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Craig W
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 Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 6:50 pm Post subject: Is history repeating itself? |
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An interesting excerpt from Milton Mayer's 1955 book "They Thought They Were Free" about the lead up to WWII in Germany and the evolution of the Nazi government.
There are many parallels with developments in the present-day US and UK (and probably many other places):
- the lack of a meaningful connection between the people and their Government;
- the slow but steady erosion of civil liberties;
- a "stepping-stones" tightening of security;
- the focus on an enemy threat to divert attention from domestic events;
- the apathy and ignorance of the general populace; etc...
Is history repeating itself?
| Quote: |
They Thought They Were Free
The Germans, 1933-45
Excerpt from pages 166-73 of "They Thought They Were Free" First published in 1955
By Milton Mayer
But Then It Was Too Late
"What no one seemed to notice," said a colleague of mine, a philologist, "was the ever widening gap, after 1933, between the government and the people. Just think how very wide this gap was to begin with, here in Germany. And it became always wider. You know, it doesn’t make people close to their government to be told that this is a people’s government, a true democracy, or to be enrolled in civilian defense, or even to vote. All this has little, really nothing, to do with knowing one is governing.
"What happened here was the gradual habituation of the people, little by little, to being governed by surprise; to receiving decisions deliberated in secret; to believing that the situation was so complicated that the government had to act on information which the people could not understand, or so dangerous that, even if the people could understand it, it could not be released because of national security. And their sense of identification with Hitler, their trust in him, made it easier to widen this gap and reassured those who would otherwise have worried about it.
"This separation of government from people, this widening of the gap, took place so gradually and so insensibly, each step disguised (perhaps not even intentionally) as a temporary emergency measure or associated with true patriotic allegiance or with real social purposes. And all the crises and reforms (real reforms, too) so occupied the people that they did not see the slow motion underneath, of the whole process of government growing remoter and remoter.
"You will understand me when I say that my Middle High German was my life. It was all I cared about. I was a scholar, a specialist. Then, suddenly, I was plunged into all the new activity, as the university was drawn into the new situation; meetings, conferences, interviews, ceremonies, and, above all, papers to be filled out, reports, bibliographies, lists, questionnaires. And on top of that were the demands in the community, the things in which one had to, was ‘expected to’ participate that had not been there or had not been important before. It was all rigmarole, of course, but it consumed all one’s energies, coming on top of the work one really wanted to do. You can see how easy it was, then, not to think about fundamental things. One had no time."
"Those," I said, "are the words of my friend the baker. ‘One had no time to think. There was so much going on.’"
"Your friend the baker was right," said my colleague. "The dictatorship, and the whole process of its coming into being, was above all diverting. It provided an excuse not to think for people who did not want to think anyway. I do not speak of your ‘little men,’ your baker and so on; I speak of my colleagues and myself, learned men, mind you. Most of us did not want to think about fundamental things and never had. There was no need to. Nazism gave us some dreadful, fundamental things to think about—we were decent people—and kept us so busy with continuous changes and ‘crises’ and so fascinated, yes, fascinated, by the machinations of the ‘national enemies,’ without and within, that we had no time to think about these dreadful things that were growing, little by little, all around us. Unconsciously, I suppose, we were grateful. Who wants to think?
"To live in this process is absolutely not to be able to notice it—please try to believe me—unless one has a much greater degree of political awareness, acuity, than most of us had ever had occasion to develop. Each step was so small, so inconsequential, so well explained or, on occasion, ‘regretted,’ that, unless one were detached from the whole process from the beginning, unless one understood what the whole thing was in principle, what all these ‘little measures’ that no ‘patriotic German’ could resent must some day lead to, one no more saw it developing from day to day than a farmer in his field sees the corn growing. One day it is over his head.
"How is this to be avoided, among ordinary men, even highly educated ordinary men? Frankly, I do not know. I do not see, even now. Many, many times since it all happened I have pondered that pair of great maxims, Principiis obsta and Finem respice—‘Resist the beginnings’ and ‘Consider the end.’ But one must foresee the end in order to resist, or even see, the beginnings. One must foresee the end clearly and certainly and how is this to be done, by ordinary men or even by extraordinary men? Things might have. And everyone counts on that might.
