Joined: 27 Mar 2006 Posts: 3187 Location: Here to help!
Posted: Sun May 27, 2007 3:12 pm Post subject:
Quote:
I have opened up to the truth about 9/11 and the New world Order. That does not mean I have to buy into the all this mind warp rubbish. To use this kind of doctrine is brainwashing by it's own merit. All the malignant powers of this world both past and present have used this type of garbage. it is wrong and is for the purely weak of will. I depend on this forum and others like it to expand the knowledge of the world elite. I always find myself in the position of having to explain to them to ignore the lunatic ratings of the "New Age Brigade. We have a serious debate in motion here regarding the wrong doing of the world elite. The last thing our movement needs is this kind of rhetoric. Also you appear to me to have a very smug attitude to those who do not hold with your belief system. Hitler held the same view. when we win the war against the elite. I hope to all goodness your type do not run things. We would then be in the same, or if not similar position as we are now.You are still being controlled by flawed teachings. That is dangerous too. If you wish to skew off the planet Earth, be my guest. But to infect a legitimate cause with this rubbish. Could prove to be damaging. You have a deliberate condescending attitude which shows your weakness.
Thanks for that Dave, wish you could hear yourself
At the risk of being boring, you are now trolling and gatekeeping: pack it in _________________ Free your Self and Free the World
Joined: 28 Jan 2007 Posts: 49 Location: North West
Posted: Sun May 27, 2007 3:15 pm Post subject:
If I said any of the following statements, would you contest any or think them "new Agey"?...
1) That electrons behave like waves if you don't watch them, and particles if you do (in other words the very act of observing causes them to behave differently)
2) that this change is measurable by interference patterns left or not left on an electron sensitive plate
3) that unwatched they go through each of two slits, neither and both at the same time (like the parrallel Universe model - all potential realities are accommodated).
4) that if you meausre the speed of a sub atomic particle then you can't determine its position, and vice versa
5) that previously paired electrons if seperated over thousands of miles will still relate to one another - if you change one then the other (thousands of miles away) responds instantly! This relates to Non-locality and Action at a distance.
..because all of these are true and proven by SCIENCE.
People might not like it - because it is a radical departure from Newtonian Materialism and the clockwork universe. But it is true - it is real science - hard science.
I am often shocked by the largely emotional response of those who claim to be scientific and not New Agey. Especially when they refuse to examine the science, and prefer a dogma.
I am not advocating that we sit on bean bag furniture and ooohhhmmm away 911. I am inviting others to consider other strategies in the cause that may actually be more effective - and dare I say it - Scientific.
I don't want my Karma to run over anyone's Dogma
Love and Peace,
ATWSOS _________________ Random Acts of Kindness Each Day also make a difference.
Joined: 27 Mar 2006 Posts: 486 Location: Manchester
Posted: Sun May 27, 2007 5:56 pm Post subject:
Down the Rabbit Hole or What the F+++ Do We Know are films / one and the same, that cover the double slit experiments findings. I don't dispute the hard science.
I agree that positive thought maybe at the least worth a shot. The Scholars for Truth had forum advocates pushing such ideas, and the campaigns to carry out activities on the 11th of each month are not bad ideas. They can only fail as much as we currently are, not that inroads havent been made.
As for Icke and others pushing such things, well perhaps they are and perhaps it does muddy the waters. The odd piece of positivity within a rather depressing overall subject matter filled with paranoia, even among its advocates is still welcome in my book however. A little unity may go along way but yes acid head hippies didn't get too far and Swampy was years behind the decision to build roads and runways. He tried though I guess. Not that Ben Elton's popcorn portrayal of similar did him any favours despite pointing out media bias
"i'll get my coat" _________________ The Peoples United Collective TPUC.ORG
Down the Rabbit Hole or What the F+++ Do We Know are films / one and the same, that cover the double slit experiments findings. I don't dispute the hard science.
I agree that positive thought maybe at the least worth a shot. The Scholars for Truth had forum advocates pushing such ideas, and the campaigns to carry out activities on the 11th of each month are not bad ideas. They can only fail as much as we currently are, not that inroads havent been made.
As for Icke and others pushing such things, well perhaps they are and perhaps it does muddy the waters. The odd piece of positivity within a rather depressing overall subject matter filled with paranoia, even among its advocates is still welcome in my book however. A little unity may go along way but yes acid head hippies didn't get too far and Swampy was years behind the decision to build roads and runways. He tried though I guess. Not that Ben Elton's popcorn portrayal of similar did him any favours despite pointing out media bias :)
"i'll get my coat"
Don't get your coat right now. I think you have a very well balanced view of this subject. you put you point very eloquently. Some people can only resort to personal attack when debated and challenged. Positive thought can be a very powerful tool when used with the collective and I believe we should have to be positive in this cause. I just do not hold with all this "Thought Transference". It smells like thought control taking away the individuals right of free thinking and individualism.
