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markwm
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Joined: 28 Nov 2006
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 Posted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 9:40 pm Post subject: New pentagon video? |
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http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=a64559be87
Sorry if posted elsewhere but I've not seen it. Video from the hotel, anyone got a link to a better version?
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markwm
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telecasterisation
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| Posted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 10:39 pm Post subject: |
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This poses me something of a dilemma.
I am as keen as the next man/person to see the truth about 9/11 revealed to the world (whatever that truth may be).
Given the way that we continually moan about the 'confiscated tapes' (still over 80 being held) and apparently none show anything worthy of note, this being a pristine example. Even if they do show something, we ain't gonna see them.
Where exactly does this leave us?
There are very few avenues left down which real in your face 'proof' can possibly exist. Yes it is just my view, but unless someone comes forward who was actively involved, I can see no way forward. Spreading the word is one thing, but it just doesn't seem enough.
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Dogsmilk
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Joined: 06 Oct 2006
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| Posted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 11:46 pm Post subject: |
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These security cameras appear to be so rubbish, one wonders why they even bother having then. They should at least get them from the same people who supply UK retailers - the pics you get on Crimewatch at least give you a rough idea of what's going on.
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tfayaz
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Joined: 21 Aug 2006
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| Posted: Tue Dec 05, 2006 10:30 am Post subject: |
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This is complete rubbish! There was no media coverage and it still doesn't show anything that is worth looking at.
They really need to release the Sheraton video if they want to end all doubt. Problem is, the doubt isn't on our side, it's on theirs!
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telecasterisation
Banned
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| Posted: Tue Dec 05, 2006 10:34 am Post subject: |
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| tfayaz wrote: | This is complete rubbish! There was no media coverage and it still doesn't show anything that is worth looking at.
They really need to release the Sheraton video if they want to end all doubt. Problem is, the doubt isn't on our side, it's on theirs! |
Why will the Sheraton video prove anything? Have you checked the angles? At best there will be an explosion in the distance seen above the annex roof.
You will never see footage that will compromise the official story - ever.
Forget Pentagon footage.
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tfayaz
Trustworthy Freedom Fighter
Joined: 21 Aug 2006
Posts: 102
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| Posted: Tue Dec 05, 2006 11:08 am Post subject: |
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| telecasterisation wrote: | | tfayaz wrote: | This is complete rubbish! There was no media coverage and it still doesn't show anything that is worth looking at.
They really need to release the Sheraton video if they want to end all doubt. Problem is, the doubt isn't on our side, it's on theirs! |
Have you checked the angles? |
Yes, I didn't just base my comment on hearsay.
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telecasterisation
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| Posted: Tue Dec 05, 2006 11:29 am Post subject: |
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| tfayaz wrote: | | telecasterisation wrote: | | tfayaz wrote: | This is complete rubbish! There was no media coverage and it still doesn't show anything that is worth looking at.
They really need to release the Sheraton video if they want to end all doubt. Problem is, the doubt isn't on our side, it's on theirs! |
Have you checked the angles? |
Yes, I didn't just base my comment on hearsay. |
With the greatest respect, you have avoided the question I posed in favour of playing the indignant card and selective quoting.
I asked;
| Quote: | | Why will the Sheraton video prove anything? |
You deliberately masked your response in rhetoric. Have another go.
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tfayaz
Trustworthy Freedom Fighter
Joined: 21 Aug 2006
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| Posted: Tue Dec 05, 2006 11:55 am Post subject: |
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| telecasterisation wrote: | | tfayaz wrote: | | telecasterisation wrote: | | tfayaz wrote: | This is complete rubbish! There was no media coverage and it still doesn't show anything that is worth looking at.
They really need to release the Sheraton video if they want to end all doubt. Problem is, the doubt isn't on our side, it's on theirs! |
Have you checked the angles? |
Yes, I didn't just base my comment on hearsay. |
With the greatest respect, you have avoided the question I posed in favour of playing the indignant card and selective quoting.
I asked;
| Quote: | | Why will the Sheraton video prove anything? |
You deliberately masked your response in rhetoric. Have another go. |
With the greatest respect, I think had you read the answer to my first question, the second one would've been quite obvious.
I have checked the angles, therefore the Sheraton video will once and for all prove that there either was or wasn't a plane that hit the Pentagon.
Either way, I think this is the end of our discussion, unless of course there is going to be further criticism coming my way.
