Rachel from N.London on Alex Cox's Forum

[ian neal]

[Rachel]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/07/28/AR2005 072801991_pf.html


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8770417/site/newsweek/page/2/

I don't think you have done much research. Look at first and second generations of Pakistanis in the UK, look at barelwi islam and the new growth of radical wahhabi islam amongst youthful converts, look at the growth in atrocity videos and the new Bin-laden propoganda 'to fight jihad on behalf of the suffering ummah' - you have a lethal combination of disaffection, anger, little theological understanding, unemployment and machismo. Iraq and Afghanistam are radicalising factors.
To not accept that islamic militancy exists is quite mad. To not accept that some youths in the UK are supportive of it is bonkers.

I call it islamofacism as I have explained before, to distinguish it from Islam the authentic religion. Another way of describing it might be the extreme Islamic Right. I've asked for suggestions as to what you want to refer to it as - as long as it is not called Islam, since it is not truly Islamic, nor is fundementalsist Islam technically correct as a term either, I now think.

7th July was not the only plot, Crevice and 21st July were others and they werea) intercepted b) bombs did not explode. July 21st was a real plot, not copy cat - those bombs were real.

There is certainly evidence that Shan and Tanweer were linked to other groups of islamic militants, and had trained in pakistan together, but we will have to wait for the trial since to make the point could be prejudicial to the men getting a fair trial in either of the 2 trials that are pending. See David Leppard's reports for starters, and various M15 leaks to this effect, FFS, do a bit of research. It's all over the place, from multiple sources.

Or are you suggesting the whole world media and the survivors and the police are all ''in on it''? Yes, you probably are. And only you know 'the truth'? Hmmm?

*Sigh*

I have seen your so called anomalies - so far they seem to hang on the 7.40am train anomaly. I am sure they got an earlier train. Apart from that, I don't think there are any other glaring anomalies that make the whole multi-sourced information that is widely available into a pack of lies. YOUR insistence that is was a black ops - let's have some proof of that please...

I don't really see whay I should have to do all your research for you, it's all there in pretty much every news source int he world, take your pick...

Except I expect you will claim that none of that counts,

in which case, we're going round in circles as you are working form such as base of paranioa that it is pointless talkign to you, and I shall retire.

And to draw analogies with my contributions to debate in the face of extreme provocation and frequent personal insults, with the troll Ally, who has contributed nothing but baseless slurs is a bit much frankly.

[numeral]

[Rachel]

[brian]

Rachel chooses to cite that Independent article as evidence when in fact it is little more than unsourced character assassination.

What does Rachel make of reports such as this from the Guardian-



The clearest image of the man behind the 7 July bomb attack on a London bus has been released by police as part of a new appeal for information about his final movements.

--Detectives believe that Hussain had initially planned to board a Northern Line train but was unable to do so because of engineering work at King's Cross. Seemingly unsure of what to do and unfamiliar with the area, he wandered around aimlessly for more than an hour.

He is believed to have left King's Cross and walked towards Euston station, before boarding a bus which became caught up in the heavy traffic that followed the tube blasts. He then got off and boarded the No 30 bus heading south.-

http://www.guardian.co.uk/attackonlondon/story/0,,1583085,00.html

What are we being told here? That area of London is blanket covered with CCTV, a man with a large rucksack with the exact times known could be picked out in a few minutes maximum yet here we have still baffled police on OCTOBER 2.

There is far too much does not make sense let alone add up, a public inquiry is a necessity

[Sinclair]

[Rachel]

My duty?

I have done enough. And I certainly do not need to be told what my duty is by a bunch of armchair conspiracists.

So extremists took over the local youth club & bookshop, set up with public money.

So ex soldiers convert to islam. So extremist jihadi-soldier philospohy is picjked up by an ex soldier: not a surprsie - this philosophy is actively targeted at disaffected angry men. So some islamic extremists are white - hello, look at the convert in the newsnight clip I already posted. And are you suggesting Sam Lewthwaite went so far as to marry and have children with a man as part of an M15 sting??

So M15 want to take extremism on by hearts and minds stuff - they always do that, what are you expecting them to do?

They are not patsies, I suggest you go and talk to anyone from the saved sect, check their website, go do some research into disaffected islamic youths are saying. Don't patronise them by assuming they are dupes: this is real, real enough to die for in some cases.

