russel, money broker for foreign investors in the US, stated that on 6 February 1992, she signed a Consultant Sales Agreement with Rick Schnieder to sell the Bushmaster Management Company....including the Alaskan Bushmaster aircraft with the Mazda I.C. Engine. He also asked Linda to solicit foreign capital for the purpose of selling WFC marketing and licensing rights. Rick stated that Stan had given Rick a special (secret) cotract that gave him worldwide marketing rights to WFC. Apparently, Rick was unaware that Linda had purchased a WFC Dealership (several years before) and knew that Stan had refused a $280 Million offer for the rights to the WFC Technology. Linda asked Rick to write out a marketing plan for the sale of WFC marketing rights, which he did in her persence. Rick also explained his share of the sellout would be one percent of everything sold over the world. However, current WFC dealership would be out, since whoever controlled the licensing rights has control. (Rick Motive: defame WFC publicly but secretly sell out WFC for gain of profit.)
6. Rick falsly claiming to have WFC ownership rights to foreign investors.
In actuality, no WFC documentations shows any such written agreement was ever consummated to sign over the marketing and licensing rights of WFC to Rick Schnieder or to any other person(s) for any reasons. Stan still maintains full and complete ownership rights to the Water Gilvesey, Bill Brooks, Forrest Harper and Ron Dockweiler, a Michigan businessman, WFC dealer, and a member of A55/A21 Schneider group. WFC successfully defended itself against all these bogus charges by providing it's well documented records and evidence of proper filing with the state of Ohio Securities and Exchange Commission under oath of hearing.
10. Rick's bogus claims to WFC rights dismissed by plaintiffs since filed charges have been proven by WFC as having no merit of truth.
A complaint against Stan Meyer and WFC was filed on 4 August 1993 by Richard (Rick) Schneider, Bill Brooks, and John Gilvesey in Frankiln County, Ohio Common Pleas Court (Case No. 93CVH08-5477). Using the Dealership Contract Agreement as bogus proof, they stated they had the contractual right to enter into and complete systems engineering, manufacturing, and marketing of aviation systems using the WFC Technology. They said Stan did not honor this claim by providing the appropriate data and support, and therefore, this group filed for breach of contract and fraud and over $2 Million each for compensatory and punitive damages. On 27 December 1993, WFC countersued for $6.5 Million for compensatory damages and $2.5 for punitive damages. This suit charged that Schneider, Brooks and Gilvesy violated the WFC Dealership Contract Agreement by attempting to make, sell and utilize a patented WFC device without the written permission of Stan Meyer and that Brooks and Gilvesy were possible co-conspirators with Rick Schneider in the 8 August 1992 illegal seizure of WFC systems by gunpoint. In May 1994, WFC received a Notice of Dismissal of the lawsuit against WFC from the attorneys representing the plaintiffs.
11. Rick falsely claims title to Gilvesy Airplane. Gilvesy sues Rick for claim jumping title.
On 16 August 1995, Project Design and Management Inc. and John Gilvesy brought suit against Rick Schneider for the conversion of their Lockheed L-60 aircraft for his own use (Case No. W95 0259 CVH). The suit states that Rick attempted to deprive the plaintiffs of their ownership rights by registering the L-60 in a company that he controlled (claim jumping) and then attempted to sell the aircraft to a third party.
12. Gunderman counter sues Rick for falsely claiming aviation rights to fuel additive project.
The complexity of these lawsuits to control energy technology is not limited only to WFC. On 17 September 1993, Rick Schneider met with Rudolph Gunderman, the inventor of A-55/A21, a new fuel additive. In a 20 September 1993 letter from Rudolph to Rick, Rudolph outlined the terms under which Rick could become a limited partner in the A55 venture. On 29 March 1995, a Complaint and Demand for Jury Trial (Case No. W95 0094 CUH) was entered by Rick against Rudolph. Rick stated that Rudolph had accepted $25,000 to give Rick the rights to expand and develope the A-55 technology for aircraft applications. Since Rudolph had refused to perform his obligations, Rick wanted payment of fair value for services rendered and monetary relief for injury. It is the understanding of WFC that Rudolph has countersued and the matter is still under court review.
12. Rick supposedly diverted A55/A21 investor funds to an offshore bank account for personal use. Harper supposedly being the fund raiser for the A55/A21 Schneider group. IRS and FSE investigating.
However, WFC has also learned that, during 1993, Rick convinced over 100 investors, many in the WCH, Ohio area, that he had the marketing rights to A55/A21 and that he raised $1.54 Million for investment in this venture. This investment group has become known as the Schneider Group. It is to be noted the A-55/ A21 Technology is in direct competition with the WFC Technology. WFC expects that when the Water Fuel Water Injection System(s) (R) come on the market, there will be little demand for A-55/21, since it is a mixture of water and naptha, a petroeum by-product. Also, it is believed that Rick has now been dropped from the Schneider Group. Reportedly by IRS, the bulk sum of the raised monies were diverted by Rick to an offshore bank account in the Cannin Islands.