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telecasterisation
Banned
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| Posted: Tue Dec 05, 2006 1:07 pm Post subject: |
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tfayaz wrote;
| Quote: | I have checked the angles, therefore the Sheraton video will once and for all prove that there either was or wasn't a plane that hit the Pentagon.
Either way, I think this is the end of our discussion, unless of course there is going to be further criticism coming my way. |
You were criticized for avoiding the question I asked - your original post said;
| Quote: | | They really need to release the Sheraton video if they want to end all doubt. |
I asked why? You waffled.
I will detail the questions so as to not confuse you further;
1). How do you know the Sheraton had a working camera trained on The Pentagon?
2). Why would the Sheraton have a camera trained on The Pentagon?
3). The object that hit The Pentagon was supposedly travelling at @ 500mph. Assuming the Sheraton had a camera trained on the flight path as opposed to The Pentagon - how will it record a recognisable object crossing right to left in a tiny field of view at such a speed - bearing in mind what we have seen thus far from the released footage?
4). The FBI denies any Sheraton footage exists - don't you know this?
Your statement...
| Quote: | | ...therefore the Sheraton video will once and for all prove... |
...is baseless and assumptive.
Over to you - (consider it criticism if it helps you supply answers).
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tfayaz
Trustworthy Freedom Fighter
Joined: 21 Aug 2006
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| Posted: Tue Dec 05, 2006 2:03 pm Post subject: |
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| telecasterisation wrote: | tfayaz wrote;
| Quote: | I have checked the angles, therefore the Sheraton video will once and for all prove that there either was or wasn't a plane that hit the Pentagon.
Either way, I think this is the end of our discussion, unless of course there is going to be further criticism coming my way. |
You were criticized for avoiding the question I asked - your original post said;
| Quote: | | They really need to release the Sheraton video if they want to end all doubt. |
I asked why? You waffled. |
Erm, no. As I said in my previous message, the first answer automatically answered the second one. I'm sorry you didn't quite understand that.
| Quote: | I will detail the questions so as to not confuse you further;
1). How do you know the Sheraton had a working camera trained on The Pentagon?
2). Why would the Sheraton have a camera trained on The Pentagon? |
Freedom of Information, and I don't think it was quite trained on the Pentagon, more that it was covering a general area.
| Quote: | | 3). The object that hit The Pentagon was supposedly travelling at @ 500mph. Assuming the Sheraton had a camera trained on the flight path as opposed to The Pentagon - how will it record a recognisable object crossing right to left in a tiny field of view at such a speed - bearing in mind what we have seen thus far from the released footage? |
Whether or not it does, the main thing I'm looking for is that it was NOT a 757 that hit the Pentagon! I'm sure we're able to distinguish a 757 from a cruise missile or whatever else.
| Quote: | | 4). The FBI denies any Sheraton footage exists - don't you know this? |
And you believe them?
| Quote: | Your statement...
| Quote: | | ...therefore the Sheraton video will once and for all prove... |
...is baseless and assumptive. |
You'll find that it's not, depending on which Sheraton one they release, if any.
I hope that's answered all your questions. Should you want to discuss this any further, please PM me.
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telecasterisation
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| Posted: Tue Dec 05, 2006 3:39 pm Post subject: |
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tfayaz responded;
| Quote: | | Freedom of Information, and I don't think it was quite trained on the Pentagon, more that it was covering a general area. |
Supply your source for this concerning Freedom of Information and how it relates to my question?
| Quote: | | Whether or not it does, the main thing I'm looking for is that it was NOT a 757 that hit the Pentagon! I'm sure we're able to distinguish a 757 from a cruise missile or whatever else. |
I'm sure we're able to distinguish a 757 from a cruise missile? How are you 'sure' - we've already had footage of the 'object' taken from a lot closer than the Sheraton is - and it showed us a blob. Again assumptive.
| Quote: | | And you believe them? |
It doesn't matter if I believe them or not - if they say it doesn't exist - we don't get to see it - game over. What they say is more important to the production of the tape than what I believe. They hold all the cards.
| Quote: | | You'll find that it's not, depending on which Sheraton one they release, if any. |
You again assume there is a Sheraton tape to be released.
http://www.infowars.net/articles/november2006/031106Doubletree.htm
States;
The FBI says, however, that there is no Sheraton video in existence.