"Your ‘little men,’ your Nazi friends, were not against National Socialism in principle. Men like me, who were, are the greater offenders, not because we knew better (that would be too much to say) but because we sensed better. Pastor Niemöller spoke for the thousands and thousands of men like me when he spoke (too modestly of himself) and said that, when the Nazis attacked the Communists, he was a little uneasy, but, after all, he was not a Communist, and so he did nothing; and then they attacked the Socialists, and he was a little uneasier, but, still, he was not a Socialist, and he did nothing; and then the schools, the press, the Jews, and so on, and he was always uneasier, but still he did nothing. And then they attacked the Church, and he was a Churchman, and he did something—but then it was too late."
"Yes," I said.
"You see," my colleague went on, "one doesn’t see exactly where or how to move. Believe me, this is true. Each act, each occasion, is worse than the last, but only a little worse. You wait for the next and the next. You wait for one great shocking occasion, thinking that others, when such a shock comes, will join with you in resisting somehow. You don’t want to act, or even talk, alone; you don’t want to ‘go out of your way to make trouble.’ Why not?—Well, you are not in the habit of doing it. And it is not just fear, fear of standing alone, that restrains you; it is also genuine uncertainty.
"Uncertainty is a very important factor, and, instead of decreasing as time goes on, it grows. Outside, in the streets, in the general community, ‘everyone’ is happy. One hears no protest, and certainly sees none. You know, in France or Italy there would be slogans against the government painted on walls and fences; in Germany, outside the great cities, perhaps, there is not even this. In the university community, in your own community, you speak privately to your colleagues, some of whom certainly feel as you do; but what do they say? They say, ‘It’s not so bad’ or ‘You’re seeing things’ or ‘You’re an alarmist.’
"And you are an alarmist. You are saying that this must lead to this, and you can’t prove it. These are the beginnings, yes; but how do you know for sure when you don’t know the end, and how do you know, or even surmise, the end? On the one hand, your enemies, the law, the regime, the Party, intimidate you. On the other, your colleagues pooh-pooh you as pessimistic or even neurotic. You are left with your close friends, who are, naturally, people who have always thought as you have.
"But your friends are fewer now. Some have drifted off somewhere or submerged themselves in their work. You no longer see as many as you did at meetings or gatherings. Informal groups become smaller; attendance drops off in little organizations, and the organizations themselves wither. Now, in small gatherings of your oldest friends, you feel that you are talking to yourselves, that you are isolated from the reality of things. This weakens your confidence still further and serves as a further deterrent to—to what? It is clearer all the time that, if you are going to do anything, you must make an occasion to do it, and then you are obviously a troublemaker. So you wait, and you wait.
"But the one great shocking occasion, when tens or hundreds or thousands will join with you, never comes. That’s the difficulty. If the last and worst act of the whole regime had come immediately after the first and smallest, thousands, yes, millions would have been sufficiently shocked—if, let us say, the gassing of the Jews in ’43 had come immediately after the ‘German Firm’ stickers on the windows of non-Jewish shops in ’33. But of course this isn’t the way it happens. In between come all the hundreds of little steps, some of them imperceptible, each of them preparing you not to be shocked by the next. Step C is not so much worse than Step B, and, if you did not make a stand at Step B, why should you at Step C? And so on to Step D.
"And one day, too late, your principles, if you were ever sensible of them, all rush in upon you. The burden of self-deception has grown too heavy, and some minor incident, in my case my little boy, hardly more than a baby, saying ‘Jewish swine,’ collapses it all at once, and you see that everything, everything, has changed and changed completely under your nose. The world you live in—your nation, your people—is not the world you were born in at all. The forms are all there, all untouched, all reassuring, the houses, the shops, the jobs, the mealtimes, the visits, the concerts, the cinema, the holidays. But the spirit, which you never noticed because you made the lifelong mistake of identifying it with the forms, is changed. Now you live in a world of hate and fear, and the people who hate and fear do not even know it themselves; when everyone is transformed, no one is transformed. Now you live in a system which rules without responsibility even to God. The system itself could not have intended this in the beginning, but in order to sustain itself it was compelled to go all the way.