13. A55/A21 members, Harper/Willis, directed by Rick tries unsuccessfully to invalidate WFC Dealership Contract.
During August 1993, WFC received a letter from Forrest Harper, a WFC Dealer (and a member of the A-55/21 Schneider Group) that he wanted his dealership down payment returned because he had cancer. Stan informed Harper by certified letter that WFC would attempt to resell his dealership as per agreed WFC Policy... even though Stan knew Forrest's involvement with Rick, including his immediate presence during the 8 August 1992 hostile theat on Stan's life. Forrest had notified Stan by telefax that if he did not return the funds within ten days, he would sue WFC for fraud.
Subsequently, WFC recieved Summons dated 21 September 1993 (Case No. CVH 930292) against WFC by Forrest Harper and Richard Willis, another WFC Dealer, A-55/A21 Group member and friend of Forrest's. Forrest and Richard stated that they had bought their dealerships because of fraudulent statements by Stan Meyer claiming the WFC was a new technology and a revolutionary alternate energy system. They demanded $25,000 for compensatory damages, $25,000 for punitive damages, and their attorney fees together with interest and costs.
14. Rick tries unsuccessfully to decieve the U.S. Federal Security & Exchange by falsley claiming WFC business rights.
In a 11 November 1993 letter to the Common Pleas Court of Feyette County, Ohio, Stan denied the allegations and asked for $333,929 in compensatory damages and $279,250 in punitive damages. He stated that Forrest Harper and Richard Willis were in direct violation of the WFC Dealership Terms of Agreement, that Forrest Harper violated Inventor Stan Meyer's patent rights by attempting to make, sell and utilize a WFC patented device without written permission and that Forrest Harper was under investigation as a coconspirator in the "hostile takeover attempt and illegal seizure by gunpoint of the two duplicate WFC Water Fuel Injection systems by Rick Schneider...since U.S. Federal Security & Exchange calls were recieved by WFC indicating Rick bogus attempt to sell WFC technology to foreign investors, supposedly one business group out of Japan and another business source in London, England.
15. Plaitiffs unable to disprove WFC "Mode of Operability" of using water only.
On 18 October 1995, a pretrial depostion hearing to inspect the WFC Dealership demonstration units (Variable-plate Electrical Polarization Process (VIC) Fuel Cell and Rotary Pulse Voltage Frequecy Generator Tubular-Array Fuel Cell) was held in the office of the plaintiff's attorney, Robert Judkins. Present were the plaintiff's, their attorneys, plaintiffs expert witness, Michael Leverich(Electronics Engineer), Stan Meyer, Dr. Russel Fowler, WFC witness and defense attorneys Judge Roger Hurley and James Detling, as well as a deposition recorder. During the deposition, Attorney Judkins attempted to have the WFC dismantle (taken apart) prior to implementing proper test proceedures, which Stan Meyer refused. Michael Leverich confirmed that his initial measurements of the WFC Fuel Cells showed that it operated exactly as the WFC documentation stated it should, as so recorded on WFC Deposition Video Tape. However, he then added a unknown white substance(powder) for additional testing. Stan objected to this, since the WFC Fuel Cell uses plain tap water and does not require a chemical additive. The plaintiffs also admitted that, during their observances at WFC Dealship Seminars, tap water was always used without any chemicals added to the water. Forrest Harper alone attende over 30 Seminars. Despite Stan's objection, plaintiff measurements were taken of this chemicallized water-bath and recorded. This illegal act of tampering with WFC Evidence of Records was witnessed by WFC Cameraman, Dr. Russ Fowler, and all others who attended Plaintiffs Deposition To-Test.
16. Plaintiff Harper relative prevented to be presiding Judge. Plaintiff attorney, Coffman, supposedly secretary of the A55/A21 Schneider Investment Group, forced to withdraw as plaintiffs counsel due to conflict of interest.
The first part of the trial started on Thursday/Friday, 1/2 February 1996 before Judge William Corzine III at the Common Pleas Court, Chillicothe, Ohio. WFC had requested a jury trial, but that was disapproved since the request was later than the 14 days allowed for such a request. A request for a change of venue to Franklin County, WFC's home county, had also been disapproved... which, being in opposition to Judicial Protocol in the fact that one of Harper's relatives was on the Judgeship of Feyette County Court District which included both Washington C.H., and Chillicothe, Ohio.
17. Plaintiffs counsel not able to disprove WFC Documents of Evidence as so established by independent test-labs, worldwide.
Defense presented their arguements and witnesses. Their three prime "Expert Witnesses" were Plaintiff's Electronic Expert, Michael Leverich, Rick Schneider and Ron Dockweiler. They attempted to prove that the WFC process was not new and revolutionary, but only electrolysis, and that the Voltage Intensifier Circuit(VIC) did not exist, contrary to WFC patent verification as so confirmed via Plaintiff's Dispostion To-Test. The VIC is the primary component to limit amperage leakage and to allow the voltage to increase, which is the opposite result of electrolysis. Attorney Judkins stated that the voltage-zones in both WFC Fuel Cells were only copper and not stainlss steel material and that the WFC Fuel Cells needed an additive to function. Rick Schneider claimed that he had the WFC for three days for testing and that the WFC Pulse Voltage Circuits were nothing more than a stack of batteries chemically storing electrons. Charles Holbrook, WFC assistant who was responsible for the WFC Fuel Cell during the time of Rick alleged testing, stated under oath that the WFC Fuel Cell was only out of his control for less than thirty minutes during one lunch period.
