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jackchit
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 Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 12:39 pm Post subject: Skeptical of FDR data |
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I have asked this question over at LC forums and had no answer even though Rob Balsamo posted in the same thread, I don't want to ask at PFT as I wouldn't to get my computer dirty.
I have noticed many who have been involved with ths FDR stuff over here so maybe i can finally get my answer.
Look at this file....
http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/GenPDF.asp?id=DCA01MA064&rpt=fa
Thats the NTSB report on flight 77 it clearly states that "any material generated by the NTSB is under control of the FBI".
So then how is it possible the FDR data to be released by the NTSB when it was under the control of the FBI?
Unless the FBI saw this as a massive red herring that would keep some researchers busy for months on end and instructed the NTSB to release flight data that could have been generated in a simulator.
I have no doubt the researchers took this in good faith and did aquire it from the NTSB but something just doesn't smell right.
Thank you.
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jackchit
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Serge
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Joined: 13 Aug 2006
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| Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 10:29 pm Post subject: Re: Skeptical of FDR data |
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| jackchit wrote: | I have asked this question over at LC forums and had no answer even though Rob Balsamo posted in the same thread, I don't want to ask at PFT as I wouldn't to get my computer dirty.
I have noticed many who have been involved with ths FDR stuff over here so maybe i can finally get my answer.
Look at this file....
http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/GenPDF.asp?id=DCA01MA064&rpt=fa
Thats the NTSB report on flight 77 it clearly states that "any material generated by the NTSB is under control of the FBI".
So then how is it possible the FDR data to be released by the NTSB when it was under the control of the FBI?
Unless the FBI saw this as a massive red herring that would keep some researchers busy for months on end and instructed the NTSB to release flight data that could have been generated in a simulator.
I have no doubt the researchers took this in good faith and did aquire it from the NTSB but something just doesn't smell right.
Thank you. |
Back into your wooden hut and try again with your pencils and crayons. You come here with nothing but a fake document with no dates, stamps, signatures etc... thinking anyone would fall for that piece of utter trash?
You know why you wont go to PFT? simple, you would be demolished in less time it takes to turn a light off, if you turn up with that pack of garbage.
The FDR data etc.. was NEVER under any control of the FBI when it was handed over under the FOIA.
Get your facts right.
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jackchit
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| Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 11:40 pm Post subject: Re: Skeptical of FDR data |
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| Serge wrote: | | jackchit wrote: | I have asked this question over at LC forums and had no answer even though Rob Balsamo posted in the same thread, I don't want to ask at PFT as I wouldn't to get my computer dirty.
I have noticed many who have been involved with ths FDR stuff over here so maybe i can finally get my answer.
Look at this file....
http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/GenPDF.asp?id=DCA01MA064&rpt=fa
Thats the NTSB report on flight 77 it clearly states that "any material generated by the NTSB is under control of the FBI".
So then how is it possible the FDR data to be released by the NTSB when it was under the control of the FBI?
Unless the FBI saw this as a massive red herring that would keep some researchers busy for months on end and instructed the NTSB to release flight data that could have been generated in a simulator.
I have no doubt the researchers took this in good faith and did aquire it from the NTSB but something just doesn't smell right.
Thank you. |
Back into your wooden hut and try again with your pencils and crayons. You come here with nothing but a fake document with no dates, stamps, signatures etc... thinking anyone would fall for that piece of utter trash?
You know why you wont go to PFT? simple, you would be demolished in less time it takes to turn a light off, if you turn up with that pack of garbage.
The FDR data etc.. was NEVER under any control of the FBI when it was handed over under the FOIA.
Get your facts right. |
that answers my question although you didn't.
you have been taken in, i ask a legit question and you post nonsense, then claim its truth
now this board is compromised as well as pillocks for truth
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Snowygrouch
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| Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 12:03 am Post subject: |
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The investigation was carried out by the NTSB (as a are ALL such cases); the results were then provided to the FBI (as its a criminal case); all this means is that the NTSB carry out work and then pass it on the FBI.