[Sinclair]

Rachel wrote:

[Prole]

I must say that I get very fed up with the arrogance of the white middle-class voices that purport to understand what drives young British-born Muslim men into becoming alleged suicide bombers.

I prefer to hear THEIR voices:

[numeral]

[insidejob]

It has been said that the Peter Power terror drill that mirrored the 7/7 attack was a 'paper exercise'. Firstly, what does this mean? Secondly, how was it that the drill was able to shift to 'real time', as Power stated, if it was a paper exercise. And, thirdly, who were the two people in gas masks at the Paddington scene reported by the Evening Standard (see quote inbold near end of article)? Were they ordinary passengers who happened to have gas masks on them? Or was the witness seeing things?


http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4153/is_20050711/ai_n14719 918
IN THE MIDST OF DESTRUCTION, DRIVER WHO CALMLY LED 1,000 TO SAFETY
Evening Standard (London), Jul 11, 2005 by DICK MURRAY
A TUBE driver who helped lead 1,000 commuters to safety after one of the blasts has spoken of how he saw a "bright yellow glow" as the bomb went off in front of him.

Jeff Porter, 46, was driving a Circle line service at Edgware Road running alongside the train carrying the bomb which killed seven passengers.

Mr Porter - who safely got all the passengers off his train - said that had his train been a second or two earlier, it would have caught the full force of the blast "and twice as many people would have been killed".

Mr Porter, a driver with London Underground for 18 years, was approaching Edgware Road station from Paddington where - because of breakdowns on other parts of the network - he had picked up even more commuters than usual.

As he neared the station, the train carrying the bomb left the station heading in the opposite direction and approached Mr Porter's train in the double-width tunnel. The cab and the first carriage had passed by when the device, thought to contain about 10lbs of explosive, detonated halfway along the second carriage.

"I was just thinking which sandwich to buy in Marks Spencer and was slowing down for a signal, then I saw a bright yellow glow," said Mr Porter.


"I am the luckiest man alive."

As the blast tore along the tunnel and engulfed his cab, the toughened glass windscreen shattered when it was hit by a large piece of debris. He jammed on the emergency brake. "My first thought was that the other train had derailed and hit me," he said.

"After my windscreen shattered it was very quiet for a second.

Then I heard someone shout, 'Help me, help me'.

"I tried the radio, but there was no response. My passengers started banging on the door behind me. I opened it ... the carriage was full of smoke and dust.

"I told everyone to stay where they were. Nobody moved. They were remarkably calm. I went back in my cab and jumped down on to the track.

"I ran up the tunnel towards the station and shouted to uniformed staff, 'Quick, we need help.

Something bad has happened'.

"The track in front of my train was covered with all sorts of wreckage but there was a clear area on the far side of the tunnel.

"The staff were brilliant. They all came down to help without a second thought. Two other drivers ran back with me to my train.

"I went through the train telling everyone to keep calm, we would get everyone off as soon as possible but that there was an emergency situation."

Mr Porter said another of his colleagues had climbed aboard the bombed train and banged on Mr Porter's train window to attract attention. "He was saying, 'Jeff, this is really bad and we need big help'. He was saying there were people dead and dying. He was really distraught."

Mr Porter said he tried another telephone on his train, but still could not get through. "So I said to the guys, 'Go back and get help. It's bad. There are people dead'. When I looked at the bombed carriage there was nothing above the seats. I saw this big hole. That's when I knew it was an explosion.

"There were people screaming and crying. But my responsibility was to the passengers in my train. I am not a paramedic."

Mr Porter went back through his carriage to see if everyone was all right.

"The passengers were as good as gold, though their faces were black with the smoke. TWO GUYS HAD GAS MASKS ON, I DON'T KNOW WHERE THEY GOT THEM FROM.

"I kept using the public address system telling passengers that we were evacuating the train but that it was going to be a slow process. I asked them to remain calm and told them that we were not in danger, and that we would get everyone out as quickly as we could.

"I was moving back down the train telling people what was happening because personal presence is better than just a PA system. I was telling people to just sit down and read the newspaper" Mr Porter said he was helped by another man - possibly a passenger - and an unknown woman employee from South West Trains who was wearing a high-visibility jacket. They started to move people in groups towards the front of the train to be led to the station.