"You have gone almost all the way yourself. Life is a continuing process, a flow, not a succession of acts and events at all. It has flowed to a new level, carrying you with it, without any effort on your part. On this new level you live, you have been living more comfortably every day, with new morals, new principles. You have accepted things you would not have accepted five years ago, a year ago, things that your father, even in Germany, could not have imagined.
"Suddenly it all comes down, all at once. You see what you are, what you have done, or, more accurately, what you haven’t done (for that was all that was required of most of us: that we do nothing). You remember those early meetings of your department in the university when, if one had stood, others would have stood, perhaps, but no one stood. A small matter, a matter of hiring this man or that, and you hired this one rather than that. You remember everything now, and your heart breaks. Too late. You are compromised beyond repair.
"What then? You must then shoot yourself. A few did. Or ‘adjust’ your principles. Many tried, and some, I suppose, succeeded; not I, however. Or learn to live the rest of your life with your shame. This last is the nearest there is, under the circumstances, to heroism: shame. Many Germans became this poor kind of hero, many more, I think, than the world knows or cares to know."
I said nothing. I thought of nothing to say.
"I can tell you," my colleague went on, "of a man in Leipzig, a judge. He was not a Nazi, except nominally, but he certainly wasn’t an anti-Nazi. He was just—a judge. In ’42 or ’43, early ’43, I think it was, a Jew was tried before him in a case involving, but only incidentally, relations with an ‘Aryan’ woman. This was ‘race injury,’ something the Party was especially anxious to punish. In the case at bar, however, the judge had the power to convict the man of a ‘nonracial’ offense and send him to an ordinary prison for a very long term, thus saving him from Party ‘processing’ which would have meant concentration camp or, more probably, deportation and death. But the man was innocent of the ‘nonracial’ charge, in the judge’s opinion, and so, as an honorable judge, he acquitted him. Of course, the Party seized the Jew as soon as he left the courtroom."
"And the judge?"
"Yes, the judge. He could not get the case off his conscience—a case, mind you, in which he had acquitted an innocent man. He thought that he should have convicted him and saved him from the Party, but how could he have convicted an innocent man? The thing preyed on him more and more, and he had to talk about it, first to his family, then to his friends, and then to acquaintances. (That’s how I heard about it.) After the ’44 Putsch they arrested him. After that, I don’t know."
I said nothing.
"Once the war began," my colleague continued, "resistance, protest, criticism, complaint, all carried with them a multiplied likelihood of the greatest punishment. Mere lack of enthusiasm, or failure to show it in public, was ‘defeatism.’ You assumed that there were lists of those who would be ‘dealt with’ later, after the victory. Goebbels was very clever here, too. He continually promised a ‘victory orgy’ to ‘take care of’ those who thought that their ‘treasonable attitude’ had escaped notice. And he meant it; that was not just propaganda. And that was enough to put an end to all uncertainty.
"Once the war began, the government could do anything ‘necessary’ to win it; so it was with the ‘final solution of the Jewish problem,’ which the Nazis always talked about but never dared undertake, not even the Nazis, until war and its ‘necessities’ gave them the knowledge that they could get away with it. The people abroad who thought that war against Hitler would help the Jews were wrong. And the people in Germany who, once the war had begun, still thought of complaining, protesting, resisting, were betting on Germany’s losing the war. It was a long bet. Not many made it."
Copyright notice: Excerpt from pages 166-73 of They Thought They Were Free: The Germans, 1933-45 by Milton Mayer, published by the University of Chicago Press. ©1955, 1966 by the University of Chicago. All rights reserved. This text may be used and shared in accordance with the fair-use provisions of U.S. copyright law, and it may be archived and redistributed in electronic form, provided that this entire notice, including copyright information, is carried and provided that the University of Chicago Press is notified and no fee is charged for access. Archiving, redistribution, or republication of this text on other terms, in any medium, requires the consent of the University of Chicago Press. (Footnotes and other references included in the book may have been removed from this online version of the text.)
Milton Mayer
They Thought They Were Free: The Germans, 1933-45
©1955, 1966, 368 pages
Paper $19.00 ISBN: 0-226-51192-8
Posted on site 02/09/06 |
Is history repeating itself?