Joined: 27 Mar 2006 Posts: 3187 Location: Here to help!
Posted: Sun May 27, 2007 6:42 pm Post subject:
Quote:
Some people can only resort to personal attack when debated and challenged
I can only agree with that when you said this:
Quote:
I have opened up to the truth about 9/11 and the New world Order. That does not mean I have to buy into the all this mind warp rubbish. To use this kind of doctrine is brainwashing by it's own merit. All the malignant powers of this world both past and present have used this type of garbage. it is wrong and is for the purely weak of will. I depend on this forum and others like it to expand the knowledge of the world elite. I always find myself in the position of having to explain to them to ignore the lunatic ratings of the "New Age Brigade. We have a serious debate in motion here regarding the wrong doing of the world elite. The last thing our movement needs is this kind of rhetoric. Also you appear to me to have a very smug attitude to those who do not hold with your belief system. Hitler held the same view. when we win the war against the elite. I hope to all goodness your type do not run things. We would then be in the same, or if not similar position as we are now. You are still being controlled by flawed teachings. That is dangerous too. If you wish to skew off the planet Earth, be my guest. But to infect a legitimate cause with this rubbish. Could prove to be damaging. You have a deliberate condescending attitude which shows your weakness.
In response to this:
JW wrote:
Your sure having a big reaction to a single thread David. If you want a real discussion about Geo Politics: start a thread about Geo Politics
Don't assume anyone posting in this discussion isnt just as capable of tackling that subject too, and putting forward all the "credible" answers that meet your approval
Seems to me you could do with opening up a little and letting go a little more
Having, in your first post on this thread, said this:
Quote:
This is my view. And I will not debate it.
All I'm saying is:
Try and understand the contradiction in your own posting. Your not comfortable with these ideas. Thats fine: you dont have to be: but when we are posting against what makes us uncomfortable, its wise for all of us to take a check before hitting "submit", and if feeling at all wound up: take a pause, hit "back" instead and write a better post. This is hard earned advise that will make you a better communicator whether you are posting here, or on any other forum _________________ Free your Self and Free the World
Joined: 25 Jul 2005 Posts: 1959 Location: South London
Posted: Sun May 27, 2007 7:46 pm Post subject:
This is a very interesting thread. The main debate is between those who think thoughts affect the outcome of events and those who think that only pragmatic actions affect such outcomes.
I happen to think thoughts are vitally important, but they are frequently the progenitors of actions aimed at affecting events. There is evidence that suggests thought alone can affect events but it is not conspicuous and is often difficult to grasp.
People's characters differ widely. Some people are drawn towards prayer and meditation, others drawn to action. Each can often be intolerant of the other. And that is time-wasting, negative behaviour. We need to understand that it is different strokes for different folks. The mystic and the pragmatist can gain from each other and respect each other.
I am one of those who is drawn both to thoughts and to action. I have spent years meditating in spiritual groups and also in gaining insights from such practice into what actions I should follow. For me it is a two-track approach. When I find myself getting depressed or demoralised by the state of the world and how powerless I am to do much about it, I particularly seek spiritual refreshment in order to come back into balance. That refreshment can be found in many ways: meditation, music, humour, friendships, nature, the countryside, gardening, exercise etc.
Now we are faced with a problem within the 9/11 Truth Campaign. It has been tremendously encouraging to watch it grow suddenly in the past three years, but we have not yet broken through enough to be taken seriously by the chattering classes. I so frequently get told by people outside that we can never be taken seriously because our people keep talking about so much crazy New Age stuff: Illuminati, Icke, Lizards, UFOs, Chemtrails, Crop Circles, Free Masons etc. That kind of stuff puts off people like Long Tooth and David Sherlock.
I think I now see a divergence between on the one hand those who want to prove to the public that we have been lied to about 9/11 and other false flag terror events through factual evidence, and on the other hand those who want to explore the truth behind all sorts of other topics. I believe we can and should work separately but alongside each other in friendship, all being a part of the wider truth movement.
To be successful the 911 Truth Campaign needs to reach those who think the wider issues mentioned are a lot of hippy-dippy rubbish. But the fact remains that unless we can create a campaign which embraces those who think these things are rubbish we will not be able to get through to the majority of the general public.
Some people have said to me that the times they are a changing and soon everyone will see that we have been lied to about UFOs and Crop Circles, the power of thought etc etc, so we should just say it like it is. My response to that attitude is that time is short and it will be many years before the public in general share a New Age view. Therefore we need to use largely traditional campaigning methods to get through. Once the public have realised what an monstrous evil lie 9/11 was, they will be interested in uncovering the truth about other issues.