Mr Porter said he spotted a tramp who is well-known to staff because he often travels on the Circle line all day to keep warm.

"He was really good," said Mr Porter. "He was calming people.

There were a couple who were less mobile and he was helping them."

Mr Porter stayed on the train until everyone was off and then reported the all-clear to other rescue personnel. The whole episode took over an hour.

As he finally emerged at Edgware Road his mobile rang; it was his brother, Alan. Assuring him that he was safe, Mr Porter then called his wife Christine and their daughter Natasha, who is a District line driver and had been following the drama from Barking station.

Mr Porter, now on sick leave, does not know whether he will be able to face driving a train again.

"I don't know, I love driving but I will have to wait and see," he said.

He was prescribed tranquillisers by his doctor, but the prescription remains unused.

EDGWARE RD

1. At 8:50am bomb explodes on westbound Circle line train to Paddington 2.

Impact of explosion hits oncoming train, damaging first carriage 3. Driver Jeff Porter calls for calm and oversees evacuation of 1,000 passengers 150 yards to Edgware Station TOWARDS PADDINGTON

(c)2005. Associated Newspapers Ltd.. Provided by ProQuest Information and Learning Company. All rights Reserved.

insidejob

[numeral]

[Sinclair]

Rachel,

[Rachel]

You assume that my sole expertise lies in my proximity to the bombn and my contact with bereaved and survivors.

You assume wrong.

I have done a great deal of research since July 7th; the difference is, I do not start researching from the basis that everything is connected and everything is a conspiracy.

The 5 yes/no questions were not intended to be exhaustive, but to guage whether th epeople I was conversing with - the people who repeatedly call me a liar, a racist, a propogandist, a shill, an M15 double agent, COINTELPRO etc etc for pages and pages of a public bulletin board - are so bonkers that they do not accept that extreme right wing 'islamic' terror groups and cells and indeed, philosphies, exist.

Because if people cannot accept the existence of such groups and such a thing as right wang islamic jihadi groups, there is precious little point attempting to engage at all, other than to rebut libellous postings made on a public board about who I am, what i do, and what I believe.

[Sinclair]

[Rachel]

@Sinclair
I did not see the Oborne Dispatches, and I have yet to see the tape a friend did of it. I saw the following one about civil liberties which I was in braod agreement with. I am at work right now and printed out have read the intro to the Oborne CPS piece, which I broadly agree with and the first 5 pages of Oborne. I did read his shorter articles in the paper to publicise the programme so I have some familarity with what he says in the CPS document.

I agree, and have said for months (if not years) that the Prime Minister has spun terror, that his ill- thought through and hasty sabotaging of the debate 10 point terror plan before going on holiday and when Clarke was on holiday was disgraceful and that he is abusing the terror threat for political gain by feeding a tabloid agenda, which the papers lap up as it sells papers. I agree that the non existent Ricin and Old Trafford threats were mendaciously hyped and sold newspapers but were not based on fact.This does not however mean that ALL terrorist plots are lies. The tabloids hype things: we 'get' that.The Freddie Starr ate my hamster story was *, as was the Beckham kidnap plot, but we all know that and nobody has leapt from that to ''everything is a lie! I am like Neo in the Matrix!'' except conspiracy theorists

I have not had time to read the rest of the document in full and will do so later tonight; however, I will point out at this stage that whilst the Blair administration have attempted to make political capital out of terror, and that they have, by means of the illegal invasion of Iraq and the bombing of Afghanistan, the support of the Bush administration and its disastrous foreign policy agenda contributed to the sense of grievances felt by many Muslims I do not accept that they went a stage further and actively bombed the trains and the bus on July 7th.

I believe that the sense of grievance felt by many Muslims is real and that this grievance can, and does, in some cases, boil over into calls for an armed jihad struggle with young men going to fight abroad, or to bring the ''war'' onto the streets and subways of the UK. I believe that there is a fantaical agenda and an extreme political jihadi philosophy that exploits the rage felt by young men and in some cases incites them to terror. Not all, not many, but some. To distinguish this philosophy from Islam, I have used the term islamofacism or Extreme Right Wing Political islamism. If you other suggestions for a term please suggest them

I believe a different foreign policy would have avoided this current situation and terror threat, and that the threat now faced is partly of Bush and Blair's own making; moreover I believe that the draconian anti-civil liberties and surveillance laws that they hope to pass are not only unneccessary, but play into the agenda of the extremists. A different approach is needed.