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"Nothing can trouble you but your own imagination." ~ Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj
Last edited by Craig W on Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:50 pm; edited 3 times in total |
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kbo234
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| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 8:32 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for the post, Craig W.....very interesting.
This article should be broadcast far and wide. There are surely plenty of people out there with the intelligence to recognise the parallels. |
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John White
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| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:22 pm Post subject: |
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I've spread this about in choice places: we all know what's what. Lets hope we can do better this time around
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Craig W
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| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:51 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks, chaps. I too have spread it about a bit - oooerrr! 
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karlos
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| Posted: Thu Apr 26, 2007 2:47 am Post subject: |
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There are alot of parallels.
Because it was the same people who did it the first time around.
How do you think a bankrupt Germany in 1929
Became in a very short time the worlds biggest army
aeroplanes, tanks, submarines, destroyers, space rockets, missiles
we are still to this day using their science in missile technology and genetics mapping, biological warfare, etc
It was because rich americans including rich JEWISH americans financed the whole thing
Even members of the British aristocracy supported them.
The Bush family was involved then and is still running things today.
They are simply doing what comes natural to them.
After the war most of the NAZIs were given jobs in america such as von Braun.
That is why history is repeating because the same people are doing it again.
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Anthony Lawson
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| Posted: Fri Apr 27, 2007 4:35 am Post subject: The Parallels |
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The Parallels
In his list of parallels Craig W includes:
| Quote: | a "stepping-stones" tightening of security;
the slow but steady erosion of civil liberties… |
…while stellios69 follows up with:
| Quote: | It was because rich americans including rich JEWISH americans financed the whole thing
Even members of the British aristocracy supported them.
The Bush family was involved then and is still running things today.
They are simply doing what comes natural to them.
After the war most of the NAZIs were given jobs in america such as von Braun.
That is why history is repeating because the same people are doing it again. |
Many of the links which stelios69 mentions, and others that he (or she?) obviously didn’t have room for, are still shrouded in mystery and misinformation, with the ranks closing should historians or other investigators begin to get too close to the truth. The Bush family certainly had connections with German financial institutions, prior to, and perhaps, during the Second World War; which would have meant a connection to the Nazis.
And the Bush family has certainly been deeply involved in running the U.S., since the end of WWII, but I don’t think that they could do it alone, it would have to be some kind of cabal; involving other bankers and financiers who would also have had links to Germany and the Nazi party, and that would have included many Jews.
In issue 14, May/June 2002, of Clamor Magazine, in an article titled: ‘Heir to the Holocaust’ and sub-headed: Prescott Bush, $1.5 million, and Auschwitz: how the Bush family wealth is linked to the holocaust Toby Rogers writes that Prescott Bush's connections to Silesian businesses made him complicit with the mining operations in Poland which used slave labour from Auschwitz, the town where the Auschwitz concentration camp was later constructed.
| Quote: | According to classified documents from Dutch intelligence and US government archives, President George W. Bush's grandfather, Prescott Bush made considerable profits off Auschwitz slave labor. In fact, President Bush himself is an heir to these profits from the holocaust which were placed in a blind trust in 1980 by his father, former president George Herbert Walker Bush.
http://www.clamormagazine.org/issues/14/feature3.php |
SOURCES: Classified Dutch intelligence documents and US government archives.
However, don’t believe all you read, folks, because an internet item dated Tuesday, December 16, 2003 by the ADL—that’s the ANTI DEFAMATION LEAGUE—whose web page sub-headings include:
ANTI-SEMITISM
CIVIL RIGHTS
COMBATING HATE, etc.,
was devoted, exclusively to the following:
| Quote: | Prescott Bush's Alleged Nazi "Ties"
Rumors about the alleged Nazi "ties" of the late Prescott Bush, the grandfather of President George W. Bush, have circulated widely through the Internet in recent years. These charges are untenable and politically motivated.
Despite some early financial dealings between Prescott Bush and a Nazi industrialist named Fritz Thyssen (who was arrested by the Nazi regime in 1938 and imprisoned during the war), Prescott Bush was neither a Nazi nor a Nazi sympathizer.
http://www.adl.org/Internet_Rumors/prescott.htm |
SOURCES: None given
No rebuttal sources quoted? Not even an attempt to produce documents to refute the accusation?