The FBI do not deal with NTSB FOIA requests because they did not produce the reports or the files or the simulations. The NTSB did. If you want a fuller explanation of this I suggest you phone FBI headquaters like I did on the following number. No prefix needed, this number will get you straight through. You cant speak to the FBI team involved (the PentBOM team as they were disbanded recently) however their legal department or FOIA dept will be able to explain the process for you.
(001) 202- 324-3000
If you have questions you can email me.
Make up a list of questions you want answered; and I will. I have personally spoken to the NTSB personell who actually made these reports (Jim Ritters office). I have also personally spoken to the NTSB FOIA officer who released the files to ME. (Miss Melba D. Moye).
The NTSB FOIA number is: 20060483, why dont you telephone them and query it if you are so very concerned and apparently irate.
Calum
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Last edited by Snowygrouch on Wed Mar 07, 2007 12:13 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Serge
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| Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 12:11 am Post subject: Re: Skeptical of FDR data |
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| jackchit wrote: | | Serge wrote: | | jackchit wrote: | I have asked this question over at LC forums and had no answer even though Rob Balsamo posted in the same thread, I don't want to ask at PFT as I wouldn't to get my computer dirty.
I have noticed many who have been involved with ths FDR stuff over here so maybe i can finally get my answer.
Look at this file....
http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/GenPDF.asp?id=DCA01MA064&rpt=fa
Thats the NTSB report on flight 77 it clearly states that "any material generated by the NTSB is under control of the FBI".
So then how is it possible the FDR data to be released by the NTSB when it was under the control of the FBI?
Unless the FBI saw this as a massive red herring that would keep some researchers busy for months on end and instructed the NTSB to release flight data that could have been generated in a simulator.
I have no doubt the researchers took this in good faith and did aquire it from the NTSB but something just doesn't smell right.
Thank you. |
Back into your wooden hut and try again with your pencils and crayons. You come here with nothing but a fake document with no dates, stamps, signatures etc... thinking anyone would fall for that piece of utter trash?
You know why you wont go to PFT? simple, you would be demolished in less time it takes to turn a light off, if you turn up with that pack of garbage.
The FDR data etc.. was NEVER under any control of the FBI when it was handed over under the FOIA.
Get your facts right. |
that answers my question although you didn't.
you have been taken in, i ask a legit question and you post nonsense, then claim its truth
now this board is compromised as well as pillocks for truth |
Dear oh dear, another fool. I have had 2 from the 'ug' brigade to handle. You are another one which will be dealt with in ease.
So then, I post nonsense and claim it is the truth?. Then I don't know what the hell you think your paragraphs are then.
This board is compromised by gnat squirts like you, who claim to have evidence which rubbishes the truth. All you post is some little kiddy had a strop script, and moan like a wet filly about not approaching PFT. The only reason you do that is because you don't want to accept the truth. Isn't it funny how prats like you believe the official stories you are told, spout them off as the truth, then as soon as something from the official story is used and proves what is the truth, you suddenly refuse to acknowledge it.
You cannot have it both ways. And your fantasy regarding the FDR is what your ilk accuse those who tell the truth as being.., fantacists.
You make yourself look stupid, and infact you are, when you come on here posting an unsigned, unstamped copy of a document, claiming all sorts...FBI/NTSB etc... Sheer stupidity on your part, but of course, you must like making yourself look a prat, so I will leave you to it.
Until you can come back with concrete evidence that the FDR is hogwash, I would suggest you refrain from what you do.
By the way, one of your buddy truthists, Libby was found guilty of perjury today. Still, you wont accept this will you, as you can prove it is not true.
You have had your questions answered on the LC forum, and don't try to deny it. You just cannot handle the answer you were given. 
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jackchit
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| Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:45 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Dear oh dear, another fool. I have had 2 from the 'ug' brigade to handle. You are another one which will be dealt with in ease.