I have blogged about all this for months so these views should not be a surprise to anyone. It is of course for , generally perfectly possible for me, many Muslims, and for many people generally to be against the Iraq war, against the trashing of civil liberties and to be extremely angry with the current Bush and Blair administration without condoning terror in any way. This should be utterly obvious to anyone with a modicum of intelligence. It should also be obvious to assess that there is a real anger, and that some act upon this anger, and use it to justify a poisonous and bigoted political extremist set of beliefs that logically culminate in mass murder.

M15 and M16 are struggling to contend with the new threat, which is that they are not up against the type of terrorists they were up against before, but disaffected self-started cells of ordinary young men who have been radicalised largely by our foreign policies as well as other factors which I will not go into here ans there isn't time ( maybe later) and who consider it their duty to fight in a jihad to protect and ''avenge'' the sufferring of their Muslim brothers and sisters ( Ummah) . It is a nigh-impossible task to track radical young men and to ascertain which ones are full of hot air and which are serious, and raises troubling questions about surveillance of everyone with a grievance against the government. Perhaps one day they will come and get me, I criticise them enough! I wish the Governemtn would pull back from this path and behave more like the Govvernment I voted for, the Labour party I supported for 14 years.

M15/6 have in fact been thwarted by the fact that the Government have an agenda to hype terror and the Bush administration even more so. I do not believe that they are agent provocateurs and actively encourage terror, if that is what you are implying? They are struggling enough as it is without making or radicalising more people!

M15 and M16 do leak to the media, I believe to spread blame if they are seen to have cocked up ( like when they let 2 of the July 7th bombers go and ceased surveillance of them) or to lobby for more funding. They do not I believe generally act as a PR or spin service for the PM or the Home Office. Scarlett is indeed close to Blair and helped out under pressure with the ''dodgy dossier'' but it is a huge leap to go from that to inferring that M16 and M15 publish fictional accounts of non existent terrorist threats and indeed stage manage mass murder of people for some sinister agenda. Just because there have been a few false flag operations does nto mean everything is a false flag. Just because one Alsatian bit you does not mean all Alsatians bite. A spot of basic logic and a deep breath might come in helpful if one feels oneself getting into a lather and beleiving that everything is a Bologna or everything is a Ricin media hype.



It should also not be a surprise that many reporters and readers see M15 and M16 as a good source of exciting stories and are a little awstruck by the mysterious ''James Bond world'' of the security services. As can be demonstrated by David Shayler now making a career out of going round doing lectures on the subject.

Surveillance of a threat naturally involves informers and infiltration: see the case of Reda Hassaine, an Algerian journalist, was paid £300 a month by MI5 to inform on goings on at the Finsbury park Mosque. M15 tend to have a different policy from what I understand to the US intelligence services; that of monitoring plotters and gathering information, and letting it run, only arresting if it seems necessary because an atrocity is about to happen. Keeping a close watch, building up a bigger picture. This policy (and possibly a lack of funding) , contributed to Khan and Tanweer, who were monitored for 2 months in spring 2004, being let go and deemed not a serious threat - with catastrohic results on July 7th. There is also indications that arrests made by the US for political gain comprom ised an M15 sting operation, meaning that M15 had to spring one trap early and then arrrest 13 people who they later had to release for lack of evidence.With friends like the US administration, who needs enemies?

This does not however in my opinion justify the unbeleivably weakly-justified and so far, evidence-free assertion theory that M15 and M16 or any one other than the named bombers were responsible for the attacks on July 7th. I think this conspiracy theory is a step much too far into fantasy, and it is a shame that people run with it, since it distracts from the real problem which is the spinning of the war of terror for political gain and the refusal to face up to the fact that the foreign policies, especially the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan and th esuppirt of the US which in turn supports oppressive policies against the Palestinians.

[Rachel]

[Rachel]

[insidejob]

The media says that the 7/7 bombers went to extremist Islamist Madrassas in Pakistan. What they don’t say is that Madrassas are run by Pakistan intelligence and they were given support by the CIA.

The Independent article suggests that Tanweer met the killer of reporter Daniel Pearl, Saeed Sheikh. Yet, Sheikh works for Pakistan intelligence.