Of course not, they’re the ANTI DEFAMATION LEAGUE, they don’t have to have sources or run around producing documents to back up any of their statements. They just announce what is and what isn’t and that’s that. ‘You don’t like what Israel is doing to the Palestinians? You’re anti-Semitic.’ End of story.
The same thing will happen when the European Union enacts its anti-free speech laws. Please see my recent post:
The Brussels Bureau of Double Standards
http://www.nineeleven.co.uk/board/viewtopic.php?t=8616&highlight=
Denying or trivialising the Holocaust will include attempting to find out who was complicit or who stood by and let it happen. You can’t have unauthorised people rummaging around in the still-classified or recently de-classified documents of the Netherlands, or France or Austria or Germany or Italy or even the United States. The Anti Defamation League wants to make sure of that, because they almost certainly know that there are paperwork time-bombs out there, just itching to be detonated by someone who doesn’t like a cover-up.
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rodin
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| Posted: Fri Apr 27, 2007 9:43 am Post subject: |
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Trying to decode history without studying Rothschild is like trying to read a book with your nose.
DBS offers a potted history of the clan.
http://www.iamthewitness.com/DarylBradfordSmith_Rothschild.htm
Interesting this history cedes that IG Farben made Zyklon B to gas Jews. Other research I have read discredits the gas chambers story. I don't know where truth lies on this - prehaps there was some gassing but not on the scale claimed.
Some say DBS himself is a mix of disinfo and insight. Certainly all researchers and analysts are capable of honest errors - in fact it would be un-natural if none were made.
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Cruise4
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| Posted: Tue May 15, 2007 10:22 am Post subject: Very Informative |
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Anyone dispute any of this?
I mean the Rothschild link info.
Last edited by Cruise4 on Fri Jun 15, 2007 9:35 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Anthony Lawson
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| Posted: Wed May 16, 2007 1:26 am Post subject: To Cruise4 |
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To Cruise4
It would be helpful if you could be more specific.
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Dogsmilk
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| Posted: Wed May 16, 2007 2:40 pm Post subject: |
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Whereas I agree that the ADL frequently act as bullies and often take accusations of anti-semitism to ludicrous extremes, I think their statement may actually be true...in a banal fashion. I can't remember if Prescott did actually like Nazis, but in many ways it doesn't matter. Fascism provides an excellent investment climate by doing away with stuff like pesky trade unions demanding all kinds of unrealistic fair pay, reasonable working hours and suchlike. Corporations tend to like people who do as they're jolly well told. And people who are contiually encouraged to subsume their identity and work towards gleichschaltung are ideal. In that respect, there's a big incentive to become a fan, but there's no need to be a card carrying supporter if you're already doing good business. I don't think wotisface (name escapes me) from IBM was specifically a supporter, but he happily supplied Hollerith machines for the population to be effectively classified into racial/religious/sexual groups...a mechanical prescursor to the electronic systems of today. It all depends on how you define someone as 'supporting' something...the arms industry of today certainly claims to hate the sin, but they have a great deal of time for the sinner...
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Anthony Lawson
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| Posted: Thu May 17, 2007 10:50 am Post subject: The Tangled Web of the Anti Defamation League—the ADL |
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The Tangled Web of the Anti Defamation League—the ADL
| Quote: | | Whereas I agree that the ADL frequently act as bullies and often take accusations of anti-semitism to ludicrous extremes, I think their statement may actually be true...in a banal fashion. I can't remember if Prescott did actually like Nazis, but in many ways it doesn't matter. |
When you can’t remember something, it may be a good idea to look it up before making a statement like “…in many ways it doesn’t matter”, because in some important ways it might matter.
In this case, I believe that it does matter, because it is directly related to the ADL’s dismissive manner in matters which they would prefer remained obscure. However, thanks to a lot of research, by others, the Bush / Nazi connection is far from being obscure, and cannot be dismissed as being ”…untenable and politically motivated” as the following will demonstrate.
| Quote: | From 1945 until 1949, one of the lengthiest and, it now appears, most futile interrogations of a Nazi war crimes suspect began in the American Zone of Occupied Germany. Multibillionaire steel magnate Fritz Thyssen-the man whose steel combine was the cold heart of the Nazi war machine-talked and talked and talked to a joint US-UK interrogation team. For four long years, successive teams of inquisitors tried to break Thyssen's simple claim to possess neither foreign bank accounts nor interests in foreign corporations, no assets that might lead to the missing billions in assets of the Third Reich. The inquisitors failed utterly.