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Insult
| Quote: | | This board is compromised by gnat squirts like you |
Insult
| Quote: | | Isn't it funny how prats like you believe the official stories you are told |
Insult, and wrong I don't believe the official account.
| Quote: | You make yourself look stupid, and infact you are, when you come on here posting an unsigned, unstamped copy of a document, claiming all sorts...FBI/NTSB etc... Sheer stupidity on your part, but of course, you must like making yourself look a prat, so I will leave you to it.
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Yet another insult, that is the official NTSB report so your allegations are unfounded.
| Quote: | | Until you can come back with concrete evidence that the FDR is hogwash, I would suggest you refrain from what you do. |
I do not claim its hogwash i said I was skeptical.
| Quote: | By the way, one of your buddy truthists, Libby was found guilty of perjury today. Still, you wont accept this will you, as you can prove it is not true.
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Shrug shoulders.
| Quote: | | You have had your questions answered on the LC forum, and don't try to deny it. You just cannot handle the answer you were given. |
Link please.
Note: many insults and no answers, My question is a valid one, on the one hand you do not believe the official account on the other you take as gospel data retrieved from official sources. This is why I'm skeptical.
@serge, your answer is nothing but insults and inaccuracies, you are clearly an ignorant Ill-educated dimwit... nice people you got around here.
@ snowygrouch, Thank you for your answer although you got a little dig in at the end, I am not questioning the integrity of anyone researching the FDR, I am however questioning its credibility due to the source. NTSB/FBI.
For the record I am a truther and have attended a meeting in Leeds where I spoke to both David and Annie in person. I am not a 911 truth skeptic.
Now quit with the insults.
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Snowygrouch
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| Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 12:02 pm Post subject: |
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I am not interested in wasting my time with a thread on insults so I hope everyone will refrain from it.
JC,
If the data is all faked that is just as valuable for exposing lies as any other scenario.
If they did; it is cast iron proof that various giv agencies (or small bodies therein) have gone to absolutely extraordinary lengths to produce faked information. That would be absolutely damning.
If the data is not faked the results are much the same but for different reasons.
The second is more likely, recent analysis by a statistical analysis expert ( http://911files.info/blog/?p=58) shows that the raw data has quite possibly been manipulated to skew the flightpath. Errors in the data are beginning to appear that show a high probability of post recording manipulation (for example vertical accelleration is "missing"; how very convenient).
If the data were 100% faked from a simulator or such there should not be such errors within the data. Of course errors (of a certain magnitude) always crop up in FDR data because there are hundreds of sensors recording data and naturally small errors and failures creep in (a sensor fails, perhaps a bit of data becomes corrupt). However the discrepancies were are talking about here are way beyond the scope of such common errors. I know; I have spent a long time on the phone to one of the worlds only Commercial FDR Analyists.
So either way it matters not; we have proof of who made the data, who released it and who now refuse to comment. If its faked; the implications are no less dire for those responsible for it.
Hope this helps.
C.
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jackchit
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Serge
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| Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 5:50 pm Post subject: |
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| jackchit wrote: | | Quote: | Dear oh dear, another fool. I have had 2 from the 'ug' brigade to handle. You are another one which will be dealt with in ease.
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Insult
| Quote: | | This board is compromised by gnat squirts like you |
Insult
| Quote: | | Isn't it funny how prats like you believe the official stories you are told |
Insult, and wrong I don't believe the official account.
| Quote: | You make yourself look stupid, and infact you are, when you come on here posting an unsigned, unstamped copy of a document, claiming all sorts...FBI/NTSB etc... Sheer stupidity on your part, but of course, you must like making yourself look a prat, so I will leave you to it.
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Yet another insult, that is the official NTSB report so your allegations are unfounded.
| Quote: | | Until you can come back with concrete evidence that the FDR is hogwash, I would suggest you refrain from what you do. |
I do not claim its hogwash i said I was skeptical.
| Quote: | By the way, one of your buddy truthists, Libby was found guilty of perjury today. Still, you wont accept this will you, as you can prove it is not true.
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Shrug shoulders.
| Quote: | | You have had your questions answered on the LC forum, and don't try to deny it. You just cannot handle the answer you were given. |
Link please.