The argument that UK Muslim anger at Western policy in the Middle East led to 7/7 does not add up. One could argue that many are angry but only a few would vent that anger through extremist ideology and murder. But what we’re supposed to believe is that:
- many UK Muslims were angry but were not duped by extremist ideology;
- this anger did not lead to many small acts of violent disorder or criminality;
- it did lead to four people who were trained and duped by extremist ideology and became expert in undercover activities and perfectly executed their first terror operation and killed themselves and others whilst doing so;
- there has been no further criminal terrorism or small acts of violent disorder by these angry Muslims or duped extremists;
- and despite the international scope of the terror threat, there has been no large attacks on any UK facilities abroad (excluding Iraq).

So, there are Muslims inside and outside the UK who are mad enough to kill themselves and British people but they are only mad enough to do it once.


http://www.globalterrorism101.com/SouthAsia2002IntelligenceReview.html
World Conflict Quarterly

News, Analysis and Articles on Terrorists & Terrorism
Islamist extremism has been used by Pakistan, as an instrument of state policy, since the 1980s, to further the country's foreign policy goals vis-à-vis Afghanistan and India, and its quest for 'strategic depth'. The Pakistani state and the Taliban have been co-sponsors of a terrorist network that essentially relies on madrassas (seminaries) and terrorist training camps located in Pakistan and (previously) in Afghanistan. There are an estimated over one million students studying in more than 10, 000 madrassas (some private estimates place their number between 40,000 and 50,000), with militant Islam as their core syllabus.

There is, at present, little evidence to suggest that Pakistan has abandoned, or even diluted, its strategy of using Islamist extremism as an instrument of state policy. The Indian State of Jammu and Kashmir remains the prime target of this strategy, and of the activities of Pakistan-based Islamist terrorist groups.


Cooperative Research has created a 911 timeline using published, mainly media, sources
http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/timeline.jsp?timeline=complete_911_ timeline&geopolitics_and_9/11=isi
March 1985: US Escalates War in Afghanistan
Osama bin Laden in 1989.
Tens of thousands more will study in the hundreds of new madrassas funded by the ISI and CIA in Pakistan. Their main logistical base is in the Pakistani city of Peshawar. [The Hindu, 9/27/01; Washington Post, 7/19/92; Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, 9/23/01; Honolulu Star-Bulletin, 9/23/01] In the late 1980s, Pakistani President Benazir Bhutto, feeling the mujahedeen network has grown too strong, tells President MFEMFE H. W. Bush, “You are creating a Frankenstein.” However, the warning goes unheeded. [Newsweek, 9/24/01] By 1993, President Bhutto tells Egyptian President Hasni Mubarak that Peshawar is under de facto control of the mujahedeen, and unsuccessfully asks for military help in reasserting Pakistani control over the city. Thousands of mujahedeen fighters return to their home countries after the war is over and engage in multiple acts of violence. One Western diplomat notes these thousands would never have been trained or united without US help, and says, “The consequences for all of us are astronomical.” [Atlantic Monthly, 5/96]


http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/essay.jsp?article=saeedsheikh
9/11 Paymaster Saeed Sheikh
By Paul Thompson
June 1993-October 1994: Saeed Sheikh, a brilliant British student at the London School of Economics, drops out of school and moves to his homeland of Pakistan to become a terrorist. Two months later, he begins training in Afghanistan at camps run by al-Qaeda and the Pakistani army. By mid-1994, he has become a terrorist instructor. In June 1994, he begins kidnapping Western tourists in India. In October 1994, he is captured after kidnapping three Britons and an American, and is put in a maximum-security prison (see November 1994-December 1999). The ISI pays for a lawyer to defend him. [Los Angeles Times, 2/9/02, Daily Mail, 7/16/02, Vanity Fair, 8/02] His supervisor for his terror work is an ISI officer named Ijaz Shah (see February 5, 2002). [Times of India, 3/12/02, Guardian, 7/16/02] Al-Qaeda and the ISI later rescue him from prison (see December 24-31, 1999) and he becomes a central figure in the financing of the 9/11 plot (see Early August 2001 (D)).