Having said that, paranoia is a pitfall once you start looking at this stuff. Whenever anyone says to me that the powers that be are doing this or that to suit their goal of total global control, I take a skeptical view and look for other solutions. If I give energy to the thought that there is a hidden hand of evil everywhere, that thought saps energy and motivation from me. I remember that there are good people working in every level of society and there is the potential for goodness in everyone. I also think it probable that New Age energies are coming into the world to inspire humanity to meet the current crisis, overcome the evil and survive as a species and as a planet.
I take strength from the many wonderful people who are putting so much energy into this campaign and feel sure we shall eventually make known the truth to all.
This is a very interesting thread. The main debate is between those who think thoughts affect the outcome of events and those who think that only pragmatic actions affect such outcomes.
I happen to think thoughts are vitally important, but they are frequently the progenitors of actions aimed at affecting events. There is evidence that suggests thought alone can affect events but it is not conspicuous and is often difficult to grasp.
People's characters differ widely. Some people are drawn towards prayer and meditation, others drawn to action. Each can often be intolerant of the other. And that is time-wasting, negative behaviour. We need to understand that it is different strokes for different folks. The mystic and the pragmatist can gain from each other and respect each other.
I am one of those who is drawn both to thoughts and to action. I have spent years meditating in spiritual groups and also in gaining insights from such practice into what actions I should follow. For me it is a two-track approach. When I find myself getting depressed or demoralised by the state of the world and how powerless I am to do much about it, I particularly seek spiritual refreshment in order to come back into balance. That refreshment can be found in many ways: meditation, music, humour, friendships, nature, the countryside, gardening, exercise etc.
Now we are faced with a problem within the 9/11 Truth Campaign. It has been tremendously encouraging to watch it grow suddenly in the past three years, but we have not yet broken through enough to be taken seriously by the chattering classes. I so frequently get told by people outside that we can never be taken seriously because our people keep talking about so much crazy New Age stuff: Illuminati, Icke, Lizards, UFOs, Chemtrails, Crop Circles, Free Masons etc. That kind of stuff puts off people like Long Tooth and David Sherlock.
I think I now see a divergence between on the one hand those who want to prove to the public that we have been lied to about 9/11 and other false flag terror events through factual evidence, and on the other hand those who want to explore the truth behind all sorts of other topics. I believe we can and should work separately but alongside each other in friendship, all being a part of the wider truth movement.
To be successful the 911 Truth Campaign needs to reach those who think the wider issues mentioned are a lot of hippy-dippy rubbish. But the fact remains that unless we can create a campaign which embraces those who think these things are rubbish we will not be able to get through to the majority of the general public.
Some people have said to me that the times they are a changing and soon everyone will see that we have been lied to about UFOs and Crop Circles, the power of thought etc etc, so we should just say it like it is. My response to that attitude is that time is short and it will be many years before the public in general share a New Age view. Therefore we need to use largely traditional campaigning methods to get through. Once the public have realised what an monstrous evil lie 9/11 was, they will be interested in uncovering the truth about other issues.
Having said that, paranoia is a pitfall once you start looking at this stuff. Whenever anyone says to me that the powers that be are doing this or that to suit their goal of total global control, I take a skeptical view and look for other solutions. If I give energy to the thought that there is a hidden hand of evil everywhere, that thought saps energy and motivation from me. I remember that there are good people working in every level of society and there is the potential for goodness in everyone. I also think it probable that New Age energies are coming into the world to inspire humanity to meet the current crisis, overcome the evil and survive as a species and as a planet.
I take strength from the many wonderful people who are putting so much energy into this campaign and feel sure we shall eventually make known the truth to all.
Xmasdale. That was a very well balanced view. Well done. That is the attitude we need in this movement.
Some people can only resort to personal attack when debated and challenged
I can only agree with that when you said this:
Quote:
I have opened up to the truth about 9/11 and the New world Order. That does not mean I have to buy into the all this mind warp rubbish. To use this kind of doctrine is brainwashing by it's own merit. All the malignant powers of this world both past and present have used this type of garbage. it is wrong and is for the purely weak of will. I depend on this forum and others like it to expand the knowledge of the world elite. I always find myself in the position of having to explain to them to ignore the lunatic ratings of the "New Age Brigade. We have a serious debate in motion here regarding the wrong doing of the world elite. The last thing our movement needs is this kind of rhetoric. Also you appear to me to have a very smug attitude to those who do not hold with your belief system. Hitler held the same view. when we win the war against the elite. I hope to all goodness your type do not run things. We would then be in the same, or if not similar position as we are now. You are still being controlled by flawed teachings. That is dangerous too. If you wish to skew off the planet Earth, be my guest. But to infect a legitimate cause with this rubbish. Could prove to be damaging. You have a deliberate condescending attitude which shows your weakness.