Note: many insults and no answers, My question is a valid one, on the one hand you do not believe the official account on the other you take as gospel data retrieved from official sources. This is why I'm skeptical.
@serge, your answer is nothing but insults and inaccuracies, you are clearly an ignorant Ill-educated dimwit... nice people you got around here.
@ snowygrouch, Thank you for your answer although you got a little dig in at the end, I am not questioning the integrity of anyone researching the FDR, I am however questioning its credibility due to the source. NTSB/FBI.
For the record I am a truther and have attended a meeting in Leeds where I spoke to both David and Annie in person. I am not a 911 truth skeptic.
Now quit with the insults. |
Insults? if you wish to take them as insults, then hooray for you. Don't forget the insults you posted, so I will bite back much harder if you want and also.., you foolishly claimed that JDX had died. You foolishly insult JDX by claiming he is not a qualified pilot.
If you think what I have said are insults, then heaven knows how you would feel if I realy laid into you.
You claim to be a truther? yet you don't accept the truth regarding the FDR. You believe Anti-Sophist, the nobody in aviation, over a fully qualified pilot with many years experience.
You are as much a truther as I am a government loyalist.
Your entire episode is to my intelligence, an insult. I don't tolerate government loyalists one iota, so get used to it.
Back to your den.
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jackchit
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| Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 8:14 pm Post subject: |
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You started with the insults, you're a totally brainless individual demonstrated by your blind following of JDX.
I tell you what, which 911 truth event are you attending next? I will come along and we can debate this face to face.
And if you want to insult me then be my guest, to my face.
LOL I know you are yellow and will never agree to that, suprise me.
Or Skype me "therealjackchit"
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johndoex
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jackchit
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jackchit
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| Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:03 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | if anyone wants to help to get me out to the UK for this, i will be honored to be there with Calum to debate Jackchit (im sure it will be brief).
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why don't you fly yourself over? Mr Pilot
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johndoex
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| Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:12 pm Post subject: |
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| jackchit wrote: | | Quote: | if anyone wants to help to get me out to the UK for this, i will be honored to be there with Calum to debate Jackchit (im sure it will be brief).
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why don't you fly yourself over? Mr Pilot |
I would love to. Can you finance the jet of my choice i would like to fly?
We may be looking at between 10-20k USD. Do you have enough to put your money where your mouth is?
If so.. i'll be there.
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jackchit
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| Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:33 pm Post subject: |
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| johndoex wrote: | | jackchit wrote: | | Quote: | if anyone wants to help to get me out to the UK for this, i will be honored to be there with Calum to debate Jackchit (im sure it will be brief).
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why don't you fly yourself over? Mr Pilot |
I would love to. Can you finance the jet of my choice i would like to fly?
We may be looking at between 10-20k USD. Do you have enough to put your money where your mouth is?
If so.. i'll be there. |
you should get there its not too much to fly over here maybe welfare will pay for it.
If you don't come it will be because you're chicken.
Again see you in Ipswich,
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jackchit
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johndoex
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| Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:20 pm Post subject: |
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If you don't come it will be because you're chicken.
Again see you in Ipswich, |
lol... chicken.. havent heard that since the last time i slammed someone in high school.. 20 years ago.
You gonna make the 'bac' bac' sound now?
Hows that wine holding up for you Jack?
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johndoex
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| Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:22 pm Post subject: |
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Since Mike Chambers locked the thread... we'll continue here...
| Quote: | Why are you avoiding the above questions?
Here they are again...
Did you send that PM? If not, do i have permission to post your IP and email from that screename so the admins here can look up the difference? Surely you would want to know the imposter using your name and sending the above PM.. no?
Who did you speak to at the I-Air board who claimed i was dead? Why did you spread it as fact when you dont have source?
What is your login name at the I-Air boards?
Answer please. |
4th time asked Jack...
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Snowygrouch
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| Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:42 pm Post subject: |
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I will indeed be at Ipswich on 22nd.
Happy to answer questions after the talk; I do not tolerate interruptions though.