Why? Because what the wily Thyssen deposed was, in a sense, true. What the Allied investigators never understood was that they were not asking Thyssen the right question. Thyssen did not need any foreign bank accounts because his family secretly owned an entire chain of banks. He did not have to transfer his Nazi assets at the end of World War II, all he had to do was transfer the ownership documents - stocks, bonds, deeds and trusts--from his bank in Berlin through his bank in Holland to his American friends in New York City: Prescott Bush and Herbert Walker. Thyssen's partners in crime were the father and father-in-law of a future President of the United States. |
The full article can be found at: http://www.tetrahedron.org/articles/new_world_order/bush_nazis.html
and commentary at: http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article3255.htm
This must be a strong contender for what the ADL means when it says that “These charges are untenable and politically motivated.” But here is a bizarre twist, because the above passages were written by a former U.S. Department of Justice Nazi War Crimes prosecutor, who, at least for a time, had strong connections to those who run and control—you’ve guessed it, or maybe not—the Anti Defamation League.
The writer of the article, Attorney John Loftus was—at least when the article was first published in September, 2000—
| Quote: | | President of the Florida Holocaust Museum and the highly respected author of numerous books on the CIA-Nazi connection including The Belarus Secret and The Secret War Against the Jews, both of which have extensive material on the Bush-Rockefeller-Nazi connection. |
http://www.tetrahedron.org/articles/new_world_order/bush_nazis.html
Bringing things up to date, the final line of the first quote above would read:
| Quote: | | Thyssen's partners in crime were the father and father-in-law of a future President of the United States, who is, of course, the father of the current President of the United States. |
As an American might say: “Go figure.”
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rodin
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| Posted: Thu May 17, 2007 7:06 pm Post subject: |
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Why would the ADL be trying to cover for a Nazi collaborator?
Because the entire shooting match was choreographed by the criminals the ADL was set up to protect. The apparent illogic of victims trying to protect those resposible for their victimhood can be explained when one realises that all wars were orchestrated by the same criminal elite - the Rothschilds & co.
| Quote: | "The following is a partial list of Jews who participated in the Revolutionary War. Major George Bush, Major Louis Bush, Major Soloman Bush."
-National Jewish Welfare Board, Jewish Caalander for Soldiers and Sailors 1943-1944, "The Jews in the Wars of the United States"
http://www.sweetliberty.org/issues/israel/calendar.html
"A secret blueprint for U.S. global domination reveals that President Bush and his cabinet were planning a premeditated attack on Iraq to secure regime change even before he took power in January 2001."
-Ted Koppel: Nightline, March 5, 2003, ree Project for New American Century Corporation (PNAC), "Rebuilding America's Defenses", by Governor Jebediah Bush (R-FL), Donald Rumsfeld, Paul Wolfowitz, et al.
http://www.newamericancentury.org/RebuildingAmericasDefenses.pdf
Strike-out convicted, treasonous and Satanic Bush White House leads Coalition of Mafia Forces to commit fake terrorist attacks against USA to justify war, loot treasury, insider trade, steal oil, deal drugs, extend police state, destroy America for New World Odor
Pentagon smoking document spells out exactly how it was done
http://www.geocities.com/sept911treason/world_trade_center_terrorist_a ttack.html |
http://www.apfn.net/Messageboard/11-02-04/discussion.cgi.43.html
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Anthony Lawson
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 2:28 pm Post subject: Why Anti Defamation? |
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Why Anti 'Defamation'?
The name “Anti Defamation League” has always intrigued me, because one would have thought that the libel and slander laws of the U.S. should be sufficient to cover defamation. After all, there isn’t an Anti Murder League, or an Anti Fraud League, at least not in the U.S.