In response to this:
JW wrote:
Your sure having a big reaction to a single thread David. If you want a real discussion about Geo Politics: start a thread about Geo Politics
Don't assume anyone posting in this discussion isnt just as capable of tackling that subject too, and putting forward all the "credible" answers that meet your approval
Seems to me you could do with opening up a little and letting go a little more
Having, in your first post on this thread, said this:
Quote:
This is my view. And I will not debate it.
All I'm saying is:
Try and understand the contradiction in your own posting. Your not comfortable with these ideas. Thats fine: you dont have to be: but when we are posting against what makes us uncomfortable, its wise for all of us to take a check before hitting "submit", and if feeling at all wound up: take a pause, hit "back" instead and write a better post. This is hard earned advise that will make you a better communicator whether you are posting here, or on any other forum
My view was never a personal attack on an individual. It was a synoptic view on the New Age genre as a whole. You attacked me personly, saying I am Trolling (what ever that means). Still I will not hold a grudge. We have a common goal. God Bless.
'Rude Awakenings' well thats the ticket positive thoughts flowing here I see, thats start a slagging match over a few positive posts whether they're right lines of thought or not to follow!
Chances are as with JFK we'll never find or corner the true culprits of 9/11, its what we do with our lives now we're awake to the issues, that is more to the point! A change in outlook is required to prevent the same mistakes (it doesn't mean away with the fairies)
Jumping up and down on street corners demanding the heads of Bush and Blair is also not going to give our movement credibility!
If you demand Trial by Fire then your sure to get it, I just hope I'm quietly out of the way if the * hits the fan _________________ 'Come and see the violence inherent in the system.
Help, help, I'm being repressed!'
“The more you tighten your grip, the more Star Systems will slip through your fingers.”
The negativity started with Long Tooth but you posted this long before anyone came back with anything personal:-
Quote:
It is this New Age kind of nonsense that gives us a bad name. Anyone reading this would think we are a bunch of "New Age" freaks. we have a serious agenda here regarding Geo-politics. all this is way off the mark. Controlling peoples minds is one thing. but we cannot control our own destiny by thought suggestion. Yes we can create our own reality, but not from using the mind in some metaphysical sense. Once the thought process as been manifest, it then becomes physical. Only by raising our voices can we start to bring change. there is no cosmic energy at work here. No deity. It is just about politics and that is what we need to change. Flying Humanoids. UFO's, Lizards. All BS. Keep to the politics and win the war on oppression.
This is my view. And I will not debate it. Because the real world is what we are fighting in. Not some New Age spiritual realm of of the hippy mind.
all i can add is the following Donald Sutherland quote
Quote:
'Less of the negative waves Moriarty'
"New Age" freaks indeed, its Sir Freak to you _________________ 'Come and see the violence inherent in the system.
Help, help, I'm being repressed!'
“The more you tighten your grip, the more Star Systems will slip through your fingers.”
The negativity started with Long Tooth but you posted this long before anyone came back with anything personal:-
Quote:
It is this New Age kind of nonsense that gives us a bad name. Anyone reading this would think we are a bunch of "New Age" freaks. we have a serious agenda here regarding Geo-politics. all this is way off the mark. Controlling peoples minds is one thing. but we cannot control our own destiny by thought suggestion. Yes we can create our own reality, but not from using the mind in some metaphysical sense. Once the thought process as been manifest, it then becomes physical. Only by raising our voices can we start to bring change. there is no cosmic energy at work here. No deity. It is just about politics and that is what we need to change. Flying Humanoids. UFO's, Lizards. All BS. Keep to the politics and win the war on oppression.
This is my view. And I will not debate it. Because the real world is what we are fighting in. Not some New Age spiritual realm of of the hippy mind.
all i can add is the following Donald Sutherland quote
Quote:
'Less of the negative waves Moriarty'
"New Age" freaks indeed, its Sir Freak to you ;)
Time for a reality check guys. This is called nineeleven.co.uk. Not New age freaks'R'us. I think one should go to "Utopiated for Flying Humanoids and Fairies.
The negativity started with Long Tooth but you posted this long before anyone came back with anything personal:-
Quote:
It is this New Age kind of nonsense that gives us a bad name. Anyone reading this would think we are a bunch of "New Age" freaks. we have a serious agenda here regarding Geo-politics. all this is way off the mark. Controlling peoples minds is one thing. but we cannot control our own destiny by thought suggestion. Yes we can create our own reality, but not from using the mind in some metaphysical sense. Once the thought process as been manifest, it then becomes physical. Only by raising our voices can we start to bring change. there is no cosmic energy at work here. No deity. It is just about politics and that is what we need to change. Flying Humanoids. UFO's, Lizards. All BS. Keep to the politics and win the war on oppression.