18. Plaintiffs Counsel present no evidence to support their false claims.
No verified testing results were presented by the defense nor was any oscilloscope results shown for the WFC electronic signal input to the WFC Fuel Cells by Rick. The plaintiff attorney Judkin did finally admit in a Plaintiff's Motion that a form of salt compound (no certificate of testing of chemical substance presented by the Plaintiffs) had been put into the WFC Fuel Cell during the depostion for testing... thereby, creating a dead short condition and causing the WFC Fuel Cells to malfuction (reducing gas production) since salt would degrade the WFC gas process, not enhance it as with electrolysis...and, since voltage has no effect on an electrolyte.
19. Judge Corzine attemps to intercede to prevent WFC arguements to be presented before the court.
On 2 February 1996, the court was adjourned until Wednesday, 8 May 1996. No WFC witnesses had been called, including WFC Expert Witnesses and Electrical Engineer, Mathias Johanson, from Sweeden. Instead Judge Corzine called the lawyers into his chambers and informed them that he could only find punitive damages of $1 and that they should try to settle the case. This was made without WFC counter arguements. Defendant Stan Meyer refused this offer, since his arguements had not been heard and he was confident of the merits of the proven WFC technology by independent testing labs.
20. Plaintiffs Electronic Expert proclaims, under oath, that WFC electronic circuits suggest that it is not an electrolysis process.
The trial re-convened on Wednesday, 8 May 1996 through Friday, 10 May 1996. Stan Meyer underwent extensive cross examination. Judge Corzine disallowed WFC video tape filmed during Plaintiff deposition to-test, WFC video tape of a WFC Dealership Seminar that contradicted key testimony of Forrest Harper and other plaintiff's witnesses, a well as WFC Test To Confirm Video tape showing both WFC Electronic Experts, Stephen Meyer and Mathias Johanson, confirming WFC VIC Circuit unipolar pulse voltage input signal with low amp leakage being applied to the Fuel Cells. Attorney/Judge Hurley only called foreward one WFC witness and limited his testimony. He did not allow key expert witness, Johanson to take the stand since "his English was not good". WFC witnesses find his English clear and easily understood. Attorney/Judge Hurley also stated he wanted to present an "Image of the Defendant", and not directly respond to the Plaintiffs' charges. However, during this time Expert Witness Leverich stated under oath of the hearing that the... "electronic circuit interfacing suggests that it is not an electrolysis process." Other key findings under oath were that Rick Schneider had threatened Stan Meyer on 14 August 1992 by pulling a .45 calibre handgun on him, that Rick, Forrest, Richard, and Ron were all in business relationship on the A-55/A21 technology and that electronic expert witness, Leverich, had added salt to the WFC Fuel Cell during his measurements at the deposition. Since the WFC uses ordinary water and not an additive, this directly violated Judicial Protocol by tampering with WFC Evidence of Records.
21. Judge Corzine prevents WFC Evidence of Records to be submitted to the court by knowing and willfully switching off the court audio sound recording equipment during WFC oral testimony.
During Stan Meyer's oral testimony before the court in demonstrating the WFC Fuel Cell "Mode of Operability" of using the Voltage Intensifier Circuit (VIC) in producing voltage of opposite polarity to separate and disassociates the water molecule into its component gases, hydrogen & oxygen, the court audio sound recording equipment seemed to malfunction and be switched off. Judge Corzine said proceedings should continue without it. This is a violation of judicial protocol, since the recording system is used to verify testimony given during the trial...and as such becomes "Evidence of Records." After his oral testimony, Stan expected Attorney/Judge Hurley to start bringing forth WFC witnesses and counter arguements. Instead, Attorney/Judge Hurley spoke up, stated he had to leave for a pre-planned vacation and said that there was no more testimony to be given and waver the right of the defendant to give a case summary of the WFC facts brought before the court. Stan Meyer immediately stated he would protest and Judge Corzine ended the hearing.
21. WFC files charges of judicial misconduct by a presiding judge to the State Supreme Court of Ohio, Disciplinary Counsel...requesting a new trial or dismissal due to judicial default.
Attorney/Judge Hurley told Stan Meyer that only evidence accepted by the judge in the original case could be heard in an appeal case. Since now there was no evidence of the WFC Voltage Intensifier Circuit demonstration and related WFC counter arguements before the court due to the fact that the court audio sound recording system was off, they could not be used in an appeal case. Also, 34 key poster boards that explained the detail of the WFC voltage process were also not allowed as evidence. Some had been numbered for the court records, but then the numbering had been crossed out. Also, the WFC patent documents had not been blue-tagged as evidence. Therefore, Stan immediately started presenting documentation and a list of complaints/discrepancies to the State Supreme Court of Ohio Judicial Counsel, which investigates complaints of judicial and/or lawyer misconduct. Defense Attorneys/Judge Hurley and Detling, at this juncture, were also summarily terminated by WFC for malpractice.
