Vapour trails, contrails or chemtrails? Fact or fiction?

[Ignatz]

[London Mick]

Moderators, what is this Ignaatz bloke doing here?

[Ignatz]

[Thermate]

Need an OFF-TOPIC section badly. Of the top4 threads in this General(911) section, we have:

Chemtrails, Depleted uranium and Global warming.

Distract much?

[TonyGosling]

I agree this is getting too much - though I actually reckon DU is not off topic enough to be zapped

What do we mods do? I ould shifthis entire topic off into the invisible holding zone for mods to discuss but no users would know what we were up to...

Can some sane person suggest something to any/all of us by PM please.

back to DU for a mo.. Its very much on the cards for Iran to be buried under a radioactive haze - once everyone's either dead or run away and the haze has cleared it can be decontaminated and redeveloped by God's bods of Zion as part of their Lebensraum programme eh!?
http://www.planetquo.com/The-Next-Attack-Is-Coming

[Johnny Pixels]

Oh, so many responses and where to start?

I see no one tried to respond to my maths. Is anyone going to deny that from cruising altitude you need 80,000 litres of chemical to produce a one part per billion concentration over a 5 x 5 mile area?

And those photos, they show persistant spreading contrails. What proof do you have that what those photos are showing is a trail of mind bending chemicals, and not a contrail?

and for this

[Johnny Pixels]

[paul wright]

Yes well these show trails of some sort leaving jet engines but are hardly conclusive of anything, as nobody disputes the existence of contrails. I don't actually dispute the existence of persistant contrails, though I think these are entirely distinguishable from chemtrails, imo.
Anyway, surely National Geographic or one of those magazines that shows a lot of land and sky scape photos will have some coincidental shots of the odd persistant contrail in their archive material. Sure there werent so many jets, but if this is what the phenomenon is there ought to be the odd one or two in shots.
Mind you I've looked on a number of websites, and leafed various old magazines such as NG and Beautiful British Columbia and Yorkshire Life or whatever it is and can't come up with any
The best a couple of guys working the Above Top Secret boards 24/7, attacking 9/11 truthism and chemtrail theory as their main targets, suggestive of a tie-in in the agency mind perhaps - any doubting mods, was some dirty dog fighters from World War II and a painting from some military museum
Still, I'm sure someone will surprise me sooner or later
Suggestion - watch some Eighties or Seventies movies on the telly that feature outdoor shots and keep an eye on the sky. I'd be grateful to hear of any sightings
By the way, Ignaatz challenged me earlier on to provide proof of modifications to airplanes by the thousand to show that this phenomenon is real. That's hardly the point. I don't know how they do it. There exists somewhere some footage of what appears to be an orb laying chemtrails. I think that exists in the chemtrails central archives of a couple of years ago, and was taken by someone I'm since out of touch with. Will try to track it down if anyone wants

[Johnny Pixels]

The problem is that chemtrails can't be distinguished from persistent spreading contrails, because all the photos that have been posted of chemtrails, and that I've ever seen anywhere of chemtrails, have been photos of spreading contrails, there is no difference.

Now that the weather is a bit nicer and there's some contrails to be seen I will try to get some photos of aircraft leaving them, both spreading ("chemtrail" style) and non spreading.

[Emmanuel]

Most people don't notice chemtrails as tv advertising and films are full of them as a symbol of normality.
For years I have been asking supposed observant, intelligent people to look up and see what has happened to our sunshine and they dont want to know.
I have now accepted that this is the condition of our air quality now and make the most of clear days when I can.
For a nation that is obsessed with weather I am not sure why so few people vocalise that the fluffy clouds of before have almost disappeared.
Its hard to imagine but the people who have introduced chemtrails are big on multitasking. There are probably more embedded side affects and reasons to employ an air force to fly planes back and forth every hour of the day all over nato governed lands...

1 Creating cloud cover to lower temperature
2 Preventing rainfall
3 Limiting human beings depth of vision, shuts down the higher conscious part of the brain. (Blue skies inspire)
4 Getting rid of barium and other toxic matter into the lungs of unsuspecting population
5 Causing sickness, flu like symptoms, dizziness, respiratory problems, death
6 Causing general tiredness and apathy

More about chemtrails here:

http://educate-yourself.org/ct/
http://carnicom.com/

Take colloidal silver to cut short any nasty fungal toxic flu like ilness. Peace out

[Ignatz]

Here's a thought...