This is my view. And I will not debate it. Because the real world is what we are fighting in. Not some New Age spiritual realm of of the hippy mind.
all i can add is the following Donald Sutherland quote
Quote:
'Less of the negative waves Moriarty'
"New Age" freaks indeed, its Sir Freak to you
disco,
your interpretation is i started the negativity, thats okay, millions died in two world wars (including my grandfather to give you/us the right to be wrong), my interpretation of my post is reality, granted my reality.
My response to the opening gambit of the thread was balance, my 'reality' is as other posters state, this fantacising about the future comes across to me as negativity, negativity for 9/11 truth. I have asked for links and all i have gotten so far is some woman peddling her best seller with claims of 400 people making a leaf glow!!! well i am a little bit harder to convert than most, its not as if faking could not occur, especially when a best seller and hundreds of thousaands of dollars are to be creamed off unsuspecting gullables.
where is the info on the 'scientists' taking part? no doubt i have to shell out $50 to find this out?
one only has to look at the photos of the people on the link and my 'instinct' tells me all is not well, everyone peddling wares for money? hmmm.
one persons positivity is anothers negativity, another persons negativity is anothers reality.
as is usual when one starts to ask the most simpliest of questions, into such topics, the goalposts seem to change.
dont put that analogy in, thats not allowed, its not disimilar to these american sales teams, whip everyone up, dazzle them with positives, then sack them when they make no sales!!!!!
Imagine some news item with condoloser rice warbbling on about all the positives of bombing iraq, where would we be if one is censored from a 'negative' question to her?
I think the thread was started from a general worry that all the negative posts about ID, chips, and elites being bullies in general all the other stuff. We maybe helping who we are fighting!
If any 'prols' came across this site by accident they may well run straight back to where they come from and bolt the door!
This thread has everything to do with having a positive mindset and outlook! It has nothing to do with seeing or dreaming of the future.
On the science and philosophy stuff:-
My personal view on science and life in general is anything is possible why limit ourselves now if only I could act on that maybe hmm just maybe _________________ 'Come and see the violence inherent in the system.
Help, help, I'm being repressed!'
“The more you tighten your grip, the more Star Systems will slip through your fingers.”
Some people can only resort to personal attack when debated and challenged
I can only agree with that when you said this:
Quote:
I have opened up to the truth about 9/11 and the New world Order. That does not mean I have to buy into the all this mind warp rubbish. To use this kind of doctrine is brainwashing by it's own merit. All the malignant powers of this world both past and present have used this type of garbage. it is wrong and is for the purely weak of will. I depend on this forum and others like it to expand the knowledge of the world elite. I always find myself in the position of having to explain to them to ignore the lunatic ratings of the "New Age Brigade. We have a serious debate in motion here regarding the wrong doing of the world elite. The last thing our movement needs is this kind of rhetoric. Also you appear to me to have a very smug attitude to those who do not hold with your belief system. Hitler held the same view. when we win the war against the elite. I hope to all goodness your type do not run things. We would then be in the same, or if not similar position as we are now. You are still being controlled by flawed teachings. That is dangerous too. If you wish to skew off the planet Earth, be my guest. But to infect a legitimate cause with this rubbish. Could prove to be damaging. You have a deliberate condescending attitude which shows your weakness.
In response to this:
JW wrote:
Your sure having a big reaction to a single thread David. If you want a real discussion about Geo Politics: start a thread about Geo Politics
Don't assume anyone posting in this discussion isnt just as capable of tackling that subject too, and putting forward all the "credible" answers that meet your approval
Seems to me you could do with opening up a little and letting go a little more
Having, in your first post on this thread, said this:
Quote:
This is my view. And I will not debate it.