As for;
| Quote: | | Should you want to discuss this any further, please PM me. |
It is my belief that using PM is the equivalent of passing notes under the desk in school to avoid teacher – I don’t engage in such pursuits for open debate subjects. If you want to duck out at this juncture – I fully understand your reasons.
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tfayaz
Trustworthy Freedom Fighter
Joined: 21 Aug 2006
Posts: 102
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| Posted: Tue Dec 05, 2006 4:04 pm Post subject: |
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| telecasterisation wrote: |
It is my belief that using PM is the equivalent of passing notes under the desk in school to avoid teacher – I don’t engage in such pursuits for open debate subjects. If you want to duck out at this juncture – I fully understand your reasons. |
Right, fine - I'll "duck" from this conversation because you're just as much interested in throwing smart little remarks about me as you are interested in the topic of conversation.
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James C
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Posts: 1046
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| Posted: Tue Dec 05, 2006 5:00 pm Post subject: |
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I find it hard to tell what I'm looking at with any great certainty. I don't think it proves anything either way and this is not a pristine example as has been suggested!
Having looked at Google Maps, the camera angle is correct for this location but the image is too blurred and that weird black rectangular area makes things hard to determine.
I'm interested in what is happening to the white object at roof level as it moves from left to right. It looked at first like a tail fin that disappears into the building but after looking at the clip again and again, the white object appears to travel across the top of the pentagon continuing to the right beyond the explosion. Hard to tell though.
A pretty inconclusive video clip especially as the facade that was hit is on the other side to the one we see (or don't see very well).
If there is a video from The Sheraton and it is of reasonable quality then it would be good to see since it would help to determine from long range the scale of the aircraft. A 757 is quite different in size to a missile, military jet or private lear type plane.
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Woodee
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Joined: 08 Sep 2006
Posts: 159
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| Posted: Tue Dec 05, 2006 11:11 pm Post subject: |
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I still reckon this video is too blurry to be real security footage. If I was paid to supply CCTV footage for a hotel, and that was the image quality? I would sack myself!!
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Serge
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| Posted: Thu Dec 07, 2006 11:48 pm Post subject: |
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I am amazed at you all here. Not once has anyone noticed the sudden appearance of a tree, which was never outside the hotel park in the first place. It has been photoshopped into the video. The tree is floating in the air.
Tele'; you are being rather naive. A mere visit to pilots for truth website, will answer all your questions. You are misinformed judging by your posts. 
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Serge
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Posts: 188
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| Posted: Thu Dec 07, 2006 11:50 pm Post subject: |
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| James C wrote: | I find it hard to tell what I'm looking at with any great certainty. I don't think it proves anything either way and this is not a pristine example as has been suggested!
Having looked at Google Maps, the camera angle is correct for this location but the image is too blurred and that weird black rectangular area makes things hard to determine.
I'm interested in what is happening to the white object at roof level as it moves from left to right. It looked at first like a tail fin that disappears into the building but after looking at the clip again and again, the white object appears to travel across the top of the pentagon continuing to the right beyond the explosion. Hard to tell though.
A pretty inconclusive video clip especially as the facade that was hit is on the other side to the one we see (or don't see very well).
If there is a video from The Sheraton and it is of reasonable quality then it would be good to see since it would help to determine from long range the scale of the aircraft. A 757 is quite different in size to a missile, military jet or private lear type plane. |
The white object you refer to is in fact a car overtaking that lorry. I thought it was a tail fin at first, but on closer inspection, it was found to be a car.
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Disco_Destroyer
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Fallious
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| Posted: Fri Dec 08, 2006 10:55 am Post subject: |
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| Amazingly fake.
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Disco_Destroyer
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| Posted: Fri Dec 08, 2006 11:02 am Post subject: |
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If that is to be viewed at real time (standard broadcasting capture) that is one fast craft as video captures at 30 frames a sec I think so that would be a complete seqence of 0.13 sec and if we knew the distance from the road to the building (across the green) we could work out the speed their presumed jumbo was supposed to be flying!! 
Video capture for broadcasting info here:- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NTSC
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Last edited by Disco_Destroyer on Fri Dec 08, 2006 11:18 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Fallious
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| Posted: Fri Dec 08, 2006 11:11 am Post subject: |
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Roughly. Just worth noting that it doesnt follow the established path either.. Anyway it's fake.. just for amusement 
Last edited by Fallious on Fri Dec 08, 2006 11:13 am; edited 1 time in total |
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telecasterisation
Banned
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Posts: 1873
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| Posted: Fri Dec 08, 2006 11:11 am Post subject: |
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| Serge wrote: | I am amazed at you all here. Not once has anyone noticed the sudden appearance of a tree, which was never outside the hotel park in the first place. It has been photoshopped into the video. The tree is floating in the air.