22. Judge shown to have malice of forethought.
WFC petitioned for a new hearing or dismissal of charges by WFC documentation submitted on 22 July and 31 July 1996. By written court order dated 9 August 1996, Judge Corzine gave WFC on or before 4 September 1996 4:30 PM to submit a reply to the plaintiff's response to the defendant's motion for a new trial. Plaintiff's response was received by the court on 20 August 1996. WFC's reply arrived on 4 September 1996. However, before the WFC reply was even considered, Judge Corzine denied WFC's request for a new trial on 3 September 1996. His judgement, on the same date, found WFC guilty of "gross and egregious fraud" with punitive damages of $1, a penalty totally inconsistent with the wording used. This was a change from his findings on the 7 August 1996 oral hearing, in which he found WFC guilty only of "fraud" with punitive damages of $1. A word change showing malice on the part of Judge Corzine.
23. Judge rules against the very WFC Evidence of Records not allowed to be submitted to the court due to the court audio equipment being switch off by instruction of the presiding Judge.
Judge Corzine ruled that WFC did not have an amperage inhibiting circuit, did not have a Voltage Intensifier Circuit (VIC) and therefore the WFC water splitting process was only electrolysis. However, independent scientific verification (Government and University Labs, Worldwide) of the WFC technology as being different than electrolysis, including the existence and amperage restricting operation of the Voltage Intensifier Circuit (VIC) as well as verification by the US Patent Office under 35 USC 101, had been established well before the trial.
>23. Judge rules against the very WFC Evidence of Records >not allowed to be submitted to the court due to the court >audio equipment being switch off by instruction of the >presiding Judge.
> > Judge Corzine ruled that WFC did not have an amperage >inhibiting circuit, did not have a Voltage Intensifier Circuit >(VIC) and therefore the WFC water splitting process was >only electrolysis. However, independent scientific verification >(Government and University Labs, Worldwide) of the WFC >technology as being different than electrolysis, including the >existence and amperage restricting operation of the Voltage >Intensifier Circuit (VIC) as well as verification by the US >Patent Office under 35 USC 101, had been established well >before the trial. Additionally, WFC was ordered to return to the plaintiffs their WFC dealership deposits and pay their attorney fees, a total amount of $40,515.72.
24.Judge Corzine impliments unsuccessfully, illegal collection activities by attempting to collect six times the judgement value.
On 2 October 1996, Judge Corzine signed an Affidavit, Order and Notice of Garnishment of Property other than Personal Earnings and Answer of Garnishee for the amount of $40,515.72. This Affidavit includes a Notice of Hearing which gives the Garnishee [ five days (underlined)] from the day he/she has been served with the Affidavit to request such a hearing. However, on the day that WFC recieved the Affidavit, WFC was notified by six banks in Grove City, Ohio that Attorney Judkins had served them with the court Garnishment Affidavit. This could have resulted in the illegal withdrawl of over $243,000 from WFC accounts had all these banks had WFC accounts. Obviously, no opportunity to ask for a hearing was allowed. For the record, WFC has paid the total cost asked for in the judgement plus 10 percent interest from 3 september 1996. Rick Motive: disclaim WFC patent developement rights in order to attempt to use WFC technology with regard to A55/A21 project...since WFC requires no chemical additive to water to become a fuel additive to gasoline or diesel fuel.
Statement of Summary
1. Judicial Protocol must be mandated to insure Defendant rights to defend.
As a result of the experience of WFC in this court case, WFC will push the U.S. court system to a Miranda "Statement of Ruling" for defendants in lawsuits of this type. Defendants should be aware of what steps they can take if their "Rights to Defend" are exploited and denied in the court room by either lawyers or judges, or both. The loophole must be closed where a lawyer can withhold evidence until the last minute and then close the case as the defendant is expecting the start of the counter arguements. This effectively prevents the withheld evidence from being heard in any appeal. Also, the defendant should understand his rights and procedures to protest in the case of violations of judicial protocol by the judge and what these violations of judicial protocol might be and what corrective action(s) can be taken to protect the [ Defendant Rights to Defend (underlined)] in an ongoing court hearing. WFC charges of judicial misconduct by the suppression of, tampering with, and refusal to properly administer WFC Evidence of Records, is now before the Disciplinary Counsel, The Supreme Court of the State of Ohio... requesting a new trial or dismissal of Judge, Corzine, ruling by Judicial default. |
And specific to the Sunday Times from the same place:
| Quote: | The Tony Edwards Affair
1. Many knowledgeable people in high positions support WFC technology in many segments of industy. Admiral Griffin was a strong supporter.
Since 1990, Stan Meyer and WFC had been championed in England by Sir Admiral Anthony (Tony) Griffin, former Comptroller of the British Navy, past President of the Royal Institution of Naval Architects and Chairman of the British Maritime Charitable Foundation. Sir Anthony had written several technical reports and appeared in various English seminars publicizing and explaining the WFC technology in using water as a possible new fuel source. Admiral Griffin was especially noted for modernizing the British Navy and being a visionary in promoting a possible sea lane for under- water cargo ships traveling beneath the North Polar Cap through the Bearing Straights. Now, in late August 1996, he invited Stan Meyer to participate, alone with other Environmentalists, in a seminar supposedly to take place in the Moses Room adjacent to the House of Lords, London England. A highly controlled list of attendees, including members of the House of Lords and House of Commons, a well as industrialists and environmentalists, were anticipated to be invited to the Seminar. Another public seminar planned by John Allen was also being planned as well as meeting with many industrial leaders in Europe. In preparation for this trip WFC heard on 18 October 1996, that Admiral Griffin had unexpectedly passed away from a fatal stroke on 16 October 1996. However, the British Maritime Charitable Foundation, as well as Lady Griffin, requested that Stan still participate in the Moses Seminar.