All I'm saying is:
Try and understand the contradiction in your own posting. Your not comfortable with these ideas. Thats fine: you dont have to be: but when we are posting against what makes us uncomfortable, its wise for all of us to take a check before hitting "submit", and if feeling at all wound up: take a pause, hit "back" instead and write a better post. This is hard earned advise that will make you a better communicator whether you are posting here, or on any other forum
400 people under scientific study made a leaf glow. Is that correct? I was listening to Talk sport radio when some guy who was a guest was supposed to be bringing the dead back to this world claiming that they had actually gone to another universe parallel to this one. This was done under scientific control. That died a natural death as will this crazy women Lynne McTaggart after she has made a killing from anyone foolish enough to believe this tripe. If you believe this, then you will believe that Pastor Benny Hinn can bring the dead to life again by touching them against your TV screen. Or that Reinhard Bonnke http://unsolvedmysteries.com/usm295278.html has raised people from the dead. As a researcher working along side the CRN The Christian Research Network. I have had written testimony from families destroyed by these fanatical liars. People like Lynne McTaggart, Benny Hinn, Reinhard Bonnke, Creflo Dollar, Pat Robertson, Kenneth and Gloria Copeland and many other of these fake mongers are waiting in the wings to jump out and exploit the truly gullible. How can people who are awake enough to see the what is happening in the world on the political arena be sucked in by this rubbish. As we have seen with the global Warming with the IPCC scientist will lie or can be taken out of context. you act like I am some kind of novice. I have been involved with the research of the spurious occults and cults for the 20 years. I have been in the middle of these occults, infiltrated them at personal risk. I have been attacked and threatened. I am seeing the parallel examples here with this cult of "Thought Projection" thinking. One challenges, one get attacked. You act like you are spiritual enlightened people, but when challenged you attack. like lowly pack animals. I was a Christian minister for a long time and see Christian become a cult in itself. I embarked on a program to infiltrate and expose the occult, many times at personal risk. This thought projection is showing all the typical signs of the above mentioned genre. These people lie to you for money, power and social standing. Why get sucked in?
Xmas Dale is the man! A logical and thought provoking response.
Quote:
"where is the info on the 'scientists' taking part?
If "the scientists" proved that positive thoughts change reality there would be a wall street crash!
I dont like this term "new age" as mentioned before positive thougts through worship or meditation is nothing new and has taken place since before 5 BC.
Xmas Dale is the man! A logical and thought provoking response.
Quote:
Whenever anyone says to me that the powers that be are doing this or that to suit their goal of total global control, I take a skeptical view and look for other solutions. If I give energy to the thought that there is a hidden hand of evil everywhere, that thought saps energy and motivation from me. I remember that there are good people working in every level of society and there is the potential for goodness in everyone. I also think it probable that New Age energies are coming into the world to inspire humanity to meet the current crisis, overcome the evil and survive as a species and as a planet.
If "the scientists" proved that positive thoughts change reality there would be a wall street crash!
I dont like this term "new age" as mentioned before positive thoughts through worship or meditation is nothing new and has taken place since before 5 BC.
Xmas Dale is the man! A logical and thought provoking response.
Quote:
Whenever anyone says to me that the powers that be are doing this or that to suit their goal of total global control, I take a skeptical view and look for other solutions. If I give energy to the thought that there is a hidden hand of evil everywhere, that thought saps energy and motivation from me. I remember that there are good people working in every level of society and there is the potential for goodness in everyone. I also think it probable that New Age energies are coming into the world to inspire humanity to meet the current crisis, overcome the evil and survive as a species and as a planet.
If "the scientists" proved that positive thoughts change reality there would be a wall street crash!
just visited the link from Rense!!! Water with a Hitler label written in Japenese looks like this it claims,!!! hehe, and then some astronaut claims to have delivered some ESP experiments succesfully.
Notice the emotive words, Hitler/Japenese, does the water have an ability to read and intelligently decipher history? Notice the 'reputable' source ie astronaunt to put a 'good' spin on the allegations.
My reality is, astranaut=moon landings hoax=NASA=liars.
The water labelled with a Hitler label written in Japenese, i havant laughed at something so ridiculous since the 19 arabs living in caves with boxcutters did it, because 'they' hate my freedom!!!!.
Do you believe that water has an intellect that can read Japenese and analyse the word Hitler, and then change its structure akin to (what looks like in the microscopic image in the rense link) an atomic bomb aftermath going through fire in a black hole?
I'd rather you post links of the names of the scientists, venues etc that are veryfying these experiments, rather than spurious claims of miracles.
Perhaps when Icke practices what he preaches i may start to take him more seriously, until then i am giving him the widest berth possible.
Joined: 28 Jan 2007 Posts: 49 Location: North West
Posted: Mon May 28, 2007 7:50 pm Post subject:
It is interesting to see how few of my original points have been considered seriously. Perhaps I made my suggestions clumsily?
Instead, the thread has been "hijacked" to address largely different agendas - e.g. to debunk New Agers, David Icke, and a whole host af apparent anti-science.
Ironically, I think that if the debunkers where to examine (non-emotionally) the genuine strangeness of Quantum Mechanics (from which my "Intent" points came) then they would be surprised to find that the universe they live in is indeed affected by consciousness; and it is indeed non intuitive (particles can move backwards in time, and single electrons can travel multiple directions at once to arrive at a finite point).
I feel saddened by the tone of many of the previous posts - I am comfortable with people disagreeing with me - but the sneering tone, the unwillingness to examine science, the smug pillory of those who may have "New Age" views, the dogmatic refusal to explore the issues, all stike me as uncharacteristic of those interested in Peace and Truth.
The degree to which my suggestions challenged others' dogma might be directly proportional to the level of aggression and sneering used in some people's replies.
