I've been put on a Terrorist Data Base List!

[Stephen]

I was giving leaflets and flyers out yesterday for the William Rodriruez talk in Liverpool and was stop by the police and Searched and Questioned Under the Terrorisiom Act! And was told I have been put on a Terrorisiom Data Base List? Plus had All my Rodriguez stuff taken off me

Whats going on ? I won't be going near a Air Port in the future

Can anyone give me some adivce.

I'm now waiting for them to turn up in there Darth Vader Gear at Five o'clock in the mourning to take me away.

[TonyGosling]

I hope that's a 'stopping terrorism' database. Really this is beyond insanity and well into psycopathology. We are all committed to stopping mass killing and terror which is being waged largely by NATO and the Western Establishment and Media in cahoots against their own people and successfully fuelling real terrorism.

No doubt if you are implicated in a future attack you'll be a "clean skin" too

I honestly think you should write up your experience properly and send a letter to your local paper and to all the national broadsheets.

[ian neal]

Outrageous if predictable development

It is wise if we all brush up on what rights we do have left

Here is a summary

http://www.liberty-human-rights.org.uk/issues/6-free-speech/s44-terror ism-act/index.shtml

Please consider making a formal complaint

[coconut]

I would not be surprised at all if it transpired that I was already on a "terrorism" watch list.

You should force yourself not to fear the police. Stand up to them and know your rights (what few we have left in the West these days).

[Stephen]

I don't feel safe to make a complant to the police, I've heard stories about the police, and don't think it would make any diffrence, as far as the Local papers and broard sheets go I'm not sure.

I'd like to do a Gandi or Martin Luither, but the reality is that I'm not them and have my own simple problems in life like finding a job that I can do and living from day to day. This is the last thing that I need!

[Stephen]

[Leiff]

It sounds like they are getting mixed up between terrorism and activism.

[Stephen]

[flamesong]

When I got arrested at the G8 I was going through the process of getting charged when the desk officer told me I was listed as an animal rights activist - despite never having been involved with animal rights - though I once interviewed an animal rights activist at a demonstration.

When I got home I contacted the most senior officers I could identify within the police but I simply got a pro-forma letter saying that if I wanted to see my record it would cost me £10.00 - as if I didn't know what was on it!

I had the (good) fortune to bump into the Deputy Chief of Police for Lancashire and bent his ear but he said that there is little if anything I can do. So, I am labelled. It didn't help that when we were arrested at the G8, other members of my affinity group had written my mobile number with ALF next to it but fortunately that never became an issue.

Since a little anti-NWO graffiti activity last year which resulted in another arrest, I'm certain that my PNC profile has been 'enhanced'. Fortunately, I have no plans to travel to America.

[Light Infantree]

[Andrew Johnson]

I think you are entitled to know the names of the officers and you are entitled to have whatever was confiscated returned.

I will check to see what the complaints procedure is. I would complain enclosing copies of the leaflets and describe exactly what you were doing.

It is up to us to de-programme the robotic behaviour of police officers who were acting in a way which infringes basic rights.

In other words, it was the police who broke the REAL law, not you.

I would also consider contacting local press with your story and expose these heavy-handed police tactics as carefully as possible. However, you may not find them sympathetic.

[xmasdale]

Strikes me we should all write to the Liverpool Echo

Contact details
Address: PO Box 48 Old Hall Street, Liverpool L69 3EB
Main - Tel: 0151 227 2000 Fax: 0151 472 2474 send a fax
E-mail: newsdesk@liverpoolecho.co.uk
Website: http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk

giving the facts and asking what the heck are the police doing classifying as a potential terrorist someone who is advertising a talk by a five times decorated hero of 9/11.

Would you be happy for us to do that, Stephen?

We could also write to the Merseyside chief constable in similar vein.

If we write to the Echo today, Thursday, it will give extra publicity to Willy's talk.