Contrails are very clearly seen to be originating from aircraft engines (not surprisingly)

Unless these "chemtrail" tanks - or a feed pipe - are built into the engine assemblies, then the trail will not appear to be coming from the engines. (I'd hazard a guess that mixing chemicals with seriously hot aircraft exhaust would quite probably be quite bad for the chemicals ).

A high-powered camera should be capable of spotting the tell-tale sign of the trail issuing from the "wrong" place. Despite bumping into a lot of chemtrail references on CT sites, I've yet to see this kind of photographic evidence. Why is that? It should be a damn sight easier to procure than some 1960's skyscape that somebody has bothered to shove on the 'net.

[Johnny Pixels]

[Johnny Pixels]

[Johnny Pixels]

This is an example of a contrail forming behind the plane slightly, as it must cool before freezing to form the trail. This was taken with a 55mm lens, so the 300mm should give a lot more detail, assuming the weather is right, I manage to spot some planes, and I have my camera on me.

[paul wright]

Conclusive in my book, though it is only reportage, is that you can clear your skies with a combination of a cloudbusterand an organised and complete comprehensive mobile phone mast towerbusting in your local area
The West Yorkshire skies are very healthy at the moment to the west due to the deployment of one or two cloud/chembusters in the area, and the systematic taking out of the majority of mobile and Tetra mast in the west of West Yorkshire by a dedicated person
The DOR is the component part that matters most and if we draw and transform that to OR we restore health to the skies and ourselves
None of the scummy argumentative nonsense being posted by Pixels or Ignatz supercedes working it for yourself
I've not seen a chemtrail whiteout around here for a long time

[Newspeak International]

[utopiated]

[paul wright]

[ian neal]

Johnny and ignatz

Please post only in critics corner in future. By all means start a thread in critics corner about chemtrails. Thanks

[utopiated]

[paul wright]

[jackamo]

'Scuse Me While I Criss The Sky

What seems to scare people so much about discussing the phenomena of "chemtrails" on here that a threat to "pull" the topic is issued?

Are we been asked to evacuate the nine-eleven.co.uk building for our own safety?

Given the fact, this thread runs to over five pages, it is hardly because there is a lack of interest in discussing the topic. So why the threat?

For my two cents, its about who has the power and control to decide which issues are objects of "legitimate" discussion and which are not on this forum. Reading through the posts, its interesting that the very people who have already decided a priori that "chemtrails" do not exist are the ones calling for an end to any discussion or exploration of the phenomena.

If you already know with absolute one hundred percent certainty that a covert op isnt taking place under the guise of normal contrail behaviour, then whats the harm in those of us who don't possess your certainty and assurance from discussing the topic.

Isnt it also interesting that there is often a correlation between those who pronounce certainty on any given subject [such as the fact they KNOW 100% that thermate was used to bring down the towers despite the fact they were not present on the day, not involved with the planning of the operation and not privy to any insider knowledge concerning black budget technological breakthroughs] and the people who decide what is acceptable to discuss on this forum and what isn't. Just an observation thats all.

[btw - thats not to say thermate wasn't used to bring down the towers, either as a primary cause or as an adjunct to another technology, but do I know that with any degree of absolute certainty? How could I?]

Regardless of the ontological status of chemtrails in terms of whether they "really" exist or not, is the topic so heretical now that we cannot even discuss the sociological dimension of the phenomena?

Or are the conceptual flames of any discussion about the "chemtrail phenomena" so out of control, that the topic needs to be "pulled" for our own well being?

Even if one denies the validity of the concept that a global covert operation is taking place right under our very noses, which utilises the phenomena of "contrails" as its outward "cover". I for one find it fascinating that myself and thousands of people all over the world are observing and photographing these lattice like "structures" in the sky under the "delusion" that this is a new phenomena. Given the fact the "debunkers" insist these lattices and crosses have always existed in the sky, then surely this "collective amnesia" or perhaps "collective hallucination" on the part of those who take the photographs and write about the phenomena is a fact worthy of study alone.

I for one am fascinated by the fact I cannot remember seeing these grids and crosses in the sky until a couple of years ago. Over my many years I do remember seeing thousands of planes leaving trails behind them which dissipated rather quickly. I still see this phenomena today and it looks pretty much how its always looked. These grids and crosses seem different both in terms of form and structure.

Below are some images I hallucinated in the skies above Nottingham today

best wishes
paul
www.utopiated.net

BTW - showing a picture of a single plane [or multiple planes for that matter] from any era emitting a con-trail as proof that the phenomena of chemtrails doesnt exist [in the form of multiple planes criss-crossing the sky to create long lasting lattice and grid like structures] is the logical equivalent of showing the picture of the Mannlicher-Carcano bolt-action rifle resting against a box in the Texas School Book Depository in Dealey Plaza as proof Lee Harvey Oswald was the lone assassin.