Since a 1734 court ruling, a libel action should only be successful if the defamatory information in question is proven to be false. I write ‘should’, because the expertise of the lawyers involved will, obviously, play an important part in swaying a jury. However, in 1964 the U.S. Supreme Court issued a ruling that revolutionized libel law in the United States, with a national rule that took into account the free press guarantees of the First Amendment. The Court decided that public officials could no longer sue, successfully, for libel unless reporters or editors were guilty of "actual malice" when publishing false statements about them. The test for malice being that the offensive statement had been published "with reckless disregard of whether it was false or not."
These days, however, the ADL, which began operating in 1913, seems intent on rolling back the centuries to make it an offense to publish, or utter something with reckless disregard to the fact that it happens to be true, because they are intent on suppressing anything which has to do with what went on in Germany, Europe and the United States, prior to the start of the Second World War, and which has since been suppressed by the ‘winners.’
In the ADL’s version of libel or slander, questioning that something happened—even if there are no documents or any other evidence to prove that it happened—is defamation. The act of ‘questioning,’ according to the ADL also means ‘denying.’ Studying historical documents becomes ‘revisionism,’ in its worst Soviet connotation, and the perpetrator a ‘revisionist.’ But just because a word has an ‘ist’ suffix, doesn’t mean that those it describes are bad people, as is the case with ‘rapist,’ for example.
No sane historian would deny that a great many unfortunate people, many of them Jews, suffered terrible hardships, including torture and rape, and were killed or died of disease in Nazi Germany, or in the concentration camps in Nazi occupied territory, before and during WWII, but to even question how may, or how and why they died has now become ‘defamation’.
| Quote: | | In July 1990, the Polish government's Auschwitz State Museum, along with Israel's Yad Vashem Holocaust center, conceded that the four million figure was a gross exaggeration, and references to it were accordingly removed from the Auschwitz monument. Israeli and Polish officials announced a tentative revised toll of 1.1 million Auschwitz dead.12 In 1993, French Holocaust researcher Jean-Claude Pressac, in a much-discussed book about Auschwitz, estimated that altogether about 775,000 died there during the war years. |
Source: What is Holocaust Denial? http://www.the7thfire.com:80/Politics%20and%20History/Holocaust/what_i s_Holocaust_denial.htm
Prior to these concessions and Pressac’s revision, a memorial plaque at Auschwitz read: "Four Million People Suffered and Died Here at the Hands of the Nazi Murderers Between the Years 1940 and 1945", yet the emotive figure of Six Million, as the total number of Jews who died at the hands of the Nazis, persists, largely because the ADL and other Jewish organizations, including Hollywood, feel that to reduce this figure would, somehow, posthumously diminish the suffering of those who died. Or could it be to bolster the living martyrdom of those who share the same religion?
Normally, when disaster strikes, the fact that the death toll had been revised downwards, to just over a quarter of the number first published, would be cause, if not for celebration, then for a measure of relief. ‘Thank God that not so many of our brethren as we first thought suffered and died’ might have been spoken or at least thought by those with a religious background, but this does not seem to have happened; quite the reverse. The ADL and other Zionist organizations stick to the Six Million figure, no matter what. In itself, this is not such a terrible thing, but why should there be such an effort made to attack those who want to get at the truth about this, and other matters relating to the Holocaust?
In my opinion, the ADL has two main aims: The first is to keep prior Jewish suffering at the forefront of people’s minds, in order to deflect their thinking away from what is going on, today. And their efforts seem to be having the desired effect, when it comes to the massive international disregard for the awful abuses that the Zionist State of Israel is visiting on the Palestinians, and the fact that, in certain ways, that state is behaving in a similar way to those they believe to be inferior, as Nazi Germany did to its minority Jewish population, as well as to many members of its other ‘undesirable’ ethnic groups.
The second aim is to suppress the truth about who supported or were sympathetic to the aims of the Nazis, when it suited their own agendas. Clearly, when historical research can reveal that the immediate forebears of two United States Presidents were hand in glove with at least one prominent Nazi, the ADL almost certainly knows that this is only the tip of an extremely large, dirty iceberg, which is why further widespread revelations are to be discouraged, at all costs, even to the extent of impugning the research and revelations of someone like John Loftus, ‘a highly respected author’ and the first Irish Catholic President of the Florida Holocaust museum.