Best

Noel

[rubber_ritchie]

It's funny that they've said you're an animal rights protestor as animal rights people have been hit a lot by these sort of laws. Mainly because their campaigns have been successful. In the last year, people doing animal rights street stalls have had the whole thing confiscated by the police when in the same town the SWP/Stop War people go unchallenged.

[karlos]

The only solution is the UK truth movement must register itself become a legal campaign group with a membership and fundraising and raise it's public profile. Being a loose collective of anarchists means all of us will be picked on and bullied.

Becoming a political party gives you the right to campaign freely. Being an unknown group means you have no rights.

I suggest we do it soon or become extinct.
SWP and the BNP can say what they like they are legal registered groups.

[Stephen]

[ian neal]

This is the WHOLE point of how we are structured

1) there is an official campaign, with a committee which aspires to be professional and credible www.911truthcampaign.net and then

2) we have this forum and related email networks which is anarchic and loose and encourages everyone to speak their own truth but which doesn't pretend to be professional or credible

The 2 are separate but complementary

In my opinion and in the opinion of many others when this has been suggested before, a political party would be the wrong route to go down. Just imagining the process by which a manifesto and candidates is agreed fills me with dread. But that is not to say individuals shouldn't stand on a truth platform as independent candidates.

Besides I have zero faith in hierarchical political parties and democracy as it is currently practised in this country to deliver the change we need.

Plus we don't need to be members of a party to have rights

[karlos]

Unions have rights because of collective bargaining.

A loose collective with no manifesto and no rules and no collective bargaining means individuals CAN be labelled subversives.
What benefits are gained from the loose collective?
The advantages of unions, political parties, etc is that many small voices unite to form a big voice.

All of you have said that no political party speaks for you. So while Britain still is a 'democracy' use your remaining civil liberties to form the UK Truth party. You all say SWP are part of the system. well you too can be part of the system. Britain needs a NONE OF THE ABOVE party.

I dont like committees which remind me of the EU the USSR and CHINA i prefer one member one vote and real democracy.

Soon they will start to ban bloggers and prosecute them for comments. That includes us.
Before leafletting and public meetings and blogging and distributing dvds gets banned completely action is needed to preserve the voice of sanity in Britain. We love our country and we can all see it going down the drain. We need to become part of the establishment in order to have any influence and to stop fascist Britain happening under our watch.

Playing the system according to the rules is the only solution.
The day will come when we will no longer have the oportunity to choose, while we still have it lets not waste it.

I want to feel proud and tell people i am a UK Truth party member and for that to have meaning and gravitas. Not be treated as another conspiracy nutter. Respectability comes with becoming legal.

[ian neal]

[TonyGosling]

Hang on a minute we ARE an intensely political campaign ... but just like any efficient tribe we don't need an all powerful leader. All sucessful movements delegate responsibility and the way I see it we should have two or three key spokespeople but no leader per se.
It's the idea, informed analysis for peace and truth, that is in charge.

[karlos]

[Stephen]

Thanks for all of the support and advise from everyone

Best Wishes

Stephen.

[Reflecter]

Sorry to hear of your predicament Stephen and I feel much of the above advise of complaining and notifying your MP and the press is a good route, as you really weren't doing anything wrong.

I suppose it wont be long before we're all getting falsely accused of things like this soon aswell. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/6897054.stm

The irony of being placed on a Terrorist database when we are campaigning that we largely don't believe any exist is staggering.

[Disco_Destroyer]

They need to get there 219 Terror Cells from somewhere

[karlos]

Hello Stephen, George Galloway mentioned you on his show Friday night on Talksport.

keep up the good work mate

[Stephen]

[Stephen]

[utopiated]

This has been going on for years now - not only from a "terrorist" angle but the whole DNA database thing.

I was questioned by Leeds CID a few years ago for a some hammed up public order thing - it went to court and got thrown out for being [in the actual words of the magistrates] "a silly waste of time".

However I of course by that time had been swabbed - I was one of the first to get DNA taken based on simply attending a police interview since that law of Mr Bliar's had come in. Also my fingerprints were taken and scanned into this machine that sent them direct to Washington.