I believe that any reasonable person re-reading my previous posts will see that I am not advocating "burying my head in the sand" or "sitting on my arse and doing nothing." On the contrary - I believe that if we simply carry on as we are - we might be doing just that.
I have suggested that we might unwittingly be collaborators with those we wish to remove from office. I had hoped it might be considered and reflected upon.
But if you prefer to post one another little films to sneer at instead, then I think it's very sad for the movement. Your departure from the original topic of this thread is conspicuous.
Re: 911 Truth...We might not be winning...
...which is a very sobering thought...
...I was simply suggesting another possible tool in our armoury, and reflecting on the possible detrimental things we might be (unwittingly) doing.
Love and peace,
PS. Don't think of a Pink Elephant
xx _________________ Random Acts of Kindness Each Day also make a difference.
Allthatweseeorseem
Ok, maybe I regret posting the David Icke video now. It seems to do more damage than good it seems. I am sorry now.
I am not part of his fan club and disagree with him on several major points.
However, we can't all be highly anayltical scientific researchers. I am not.
A forum is meant to be is an instrument of discourse and words are often arbitary and misunderstood.
Your original post was genuinely moving and very pleasing to read.
"For example, if we as (a collective of hundreds, maybe thousands) got into a relaxed state, and then imagined (fully using all the senses) a much better world. Could we start to influence the world for the better. My fear is that we might already be doing this (for the worse) by reminding ourselves daily of the bad things that are going on, and how bad it will be if the neocons get their way."
Joined: 25 Jul 2005 Posts: 1959 Location: South London
Posted: Mon May 28, 2007 11:50 pm Post subject:
AllThatWeSeeOrSeem wrote:
Ironically, I think that if the debunkers where to examine (non-emotionally) the genuine strangeness of Quantum Mechanics (from which my "Intent" points came) then they would be surprised to find that the universe they live in is indeed affected by consciousness; and it is indeed non intuitive (particles can move backwards in time, and single electrons can travel multiple directions at once to arrive at a finite point).
I believe all of us should be aware of the strangeness of quantum mechanics and "What the Bleep to we Know" or "Down the Rabbit Hole", a movie which largely features scientists in that field doing their best to explain modern discoveries in this field, is not a bad explanation of it for the lay person. I am not a scientist and I suppose can only tentatively grasp even Newtonian physics. Once Einstein came along things changed into something I still can't get my head around: "Time dilates as the speed of light approaches". If you say so, Dr Einstein, but I have to take your word for it and I know that it's only a theory and you may be wrong. Quantum mechanics goes even further and it's all a mystery to me, but one thing I do find interesting about it is that much of what scientists are now saying about this stuff accords with the wisdom of the ancients and the insights of mystics throughout the ages.
So when the scientists and the mystics agree, the only people left out are those who are so sure mysticism is mumbo-jumbo that they refuse to be open to the possibility that these people may be on to something. This to me is the mid-set of the 19th century: "We know how the world works now; Newton and Darwin have solved it for us. There is no God, no hereafter - religious people are just weak-minded fools who prefer to delude themselves than to face reality; mystics are just deluded escapists who utter incomprehensible mumbo-jumbo. We live in the scientific age now and science will solve all our problems."
But, if we look at the records, we discover that Newton was an astrologer and an alchemist - strange! There is a record of him getting into a furious argument with another scientist who argued that astrology was bunkum. Newton's parting shot was: "I have studied the subject, Sir. You have not".
AllThatWeSeeOrSeem wrote:
I believe that any reasonable person re-reading my previous posts will see that I am not advocating "burying my head in the sand" or "sitting on my arse and doing nothing." On the contrary - I believe that if we simply carry on as we are - we might be doing just that.
I have suggested that we might unwittingly be collaborators with those we wish to remove from office. I had hoped it might be considered and reflected upon.
You may be right, but I think we should concentrate on the progress our campaign is making, rather than the awfulness of what the powers that be are up to. That is surely positive thinking and cannot be detrimental.
AllThatWeSeeOrSeem wrote:
Re: 911 Truth...We might not be winning...
...which is a very sobering thought...
You may be right about that too, but I have been campaigning on this issue for over three years now and have witnessed fantastically encouraging growth in our supporters and a noticeable change in the attitudes of the public over that time, despite the subbornness of the media; though this year has demonstrated that local media will now cover us; it's just the national papers and broadcasting networks who resist.
So this is certainly no time to get discouraged and to think we are doing it all wrong. But I think we would find it beneficial not to direct our anger at those who are merely pawns in the hands of the big players in the power game, but to recognise that we too are pawns within a system from which it is well nigh impossible to escape completely. People get unwittingly led into situations where they are pressured and seduced to conform. We've all been there. None of is untainted by the system; some of us are just beginning to wake up; that's all. Let's not get angry at those who just want to snooze for a little longer. They are our brothers and sisters after all.