As I said email me a list of questions and I`ll answer them. Quite what else there is to debate I dont know.
I`m afraid that you wont have any of your "personal questions" answered about Pilots for truth when you come to my lecture. Any issues you have with persons involved is entirely your own affair.
Violence of any sort or the inciuation of; is an abhorrent concept to me.
C.
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chek
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| Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 12:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Snowygrouch wrote: | I will indeed be at Ipswich on 22nd.
Happy to answer questions after the talk; I do not tolerate interruptions though.
C. |
I wouldn't worry unduly SG - Jackchit is merely one of the huge army of evidence-free 'doubters' that have been sent to infest the LC boards like swarms cockroaches since The Pentacom was released.
They offer no effective rebuttals, but they do have the whole array of cheap semantic tricks that lawyers of the shyster variety employ.
Easy meat when you're sure of your ground.
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jackchit
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| Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 6:51 pm Post subject: |
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| chek wrote: | | Snowygrouch wrote: | I will indeed be at Ipswich on 22nd.
Happy to answer questions after the talk; I do not tolerate interruptions though.
C. |
I wouldn't worry unduly SG - Jackchit is merely one of the huge army of evidence-free 'doubters' that have been sent to infest the LC boards like swarms cockroaches since The Pentacom was released.
They offer no effective rebuttals, but they do have the whole array of cheap semantic tricks that lawyers of the shyster variety employ.
Easy meat when you're sure of your ground. |
That is a baseless ignorant comment, I have been on the LC forum for over a year, The pentacon has had a frosty reception because it claims to offer proof but fails to deliver and is boring to boot.
Ask questions demand answers........ Is that motto now dead and buried?
You are from the JDX school of thought "Insults not Answers". you are pathetic.
@ snowygrouch, your reference to violence perplexed, I in no way insinuated violence in any form.
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chek
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| Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 7:50 pm Post subject: |
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| jackchit wrote: |
That is a baseless ignorant comment, I have been on the LC forum for over a year, The pentacon has had a frosty reception because it claims to offer proof but fails to deliver and is boring to boot.
Ask questions demand answers........ Is that motto now dead and buried?
You are from the JDX school of thought "Insults not Answers". you are pathetic. |
And yet you are the one who has clumsily claimed:
a) Rob Balsamo is dead - you heard it on an ex-employees board that you can't actually recall when repeatedly challenged to provide evidence.
Nor can you provide your login for Rob to source this mysterious quote through the board moderators.
The obvious flatfoot clumsy implication being Rob is a fraud and thus by extension his research is a fraud. However, this is not enough for you. You then go on to claim:
b)SG is young and impressionable and again by extension the research he has contributed to is therefore easily dismissable.
You then puff up a ridiculous claim (while still avoiding answering the above) that if someone does not travel from the USA to Ipswich to face big bad truthseeking you and your righteous claims, you 'win' game set and match. All in the absence of a single coherent and/or verifiable reason from you.
No Jack, it is you who are pathetic.
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Snowygrouch
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| Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 8:26 pm Post subject: |
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JC,
Good
C.
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jackchit
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| Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 9:00 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | a) Rob Balsamo is dead - you heard it on an ex-employees board that you can't actually recall when repeatedly challenged to provide evidence.
Nor can you provide your login for Rob to source this mysterious quote through the board moderators.
The obvious flatfoot clumsy implication being Rob is a fraud and thus by extension his research is a fraud. However, this is not enough for you. You then go on to claim:
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Is being wrong a hobby of yours? I said I couldn't recall but if you wanted i could dig it out.
Again from the JDX school of diversion and evasion, I'm done with you Mr anonymous smeg.
@SG I do not question your integrity all I questioned was the validity of what you are studying based upon its source. But you took the time to answer my question so I respect you for that.
@JDX maybe you could post a link to the board where your former co-workers keep in touch.
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johndoex
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| Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 9:34 pm Post subject: |
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| johndoex wrote: | Since Mike Chambers locked the thread... we'll continue here...
| Quote: | Why are you avoiding the above questions?