2. WFC requested to attend an Environmental Seminar in London, England, that never existed in reality.
To honor Admiral Griffin's last request, as so related to WFC by Mark Beach, Oxford representative to the Ukrain, Stan arrived in England. Almost immediately, he was ushered into a closed door meeting with memberes of the British Maritime Charitable Foundation (BMC). In an attempt to intimidate him, they notified Stan they had "just" been given information he had been charged with "gross and egregious" fraud. They said their legal counsel had advised them to cancel the meeting. However, if Stan could provide the result of an appeal, reveal WFC contractual sources and satisfy other requirements, than they would protect him from the press, as so audio tape recorded. Stan provided fax copies of his documentation with the Ohio Supreme Court Judicial Counsel and other WFC documents denoting confimation of WFC technology by independent test labs, but refused the other demands and the Seminar was cancelled by BMC.
The Foundation also attempted to have WFC pay their expenses, which WFC refused in a Cease and Desist letter since WFC had no contractual agreement with the Foundation. Admiral Griffin had been briefed on the bogus court case and never implied it would be an obstacle to the Seminar. Also, supposedly the information on the court case was provided to the Foundation by Noel Whitney, an Irish Businessman. Noel had been involved in an earlier WFC "Proof of Concept" project, which had been automatically terminated when Noel had lost his funding source and was unable and openly refused to pursue the WFC project any further as per terms of contract. Apparently, Noel financial sources were misinformed... finding out that Noel had no WFC intellectual rights for Europe. Noel simply was to become a manufacturer supplier for WFC provided that Noel satisfactorily completed WFC agreed to work. Finally, it has been verified that the Moses Room had never been scheduled for the Seminar. However, knowledge of the court case and the cancellation of the Seminar did not affect the many other business meetings that Stan had scheduled during his trip to England and other parts of Europe. Stan had in his possession the latest 1996 WFC International News Release titled "WFC Setting Industrial Standard," Technical Supplement Report (TSR), issue No.11A denoting independent confimations of WFC tech-base by various Governmental and University testing labs and explaining how particle oscillation of the water molecule being exposed to and undergoing pulsating electrical stress can cause the water-atoms to function as an energy generator...instantly converting water droplets into thermal explosive energy to run a car by the use of WFC Water Fuel Injectors... by simply replacing the standard spark plug or diesel injector port in I.C. Engines, or injector nozzles in jet turbine Engines. The Foudation was given a copy of the TSR by Stan during the BMC seminar committee meeting.
3. WFC denounces Sunday Times Article by Tony Edwards as being distorted. WFC never has received any U.S. Federal cease and desist orders to stop developing the Water Fuel Injectors for mass production.
In their 1 December 1996 issue , the London Sunday Times published an article entitled "End of Road for Car that Ran on Water" by TonyEdwards. It defamed WFC technology and upheld the court case without due recourse, stating that three "Expert Witnesses" were not impressed and decided that the WFC was simply using conventional electrolysis. It stated Stan Meyer was found guilty of "gross and egregious fraud" and was ordered to repay the investors their $25,000. It imlpied that Michael Laughton, professor of electrical engineering at Queen Mary and Westfield University, London was due to examine the car, but was not allowed to see it. However, not mentioned was that this occurred in 1990 and that the WFC Water Fuel injector tech-base was still under U.S. National Security Review as in accordance to U.S. Patent Law and not available for public viewing. Also not mentioned were the many WFC Patents, verified laboratory and university testing that supports the bases of WFC technology nor the WFC appeal filing to dismiss Judge Corzine ruling due to Judicial default and other relevant information.
Stan wrote a "Request to Retract" fax-letter to the Sunday Times on 2 December 1996. He attached WFC documentation on the filing with the Disciplinary Counsel. He further stated that Judge Corzine had no right to turn off the court audio sound recording equipment, nor to rule against U.S. Patents, or overrule Government and University lab reports in the public domain concerning the mode of operability of the WFC Technology. Furthermore, Stan pointed out that no US Federal "Cease and Desist" order has ever been issued against WFC since the WFC Technology has been fully legalized under US Patent Security Law 35 USC 101 and other US Federal regulatory Acts. His final statement was that "WFC is here to stay" in contradiction to the Sunday Times statement.
4. Many people are not taken in by Tony Edwards bogus article. They are openly speaking out, internationally. The Sunday Times readership was not completely taken in. For example, one letter to the Sunday Times Editor-in -Chief, John Witherow from Ola Deraker, noted Swedish international journalist, called the article scandalizing and pointed that experts had talked positively about the WFC technology. He also explained why the WFC process could not be electrolysis, and wondered what the Sunday Times was going to do to correct the matter. WFC has, also, filed a formal complaint with the British Press Complaint Commission dated 14 December 1996 to redress the wrong from this article. Others are comming to the aid of WFC and speaking out against the distorted facts presented by Tony Edwards article.