1999 (J): The London Times later claims that British intelligence secretly offers 9/11 paymaster Saeed Sheikh, imprisoned in India (see November 1994-December 1999) for kidnapping Britons and Americans (see June 1993-October 1994), an amnesty and the ability to "live in London a free man" if he will reveal his links to al-Qaeda. He apparently refuses. [Daily Mail, 7/16/02, London Times, 7/16/02] Yet after he is rescued in a hostage swap deal (see December 24-31, 1999), the press reports that he, in fact, is freely able to return to Britain. [Press Trust of India, 1/3/00] He visits his parents there in 2000 and again in early 2001. [Vanity Fair, 8/02, BBC, 7/16/02, Telegraph, 7/16/02] He is not charged with kidnapping until well after 9/11 (see November 2001-February 5, 2002). Those kidnapped by Saeed call the government's decision not to try him a "disgrace" and "scandalous." [Press Trust of India, 1/3/00] The Pittsburgh Tribune-Review later suggests that not only is Saeed closely tied to both the ISI and al-Qaeda, but may also have been working for the CIA: "There are many in Musharraf's government who believe that Saeed Sheikh's power comes not from the ISI, but from his connections with our own CIA. The theory is that ... Saeed Sheikh was bought and paid for." [Pittsburgh Tribune-Review, 3/3/02] Did or does Saeed have some kind of deal with British or US intelligence?

Daniel Pearl.
January 6, 2002: The Boston Globe reports that shoe bomber Richard Reid (see December 22, 2001 (B)) may have had ties with an obscure Pakistani group called Al-Fuqra. Reid apparently visited the Lahore, Pakistan home of Ali Gilani, the leader of Al-Fuqra. [Boston Globe, 1/6/02] Reporter Daniel Pearl reads the article, and decides to investigate (see also December 24, 2001-January 23, 2002). [Vanity Fair, 8/02] Pearl believes he is on his way to interview Gilani when he is kidnapped (see January 23, 2002). [Pittsburgh Tribune-Review, 3/3/02] A 1995 State Department report said Al-Fuqra's main goal is "purifying Islam through violence." [Vanity Fair, 8/02] Intelligence experts say it is a splinter group of Jaish-e-Mohammad, and has ties to al-Qaeda. [UPI, 1/29/02] Al-Fuqra claims close ties with the Muslims of the Americas, a US tax-exempt group claiming about 3,000 members living in rural compounds in 19 states, the Caribbean and Europe. Members of Al-Fuqra are suspected of at least 13 fire bombings and 17 murders, as well as theft and credit-card fraud. Gilani had links to people involved in the 1993 WTC bombing, and he fled the US after the bombing. Gilani admits he works with the ISI and lives freely in Pakistan. [Boston Globe, 1/6/02, The News, 2/15/02, Pittsburgh Tribune-Review, 3/3/02, Vanity Fair, 8/02] Saeed Sheikh "has long had close contacts" with the group, and praises Gilani for his "unexplained services to Pakistan and Islam." [The News, 2/18/02, Pittsburgh Tribune-Review, 3/3/02] There has been surprisingly little media coverage of Al-Fuqra, given their US presence and al-Qaeda connection (see also [Knight Ridder, 12/25/01, New York Times, 1/3/02, New York Post, 2/10/02, Rocky Mountain News, 2/12/02]).

February 5, 2002: Pakistani police, with the help of the FBI, determine Saeed Sheikh is behind the kidnapping of Daniel Pearl (see January 23, 2002), but are unable to find him. They round up about ten of his relatives and threaten to harm them unless he turns himself in. Saeed Sheikh does turn himself in, but to Ijaz Shah, his former ISI boss (see June 1993-October 1994). [Boston Globe, 2/7/02, Vanity Fair, 8/02] The ISI holds Saeed for a week, but fails to tell Pakistani police or anyone else that they have him (see February 12, 2002). This "missing week" is the cause of much speculation. The ISI never tells Pakistani police any details about this week. [Newsweek, 3/11/02] Saeed also later refuses to discuss the week or his connection to the ISI, only saying, "I will not discuss this subject. I do not want my family to be killed." He adds, "I know people in the government and they know me and my work." [Newsweek, 3/13/02, Vanity Fair, 8/02] It is suggested Saeed is held for this week to make sure that Pearl was killed. Saeed later says that during this week he got a coded message from the kidnappers that Pearl had been murdered. Also, the time might have been spent working out a deal with the ISI over what Saeed would tell police and the public. [Newsweek, 3/11/02] Several others with both extensive ISI and al-Qaeda ties wanted for the kidnapping are arrested around this time. [Washington Post, 2/23/02, London Times, 2/25/02] One of these men, Khalid Khawaja, "has never hidden his links with Osama bin Laden. At one time he used to fly Osama's personal plane." [PakNews, 2/11/02]