Here they are again...
Did you send that PM? If not, do i have permission to post your IP and email from that screename so the admins here can look up the difference? Surely you would want to know the imposter using your name and sending the above PM.. no?
Who did you speak to at the I-Air board who claimed i was dead? Why did you spread it as fact when you dont have source?
What is your login name at the I-Air boards?
Answer please. |
4th time asked Jack... |
5th time asked Jack.
edit: adding PM here...
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johndoex
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| Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 9:59 pm Post subject: |
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Calum,
I replaced your "Snowygrouch" with your real name on our memberlist. Sorry it took so long...
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/core.html
Also credited you as the source for the animation. So you should be all set for your conference. But of luck to you my friend. Wish i could be there with you, for you.
Jack,
When at the conference, try to refrain from calling the organization "Dimwits for Troof" like you do regularly at the LC boards. Its very unbecoming and Calum might just ignore you if you use those tactics... (as i have done, and will do after you answer the above questions).
Let me guess, you didnt write that either...
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jackchit
Suspended
Joined: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 65
Location: Sheffield
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| Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 10:34 pm Post subject: |
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| johndoex wrote: | Calum,
I replaced your "Snowygrouch" with your real name on our memberlist. Sorry it took so long...
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/core.html
Also credited you as the source for the animation. So you should be all set for your conference. But of luck to you my friend. Wish i could be there with you, for you.
Jack,
When at the conference, try to refrain from calling the organization "Dimwits for Troof" like you do regularly at the LC boards. Its very unbecoming and Calum might just ignore you if you use those tactics... (as i have done, and will do after you answer the above questions).
Let me guess, you didnt write that either... |
can't make it eh dimwit.. should've known you'd worm your way out of it.
Eh.. whaddya gonna do when you're dealing with *.
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http://www.myspace.com/markrobertsgayspy |
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Serge
Moderate Poster
Joined: 13 Aug 2006
Posts: 188
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| Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 11:00 pm Post subject: |
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| jackchit wrote: | | johndoex wrote: | Calum,
I replaced your "Snowygrouch" with your real name on our memberlist. Sorry it took so long...
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/core.html
Also credited you as the source for the animation. So you should be all set for your conference. But of luck to you my friend. Wish i could be there with you, for you.
Jack,
When at the conference, try to refrain from calling the organization "Dimwits for Troof" like you do regularly at the LC boards. Its very unbecoming and Calum might just ignore you if you use those tactics... (as i have done, and will do after you answer the above questions).
Let me guess, you didnt write that either... |
can't make it eh dimwit.. should've known you'd worm your way out of it.
Eh.. whaddya gonna do when you're dealing with *. |
Right then pickering sucker. Since you cannot answer questions, which you hypocritically accuse others of doing, along with the insults... here goes..
When you have finished working on Pickerings rectum, come back to down to earth with a bump, as you are clearly being bum sucked into his bickerings, your posts clearly indicate you have been sucked up and in by his behaviour, as you are mirroring it on here. You are a first class pillock with as much between your ears as there is between one side of a canyon to another.
You have a nothing reputation as being able to provide evidence to back up everything you claim. So I am telling you to come up with the evidence of your claims.
Your name 'jackchit', I am correct in saying that it refers to what you know. Seeing as you cannot spell, you need to replace the 'c' with an 's'.
As soon as you are rumbled, you react like the filly you are. And as you have been rumbled, your squirming is hilarious, keep at it, it is very entertaining to watch.
Again, I state that you are a NO truther, but a pickering style loyalist dope, ducking and diving from questions which would expose you further than you have been exposed already.
You are too simple, you really are. Pathetic is too weak an expression to describe you and your keyboard warrior drivel.
You are figured.
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The most transparent of all materials on this Earth is a politician. |
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mark_e
Moderate Poster
Joined: 29 Oct 2006
Posts: 155
Location: Ipswich
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| Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 11:24 pm Post subject: |
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| so then jack, shall i reserve you a seat for our event on the 22nd? |
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