In Retrospect to Events
1. Pupose of Power Brokers: defame WFC publicly by whatever means to prevent financial and public support. Isolate Inventor to push for a possible buy out.
A classic pattern seems to always emerge, one that has been used many times to control, exploit, and even suppress new technology that is not under corporate domination. Corporations are specifically set up to take over and control high technology, worldwide. First and foremost directive, try to take over the inventor's work by whatever means possible. This includes buyout at the lowest price or filing blocking patents against the inventor. Attempt to get various regulatory organizations or the Internal Revenue Service to investigate the inventor with a resulting loss of financial resources and/or time. Harass the inventor with countless court cases to falsly claim that someone else owns and controls the technology, to prematurely force the inventor to reveal his work before patents are consummated. If a charge of fraud can be obtained, no matter what the cicumstances, then use this to prevent further financial support in business and stop publicizing the technology publicly. Destroy/weaken the inventor's financial base if possible to increase the likelihood of a sellout. Try to obtain a third party or bogus agreements that can be used to provide a means to attempt to capture control of the technology by way of contractual loopholes.
5. U.S. Patent and Commerce Laws protects the right of the inventor to reduce his patent to practice. Fortunately, these bogus activitie are considered in the realm of unethical business and legal practices. All have been tried on WFC. However, its not morally right to do wrong. Without the Lord's protection and guidance, the WFC would not be on the verge of availability to the world as it is today. WFC is in the system engineering stage of its growth. WFC "Proof of Concept" contracts are active and WFC is proceeding with building prototypes for WFC units/kits for testing and developing a manufacturing standard for mass production. Negotiations are underway far a large variety of WFC projects around the world. The WFC is a topic on the Internet and in many corporate boardrooms. Environmentalists are taking up the banner for WFC around the World. The power brokers know one thing...that if we come together in one accord, there is no power on earth that can stop the progression of the WFC technology...our planet earth is worth saving. |
_________________
Govern : To control
Ment : The mind |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ian neal
Angel - now passed away
Joined: 26 Jul 2005
Posts: 3140
Location: UK
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 11:15 am Post subject: |
|
|
| suspecta wrote: | Yes there are people everywhere who abuse children and god forbid even worse, but to single out Jews as a people who routinely go in for child sacrifice is just blatant anti-Semitism.
To be honest I'm more worried about Islamophobia than anti-Semitism at the moment but that doesn't mean it's OK to start going on about Jews and blood sacrifice. The Nazis did that.
So we should be wary of any site that pushes this sort of thing, in my view. |
Absolutely agree suspecta. Well said
Personally I have no time for orthodox religions and dogmas of any kind, but lots of time for G-d and understanding our inherent spiritual dimension.
To me it is blatantly obvious that the PTB are desperately trying to stoke division and hatred amongst the followers of major world religions, polarise debate whilst at the same time portraying themselves as some kind of secular reasonable middle-ground. The same old same old. The liars and hypocrites.
Anyone who fails to understand and communicate the difference between the (IMO racist and intolerant) political ideology of zionism and the generations of terrorists who have headed the Israeli state and the Jewish religion and millions of followers of Judaism is not someone to be listened to or trusted. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Skeptic
Validated Poster
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 485
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 12:22 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ian neal wrote: |
Hi Skeptic
Personally I don't know anything about the court case, but given the degree of doubt expressed by Eugene Mallove over Stanley Meyers claims I wouldn't automatically assume Stanley was genuine.
http://www.rexresearch.com/meyerhy/meyerhy.htm#obit
The difficulty is that both Meyers and Mallove faced a similar dilemma. In such a controversial, economically unproven and yet potentially highly rewarding market, there is obvious scope for charlatans to enter the market with all kinds of exciting claims of revolutionary technologies that are pure scams. Yet equally there is undoubted evidence of the oil/energy business (for what ever reasons) have suppressed the market in alternative and renewable energy technologies and energy conservation that would threaten their own dominance of global energy markets. Part of this suppression is to ridicule the possibility of alternative technologies such as cold fusion or ZPE
This then sets up a catch 22. Exciting claims of new energy technologies are not invested in precisely because they are seen to be too high risk and too 'unproven' in the marketplace (regardless of their actual merits). Yet the major obstacle to inventors in 'proving' their inventions in the market place is a lack of investors to provide capital to take a prototype to market and scale up production.
I think the answer is to follow James C's advice and Catfish's example and that is to try and develop working prototypes in order to prove there are genuine alternatives out there and then to take these prototypes out to the alternative/green gatherings to generate wider interest. |
Thanks Ian
I was just interested because (according to Wikipedia!) he was successfully sued by investors and convicted for fraud.
One would presume that in order for him to be found guilty of fraud, his invention would have to be proven to be faulty in some way. But this is just an assumption, hence my interest.