April 5, 2002: Later in the month the London Times says that the real truth about Saeed won't come out in the trial because, "Sheikh is no ordinary terrorist but a man who has connections that reach high into Pakistan's military and intelligence elite and into the innermost circles of Osama Bin Laden and the al-Qaeda organization." [London Times, 4/21/02]

insidejob

[Annie]

Hi Rachel
It was a pleasure to meet you last night at the London 911 Truth Campaign event.
For obvious reasons, those who realise that the official version of 911 does not stand up to any impartial scrutiny are also curious about the events of 7/7, especially as there is, to date, no official account of what happened that day. All that the British public has to go on is a series of leaks (both official and unofficial) to members of our esteemed national press. That these leaks are contradictory and often made to hacks with a reputation for acting as MI5/6 conduits adds to the public’s appetite for a full enquiry. However, post Hutton and Butler, I’m not sure quite how such a report would be received.
Concerns are justified about the spies’ role in promoting terrorism, lying to government about their mistakes, or turning a blind eye to illegal acts. In only five years working for MI5, David Shayler saw innumerable examples of these activities within the intelligence agencies. Also, evidence has subsequently emerged from MI6 that there was indeed an attempt to assassinate Gaddafi by funding Islamic extremist terrorists in Libya. It has also been established through the Stevens enquiry that the British intelligence officers promoted atrocities in Northern Ireland.
As you say “Just because there have been a few false flag operations does not mean everything is a false flag. Just because one Alsatian bit you does not mean all Alsatians bite.” Yes, to a certain extent. However, if these agencies are never held to account for their actions and continue to get away with illegal acts, there is no incentive for change. MI5 and MI6 are closed, secretive and self-referential organisations. As such, they are self-perpetuating oligarchies and will never reform without outside pressure.
For the record, David Shayler has not “made a career” out of lecturing about MI5. In fact, he’s had damn little career since he turned his back on a lucrative job and blew the whistle on the agencies nine years ago. He attends events like last night gratis because he feels passionately that the truth needs to be told, change can be effected, and we can all sleep more safely in our beds at night.
We are all seekers after the truth. I’m sure that the 911 Truth Campaign would be interested to hear your personal experience and analysis on the events of 7/7, if you would feel able to come to one of our meetings and talk us through it. One thing we don’t want to do is run off down a series of blind alleys!
By the way, what are your views on 911 itself? Have you seen any of the DVDs/ read the books questioning the official version?

Regards

Annie Machon
Secretary
911 Truth Campaign (Britain and Ireland)

[alkmyst]

The only Al Qaeda terror cell to have been caught anywhere in the world .......... were Mossad agents arrested by the Palestinian Authority for attempting to set up phony 'al Qaeda' cells in the Gaza Strip!

Full story at: www.whatreallyhappened.com/fakealqaeda.html

Anyone who doubts the extreme philosophy and practices of Mossad (Motto: By Way of Deception Thou Shalt Do War) should read the 1990 bestseller titled: 'By Way of Deception' written by Victor Ostrovsky and Claire Hoy.

Another excellent source is 'Ben-Gurion's Spy' by Shabtai Teveth

Al K Myst

[Prole]

[Sinclair]

[Techybloke666]

[numeral]

[Prole]

From Rachel's blog today http://rachelnorthlondon.blogspot.com/

[Rachel]

[Pikey]

Well done Annie, IMO you've made a great start to your challenging position of Secretary of the 911 Truth campaign (Britain & Ireland).

I have been following this thread which at times has broken my heart when I have read the personal attacks and insults, they achieve nothing,
which IMO is the outcome the powers that be wish to see in order to maintain the status quo.

Is this the first positive sign of a working together for the common cause Rachel ?...............an independent enquiry into 911 as well as 7/7........an entente cordial?

I do hope so.

Peace & truth

[Pikey]

Hi Rachel,

I would be interested to read what you have to say about the "David Shayler google video" thread on this website forum (i.e the official 911 truth campaign (Britain & Ireland) presentation.

Peace & truth

[Sinclair]