It completely ignores the technical capability of Oswald to fire the necessary shots in the requisite time, it ignores the fact Oswald was, in his own words a "patsy" and it ignores the wider milieu surrounding the assassination. Likewise, showing a plane or planes emitting contrails ignores both the capability and intent to carry out a covert operation under the guise of normal contrails and it ignores the lattice like grids that are the signature mark of any "chemtrail" operation.

Background information:

The images below were taken of the skies above Nottingham City today on 9th March 2007 between 3:03pm and 3:08pm. These crosses and lattices are a regular feature of the Nottingham sky line.

What was interesting today was the fact I recieved information that the skies over Peterborough [about 50 miles south of Nottingham] were also the subject of this lattice like "spraying". This occured about an hour before the pictures were taken so I had a chance to observe the sky between 2:00pm and 3:00pm.

Apart from the odd plane emitting the usual short acting contrail phenomena and a few clouds, the skies were clear. Suddenly, in the space of five minutes multiple planes appeared and began criss-crossing the entire sky, leaving thick trails of long lasting appearance [the lattice like structures could still be observed two hours later] and then the planes disappeared as fast as they arrived.

Now, maybe it is in the realms of possibility that these multiple planes criss crossing the sky were part of some kind of exercise that took place coincidentally as the sky's atmospherics changed so dramatically [in the space of an hour] that it caused trails from the planes to form [this is the argument used by debunkers to explain why these "contrails" do not dissipate quickly - its all down to atmospheric conditions apparently]

Remember, in the previous hour, the few planes I saw were flying at a similar altitude and were leaving the classic short-lasting contrail, then all of a sudden things changed...Anyway, after the planes disappeared I called a friend in Mansfield [12 miles north of Nottingham] because usually, the lattices also form over this town too.
On this occasion, he reported no sky grids and said the planes he could see in the sky were emitting the short duration contrails. So if these trails are simply the epiphenomena of atmospheric conditions, they took place in a twelve mile bubble!

Given the fact I have observed, documented and photographed these sky grids over Nottingham at least twelve times in the last year [and observed on many other occasions without documenting] the debunkers are asking me to believe it is simple coincidence that on every single one of those days the planes decided to radically alter their flight paths [they do not usually cross each other on multiple occasions within a very short duration of time usually as far as I can observe] on the very days a special set of atmospheric conditions were occuring that allowed these trails of long duration to form.

The image below was taken from www.chemtrailsuk.net. We are currently seeking volunteers to document and photograph these lattice like structures which appear all over the UK skies. We hope to discover patterns of coherence in regards to this phenomena whilst simultaneously accepting the possibility we are labouring under collective delusion

For more information contact webmaster@chemtrailsuk.net

Note: all images and video taken on a Sony Erricson 608i. Because of the poor quality of the pictures, the contrast was adjusted in photoshop. No other manipulation was made.

[jackamo]

Various Images of Long Lasting Lattice and Cross Formations over the skies of Nottingham and Mansfield in the last year:















I think these few examples taken over the last year show the possibility that the lattice signatures of a "chemtrail operation" are more than mere random patterns generated by individual and unorganised flight paths.
It can be suggested that a design and intelligence is at work here.

paul
www.utopiated.net

[Emmanuel]

Ignatz,
What bit dont you understand?
I dont live near an airport, why are aeroplanes going back and forth, sometimes creating crosses exactly over towns and even strange curving paths.
Also the spraying is not on permanently I have seen it definitely stop and start. Please, flying a plane is not the same as revving up a car!
I have seen this atrocious behaviour all over europe. Here is the same * goin on in Italy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6NbqZy-8FGg&mode=related&search=

[Emmanuel]

Another video here to catch more chemtrail action.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocm9fDaO9-M
Somebody has posted an interesting quote there too.

"Near the day of Purification, there will be cobwebs spun back and forth in the sky"
-Hopi Indian Prophecy

[Ignatz]

[scar]

[London Mick]

Another glorious day here in London. Huge blue sky and not a chemtrail in sight. Are they giving us a break for some reason? It's been like this all week now. Loads of planes flying around but no chemtrails.

[paul wright]

[Newspeak International]

Well I'm pleased that the mods decide to reinstate this thread,I was loosing interest for the same reasons utopiated stated.

This is a phenomenon that exists,it is in the sky above us almost everyday,and it is part of the whole positioning of the NWO objectives and to deny it denies the truth.

An important call by the mods imo.