Peace |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
suspecta
Minor Poster
Joined: 19 Jul 2006
Posts: 87
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 12:37 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | | Anyone who fails to understand and communicate the difference between the (IMO racist and intolerant) political ideology of zionism and the generations of terrorists who have headed the Israeli state and the Jewish religion and millions of followers of Judaism is not someone to be listened to or trusted. |
Quite right. They need a leaflet about Orthodox Jews Against Zionism shoved in their faces, or something. Or about True Torah Jews Against Zionism. Or Jews Not Zionists
http://www.nkusa.org/
http://www.jewsagainstzionism.com/
http://www.jewsnotzionists.org/
I get heartily sick of seeing and hearing gratuitous anti-Semitism mixed in with all the justified anti-Zionism.
I also think these anti-Semitic anti-Zionists need to realise just how brainwashed most Israelis are and how hard it is to break out of that kind of brainwashing. I tried to talk to an Israeli family friend recently and it was like communicating with a brick wall - he was absolutely positive that the Arabs want to push them all into the sea.
He was also totally unaware that the Israeli security services recently prevented a meeting between leading Israelis and Palestinians from taking place (just before the war on Lebanon). This meeting could have actually led to a viable peace but the ultra right just don't want it and will do anything in their power to prevent it.
Suspecta |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ian neal
Angel - now passed away
Joined: 26 Jul 2005
Posts: 3140
Location: UK
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 3:28 pm Post subject: |
|
|
True enough and those are good sites
I would add that IMO many of the "anti-Semitic anti-Zionists" are part of the game as well. What better way to deflect legitimate criticism away from the crimes of the Israeli state than to associate and confuse in the public consciousness this legitimate denounciation of zionism with the 'racist', protocols of zion, 'it's all the jews I tell you', neo-nazi, anti-semitic bs nonsense.
The PTB are up to their necks in this bull. Anyone who does a little digging will find the connections that link western security/intelligence agencies with extreme viewpoints within all religions and fascist politics
The rise of 'rapturists', wahabism, 'anti-semiticism', the BNP and bigotry in general is all part of the creating the 'us and them' mentality essential to push peace loving but gullible people away from their inherent tolerance and love of justice towards supporting the PTB's fear driven, war mongering agenda |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Doos
Minor Poster
Joined: 23 Sep 2006
Posts: 25
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 9:35 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| suspecta wrote: | I just think it's a bit dangerous to emphatically advise only alternative treatment when there are people who go on to lived decades after lumpectomies followed by radiotherapy. If they had used only alternative methods they could all have been dead by now like my friends who shunned conventional treatment, so all I'm saying here is that we should be responsible in what we say here in the absence of careful, controlled research regarding alternative methods.
Suspecta |
Hi suspecta. If you want one book that will give you the whole B17 story, the cover-up, including info on the numbers who undergo "conventional" treatment and how long they survive compared with "alternative" therapy, I recommend "Cancer, why we're still dying to know the Truth" by Phillip Day, Health Researcher. Available at
http://credence.org/
Mr Day's done a book on AIDS too "The Truth about HIV" also about Big Pharma. Or catch him on his next tour of UK, his talks are very motivational.
Sorry if I've broken forum rules by plugging a book..........  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ian neal
Angel - now passed away
Joined: 26 Jul 2005
Posts: 3140
Location: UK
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 12:43 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Hi Doos and welcome
No problem about the book plugging.
The only issue on this thread is how far allow the debate to meander from 9/11. It's a tricky balancing act .
Clearly Dean Warwick's death warrants discussion due to his interest in 9/11 and the closely related issues: his claims of around new energy technologies and his claims regarding the global elite as well as the puzzling circumstances of his death especially given his controversial views and his concerns that he may be murdered.
He also had many other related interests including alternative health and the alleged crimes of big pharmaceuticals. However this feels a few steps too far removed from 9/11 itself.
Any feedback on this guidance
| Quote: | Further the moderators request that posters focus on 9/11 and issues directly relevent to 9/11
Obviously what is considered directly relevent to 9/11 is open to interpretation and balance and will be defined over time.
This certainly includes the wider war on terror, Iraq, Afghanistan, 7/7 and other allegedly 'al qaeda' or al qaeda 'inspired' attacks, erosion of civil liberties, extraordinary rendition, the Impeach Blair campaign and media reporting of the 'War on Terror'.
It will include a degree of relevent historical context: such as operation gladio, Iran Contra, Skull and Bones, CIA criminality, the rise of 'Islamic fundamentalism' and so forth.
However it will exclude discussion of holocaust revision, ascended masters, UFOs, 2012, numerology, lizards, moon landings and so forth unless a direct connection to 9/11 can be demonstrated.
It is the decision of the moderators that discussion of issues such as these that do not relate directly to 9/11 (regardless of any merits they may have) is counter-productive to the campaign's aims. There are several other sites that provide a forum that is both sympathetic to 9/11 truth and tolerant of a wider range of topics. One such example is www.illusionsforum.com and there are others. |
and where to draw the line very welcome. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Pikey
Banned
Joined: 25 Jul 2005
Posts: 1491
Location: North Lancashire
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
heart-earth
Suspended
Joined: 21 Oct 2006
Posts: 31
Location: M DNA ARK
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 1:27 pm Post subject: 3 journalists killed on 7-10 |
|
|
Why is there no Dean Warwick on the list yet ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deaths_in_2006
_________________
"you can fool some people sometimes,
but you can`t fool all the people all the time." |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
flamesong
Major Poster
Joined: 27 Jul 2005
Posts: 1305
Location: okulo news
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 10:11 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Has anybody listened to the two audio files linked in this thread?