Tele'; you are being rather naive. A mere visit to pilots for truth website, will answer all your questions. You are misinformed judging by your posts. |
Which aspects are misinformation exactly?
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I completely challenge the official version of events - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC -I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC |
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Disco_Destroyer
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| Posted: Fri Dec 08, 2006 11:42 am Post subject: |
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If that is what they say it is why is there traffic traveling along what I guess is the roofline, and for such a dramatic event why no vehicle slows down  Maybe a trip to the hotel is in order to stand on the forcourt and have a see what can be seen, after all Bill Hicks says you can't see much from the 'Eagles Nest'
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'Come and see the violence inherent in the system.
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Serge
Moderate Poster
Joined: 13 Aug 2006
Posts: 188
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| Posted: Sat Dec 09, 2006 1:44 am Post subject: |
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| telecasterisation wrote: | | Serge wrote: | I am amazed at you all here. Not once has anyone noticed the sudden appearance of a tree, which was never outside the hotel park in the first place. It has been photoshopped into the video. The tree is floating in the air.
Tele'; you are being rather naive. A mere visit to pilots for truth website, will answer all your questions. You are misinformed judging by your posts. |
Which aspects are misinformation exactly? |
As it turns out, the video has now been debunked. It is a total fake and the time this video was taken was after 11am, and certainly not 911.
The highway at time of missile hitting the pentagon would normally have been nose to tail in traffic. As confirmed by the many people who live and drive to work everyday past the pentagon.
On a point of misinfo, you say the FBI claims no sheraton video, you believe that. In fact, the FBI is lying. In many words, you accept the FBI's word and are pushing it.
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telecasterisation
Banned
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| Posted: Sat Dec 09, 2006 10:53 am Post subject: |
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Serge wrote;
| Quote: | As it turns out, the video has now been debunked. It is a total fake and the time this video was taken was after 11am, and certainly not 911.
The highway at time of missile hitting the pentagon would normally have been nose to tail in traffic. As confirmed by the many people who live and drive to work everyday past the pentagon.
On a point of misinfo, you say the FBI claims no sheraton video, you believe that. In fact, the FBI is lying. In many words, you accept the FBI's word and are pushing it. |
I have already clearly stated earlier in the thread, it matters not what I believe or what really exists - the world will never see a video of anything other than 'nothing' hitting The Pentagon (an explosion that appears over a wall), or manipulated video designed to fool. To even contemplate that the FBI/Government will sheepishly hand over a tape containing anything remotely incriminating is the belief of delusional herberts.
Why would anyone hand over a tape that would essentially bring an administration to its knees - a video of something other than a plane hitting The Pentagon would automatically mean all the people were killed on the plane/s, every aspect of 9/11 fabricated. Potentially all law and order would breakdown, rioting, complete anarchy. The impact to the world would be immeasurable , the London bombings would be questioned, who knows were it would culminate?
This would be allowed just because a 'request' has been put and they 'have' to hand the tapes over?
There are many sites that state the FBI claims there is no Sheraton footage, I searched and here is the first in the list;
http://www.infowars.net/articles/november2006/031106Doubletree.htm
It says about halfway down under the comparison of the relative positions of Pentagon and Sheraton;
‘The FBI says, however, that there is no Sheraton video in existence. So which is it to be? Does a hotel video capture the impact or doesn't it? Was Gertz simply making his story up about the hotel staff seeing the video? And if the FBI is telling the truth about the Sheraton Hotel then why did the Sheraton, a major building in the area, not have any cameras in operation?’
You are saying that the latest video is faked - well if this is the case - where did it originate? Was it the FBI? If so, there is a representation of what you can expect from every video you will ever see regarding The Pentagon. Perhaps the FBI have come forward to say it wasn't them that released it?
I for one, refuse to play 'The Pentagon Game', waiting for each of 80+ tapes to be incrementally released, minutely picked over and debunked in turn.
I reiterate, it matters not what I believe, you can label it 'misinfo' and get all bent out of shape as a result, but if people don't want you seeing something, you ain't gonna see it. The Pentagon tapes will never show you anything.
_________________
I completely challenge the official version of events - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC -I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC |
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