AllThatWeSeeOrSeem wrote:
...I was simply suggesting another possible tool in our armoury, and reflecting on the possible detrimental things we might be (unwittingly) doing.
Yes positive thought is another tool in our armoury, but in my book not an alternative to pragmatic action.
At the risk of being too facetious, may I just suggest these sayings:
"To be or not to be..." - William Shakespeare.
"To be is to do..." - Jean-Paul Satre
"Be do be doo be doo" - Frank Sinatra
LMAO:
but as for Long Tooth and Sherlock is it not true that the Human form is over 90% water and we all return to the Water Table does that not mean Water is the oneness of the world or indeed the source of life itself??
Have it you! you liquid born entities you!! _________________ 'Come and see the violence inherent in the system.
Help, help, I'm being repressed!'
“The more you tighten your grip, the more Star Systems will slip through your fingers.”
At the risk of being too facetious, may I just suggest these sayings:
"To be or not to be..." - William Shakespeare.
"To be is to do..." - Jean-Paul Satre
"Be do be doo be doo" - Frank Sinatra
LMAO:
but as for Long Tooth and Sherlock is it not true that the Human form is over 90% water and we all return to the Water Table does that not mean Water is the oneness of the world or indeed the source of life itself??
Have it you! you liquid born entities you!!
Yes I quite like the idea of the shapeshiters in Star Trek (forget their real name) but if we were 90% carbon maybe oil would be the source of life _________________ 'Come and see the violence inherent in the system.
Help, help, I'm being repressed!'
“The more you tighten your grip, the more Star Systems will slip through your fingers.”
Really interesting thread here, and I risk perhaps taking it off on a tengent but I cannot help but feel there is an interesting link towards the science behind this theory and the use of Ketamine as a mind dissasociative.
I shall not bore you with the details, but during during my own use of this recreational drug there has indeed been far too many incidents where things have happened, people have come in to my life that I felt beforehand would actually come to be.
I have since been reading in to Jungian Synchronicity and John Lilly, and despite not being confident enough in my own academic ability to offer a profound explanation of what I am getting at, I am now a firm believer that our consiousness is able to create our surroundings.
How this all links in to quantum theory I am not yet able to say. _________________ SAPERE AUDE
What a synchronicity!
i was reading Jung yesterday. Heres something that google found on it.
synchronicity
"Synchronicity is an explanatory principle, according to its creator, Carl Jung. Synchronicity explains "meaningful coincidences," such as a beetle flying into his room while a patient was describing a dream about a scarab. The scarab is an Egyptian symbol of rebirth, he noted. Therefore, the propitious moment of the flying beetle indicated that the transcendental meaning of both the scarab in the dream and the insect in the room was that the patient needed to be liberated from her excessive rationalism. His notion of synchronicity is that there is an acausal principle that links events having a similar meaning by their coincidence in time rather than sequentially. He claimed that there is a synchrony between the mind and the phenomenal world of perception.
What reasons are there for accepting synchronicity as an explanation for anything in the real world? What it explains is more simply and elegantly explained by the ability of the human mind to find meaning and significance where there is none (apophenia). Jung's defense of acausal connections is so inane I hesitate to repeat it. He argues that "acausal phenomena must exist...since statistics are only possible anyway if there are also exceptions" (1973, Letters, 2:426). He asserts that "...improbable facts exist--otherwise there would be no statistical mean..." (ibid.: 2:374). Finally, he claims that "the premise of probability simultaneously postulates the existence of the improbable" (ibid. : 2:540). However, if you think of all the pairs of things that can happen in a person's lifetime, and add to that our very versatile ability of finding meaningful connections between things, it then seems likely that most of us will experience many meaningful coincidences. The coincidences are predictable but we are the ones who give them meaning."
Really interesting thread here, and I risk perhaps taking it off on a tengent but I cannot help but feel there is an interesting link towards the science behind this theory and the use of Ketamine as a mind dissasociative.
I shall not bore you with the details, but during during my own use of this recreational drug there has indeed been far too many incidents where things have happened, people have come in to my life that I felt beforehand would actually come to be.
I have since been reading in to Jungian Synchronicity and John Lilly, and despite not being confident enough in my own academic ability to offer a profound explanation of what I am getting at, I am now a firm believer that our consiousness is able to create our surroundings.
How this all links in to quantum theory I am not yet able to say. :(
Obviously out for the weekend from the institution. What a bunch of tripe, if I ever heard it. I'm sorry SJF, Ketamine and spurious philosophy readings. what is it comming to.
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Thanks for that Dave, wish you could hear yourself
Then, my work is done !