After the court case I wrote to the cops and demanded they take me off the PNC and any other evidence databases that were part of the process. This inspector wrote back and said they had destroyed all but the swabs as this was now legal whether charged or not.

In addition I'll point out that anyone linked to activism against the criminal justice bill or anti-rave/festival legislation will also be databased already via Operation Nomad. Several times my car registration and address details were taken and I can guarantee this database was never cleared either.

I think the best tactic is to get as many people as possible onto terrorist databases so that it becomes a pointless system. We should all commit a minor crime en-mass and get signed up

[Andrew Johnson]

Stephen asked me to post the leaflet files for him, so here they are.

Download from this link if you can't download the attachment.

http://www.checktheevidence.com/911/S-Bamber-Rodriguez%20Files.zip

[Long Tooth]

[xmasdale]

I've just received this from Stephen. Sorry but my slow dial-up PC can't handle the attachments: -

Here's what happened to me on Tuesday 3rd July2007 - as far as I can remember. There is more, but I can't recall everything - most of the important stuff is here, though.

This was a stressful situation for me.

I was giving out leaflets for about an hour before the police stopped me, I was giving out flyers and Posters on Bold Street in Liverpool Town Centre when I was stopped by two policemen and asked what I was doing. I told them I was giving out leaflets for the William Rodriguez “Last Man Out of the North Tower” talk in Liverpool, and then the two policemen started getting verbally aggressive and intimidating straight away by saying….

"Are you making money out of this!? Is Rodriguez making money out of people!?"
I said "No, what's the problem? I'm only giving out flyers."

Then, they stopped and cautioned me - under the Terrorism act - they body-searched me and confiscated all my Rodriguez leaflets/flyers. They took my details and made a call on the radio and they told me they had put me on the “Terrorist List”. They said I was acting suspiciously.

One of the policemen asked me if I was "anti-disestablishment".
I said, "Yes!" (I think he probably meant "anti-establishment", but he said "anti-disestablishment".)
They said, "What about the firemen?"
I said, "I'm not against the firemen."
They asked, "Where did I find out about this Rodriguez guy?"
I said, "From the 9-11 Website." I told them I didn't think Muslims "did" 9/11.
They said they wanted to look in my bag. I said "OK."
They asked me if I had any sharp objects. I said "Only a pair of scissors for cutting up leaflets."

I had more stuff in my bag - A4 papers, leaflets, postcards some DVDs etc. These were all for the talk that evening.

The policeman said, "Are you going to give this out as well?"
I said “No! That's for the Casa! That's for the Casa!” (The Casa is the venue where William Rodriguez was to speak at).

They nearly took it, but I became submissive, because I didn't want to lose all my stuff - I had just spent a lot of money on it - I told them I had just spent quite a bit on the printing. I had to hold all the things out of my pockets - in my hands. As I held my arms up, they body-searched me - treating me as if I was a criminal/terrorist. I'm a peaceful person!

They asked, "Do you have any ID?"
I said, "Why do I need ID?"
The policeman said, "That wasn't what I asked you."
He said again, "Any ID?"
I said, "No."

The 2 policemen told me that if I wanted to complain, I would have to go to a certain police station, but I can't remember the name of it, because I wasn't listening. They started lecturing me, saying things like "Where would we be without the Police?". They said they would give me the benefit of the doubt. I had to "back down" and kind of say "a three bags full, sir".

I thought afterwards how I'd just been stopped under the terrorism act - there's no benefit to that. I felt that I couldn't stick up for myself, because they would have arrested me - that's the impression they gave me. I didn't want to miss the night at the Casa and end up in jail!

And then they walked off with my WR leaflets. I felt that they had totally abused their power and that they had "got off" on their power trip.

---------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------

Thank you to Andrew Johnson for helping me put together my account of what happened.

I've attached the flyers and leaflets I was handing out, plus the Police Stop form I was given, It's clearly marked Terrorism.