Think about that, for a moment. An Irish-Catholic-Holocaust Museum president? In Florida? Nevertheless, his findings about the Bush family’s Nazi connections are dismissed by the ADL as ‘rumors’ that are ‘…untenable and politically motivated.’ This ADL statement, by the way, was released in December, 2003, when John Loftus had held the museum presidency since at least September 2000. (It seems that Loftus is now a vice chairman, but still active in the museum’s affairs.)
These guys are obviously not singing from the same psalm sheet, and it would be interesting to know what else the ADL and the general holocaust-museum hierarchy disagree about. But one thing is certain: Someone is, or was telling lies. From what I have read elsewhere, I do not think that it was John Loftus.
One other thing is certain: If there is a renewal of anti-Jewish feelings in those who hold natural fairness and decency as being the self-evident way of behaving towards others, then the ADL, as well those citizens of Israel who do not ‘do unto others as they would have done unto themselves,’ must take a large share of the blame for it. It is my belief that the ‘ordinary’ Jews of Germany took the consequences of the excesses of their co-religionists who did not live in Germany, but whose agenda had the formation of the Zionist state of Israel as their primary goal, and who were not about to let anything or anyone stand in their way.
Just as bombing people whose ideas of religion and politics do not coincide with your own is counterproductive—in that it will stir up feelings of hatred and a desire for revenge in those whose loved ones have been killed or maimed—covering up historical truths, will, in the end, have a similar effect as bombs: a desire for revenge against those who propagated lies, by attempting to hide the truth. As it is with bombs—even ‘smart’ ones—it will not always be the prime targets who suffer from such a backlash, because they are the ones who usually have the wherewithal to make their escape, leaving behind the fools, who believed their lies, to bear the consequences.
There is evidence that a backlash is already in progress. In a recent release by the ADL, an organization called ‘Wheels of Justice’ is taken to task for being a…
| Quote: | | …microcosm of the latest permutation of the assault on Israel that we see in the public discourse. There is an insidious two-step process revealed in scenario after scenario. First, the anti-Israel extremists unabashedly use the imagery of either the Nazi genocide, the ethnic cleansing of Bosnia, or the racist segregation of Apartheid South Africa (or all three) to publicly characterize the alleged systematic and unrelenting oppression of Palestinians by Israel. This can be done in the form of a conference, a lecture or even a paper or a book. Second, when these falsehoods trigger outrage and rebuttal from the Jewish community, the instigators charge that powerful Jewish interests are seeking to suppress free speech – and they allude to the manner in which Zionists control the media and the larger public discourse on Israel. In other words, their anti-Israelism is bolstered by appeals to outright anti-Semitism. |
Full article at: http://www.adl.org/ADL_Opinions/Israel/Jewish+Advocate_01.04.07.htm
I’m not going to try and analyse that outburst, except to say that the use of the word ‘alleged’ in front of the phrase ‘systematic and unrelenting oppression of Palestinians by Israel’ is absurd, because the systematic and unrelenting oppression of Palestinians by Israel is exactly what is happening, and it has continued through endless ignored United Nations resolutions, regarding the Occupied Territories, Gaza, the Fence or Wall, etc., as well as long after the various attempts at negotiations—each given cosy, reassuring-sounding names such as Camp David, Oslo, the Road Map or whatever—have failed, and when those who are about to participate in the next futile round of talks are in no doubt that Israel will never give an inch, unless it suits them, and only them.
The ADL ‘Wheels of Justice’ article concludes:
| Quote: | Only the voices of our friends can kill the seeds of anti-Semitism….
Unfortunately, the truth is not enough. We need allies to stand up for the truth with us. As the new year begins, we need to be thankful for the allies we have and remain determined to go out and build relationships with the ones we still need. |
And that’s where they are so wrong. Far from killing the seeds of anti-Semitism, the ADL is nurturing them. For true justice, built on normal decency and the good faith of all parties concerned, the truth is enough, as long as it is the whole truth and it is not accompanied by a ‘bodyguard of lies’.
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The truth won't set you free, but identifying the liars could help make the world a better place. |
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Mark Gobell
On Gardening Leave
Joined: 24 Jul 2006
Posts: 4529
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 7:41 pm Post subject: |
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Good thread folks.
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The Medium is the Massage - Marshall McLuhan. |
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