Whenever I find myself assessing material like this, my phase one analysis is to look at the most verifiable information.
Dean Warwick claimed that Michael Meacher was sacked because he had 'publicised the fact that he had read word for word what was going to happen to the twin towers three years before the event'. Is there any record of this? I assume he wasn't talking about Wembley Stadium!
He also claimed that photographs could not be taken on the Moon because there is no light on the Moon. What we see is the Sun's electromagnetic radiation reflected off the Moon. By that token there is no light on the Earth and we should not be able to take photographs here!
I regret that when I read or hear things like this I find the more extreme claims very hard to believe. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Pikey
Banned
Joined: 25 Jul 2005
Posts: 1491
Location: North Lancashire
|
| Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 10:40 pm Post subject: |
|
|
A few of the speakers at the Probe conference on Sunday 30/3/08 mentioned Deans work and his sudden death at Probe.
One of the speakers gave an account of his work experience in the military and afterwards as one of the bodyguards for a well known South American drug baron. He gave a very interesting insight into the drugs dealing and stated that the biggest customers were government agents, CIA, MI6, Mossad etc
He advised that the military have been using sonic weaponry for some time and that Dean Warwick knew about this due to his work experience with the CIA.
Maybe we should take Andrew Johnsons research and Dr Judy Woods more seriously comrades. 
I was not at Probe the day Dean passed away to another dimension but many of the regulars who attend Probe and witnessed the incident feel that he was taken out by sonic weaponry.
_________________
Pikey
Peace, truth, respect and a Mason free society
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RaH-lGafwtE#
www.wholetruthcoalition.org
www.truthforum.co.uk
www.checktheevidence.com
www.newhorizonsstannes.com
www.tpuc.org
www.cpexposed.com
www.thebcgroup.org.uk
www.fmotl.com |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
marky 54
Mega Poster
Joined: 18 Aug 2006
Posts: 3293
|
| Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 11:53 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | feel that he was taken out by sonic weaponry.
|
| Quote: | Maybe we should take Andrew Johnsons research and Dr Judy Woods more seriously comrades.
|
this is'nt the first time ive seen a death used as an excuse to give credibility to j.wood.
people died therefore j.wood must be right kind of arguement.
i am not saying that this death may not of been suspicious, i simply don't know, but surely more than a 'feeling' is needed to conclude something.
was this event filmed where he died? i aint asking for want of wanting to see it, just that if he WAS killed by sonic weaponary then surely the killer was in the room and the footage could give an indication.
why has it been 1 and half years since last hearing anything on this if it was a murder case? or is there disagrement as to wether it was? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Pikey
Banned
Joined: 25 Jul 2005
Posts: 1491
Location: North Lancashire
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
marky 54
Mega Poster
Joined: 18 Aug 2006
Posts: 3293
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2008 1:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | | One of the links thrown up is from a NY resident who smelled the (oh so familiar) aftermath of nukes at WTC on 9/11. |
thanks for the link.
so there is no evidence, just information that leads to assumptions.
i do not dispute the death is suspicious, but if im going to believe it was due to sonic weaponary, and that somehow must mean j.wood is correct, then im just looking for some kind of actual evidence, rather than 'feelings'.
i can tell im wasting my time and all there actually is, is feelings and suspicions and assumptions. if somebody died suddenly whilst reading the bingo i doubt there would be any suspicions at all, yet i bet it happens.
what im trying to get to or be clear about is wether this was a normal death made suspicious due to the nature of the talk, or if there is actual evidence pointing to murder and use of sonic weaponary.
actually forget it i don't think people get it sometimes once they have already made up their minds. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Pikey
Banned
Joined: 25 Jul 2005
Posts: 1491
Location: North Lancashire
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2008 2:20 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | thanks for the link.
so there is no evidence, just information that leads to assumptions.
i do not dispute the death is suspicious, but if im going to believe it was due to sonic weaponary, and that somehow must mean j.wood is correct, then im just looking for some kind of actual evidence, rather than 'feelings'.
i can tell im wasting my time and all there actually is, is feelings and suspicions and assumptions. if somebody died suddenly whilst reading the bingo i doubt there would be any suspicions at all, yet i bet it happens.
what im trying to get to or be clear about is wether this was a normal death made suspicious due to the nature of the talk, or if there is actual evidence pointing to murder and use of sonic weaponary.
actually forget it i don't think people get it sometimes once they have already made up their minds |
Your not wasting your time Marky and I understand were your coming from. I dont believe NPT and DEW is the truth neither do I believe its false but I'm open minded enough to check it out and do my own research.
Thats considerably different to the gatekeeper and negative quest for 911 truth approach currently practiced on this site.
_________________
Pikey
Peace, truth, respect and a Mason free society
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RaH-lGafwtE#
www.wholetruthcoalition.org
www.truthforum.co.uk
www.checktheevidence.com
www.newhorizonsstannes.com
www.tpuc.org
www.cpexposed.com
www.thebcgroup.org.uk
www.fmotl.com |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Chat
Usergroups
Calendar
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
