Were explosives in the twin towers for years?

[dookie]

All of us must have had some really good thought out answers to questions that we have asked the blind and ignorant. But top this if you can! I was talking to a few customers in my pub as we were watching Loose Change (again)! When one bright individual serving in HM Forces said, "The towers do look like they are exploding on there way down, but the builders might have put explosives in them when they built them, as skyscrapers only have a 30 year or so shelf life and it would make it easier to demolish them when there time is up"!
And no, I am not making that up. Nice to know the forces still have a good screening programme. I am still avoiding him in case of any more deep insights.

[kbo234]

Welcome Dookie.

Sounds like a great pub.

Maybe there's an idea here. Perhaps we should be going round and giving free copies to pub landlords to show to their customers? It would certainly get those customers talking.
How come we've not thought of that before? Yes. I will start on the local hostelries this very week.

Good story too. Yes, it is surprising what people will come out with isn't it?

Why just yesterday a few of us were talking to a well-known journalist. He said 'Yes, that building 7 collapse really is a bit funny but it can't have been an inside job because the world just doesn't work like that.'

Life is full of surprises. Every day something new.

[dookie]

I must have planted the seeds of doubt in nearly a hundred people by now over the last couple of months. They are even asking me questions and asking for copies of Loose change etc! At last the end of stupid answers comes closer by the day. Watch out you lot in your ivory towers, "The masses are rising" Five pubs near me have a copy and the managers are all hooked!!

[Gravy]

Hello all. New here.

To get a handle on the facts behind the claims in "Loose Change", fans may want to download my "Loose Change Viewer Guide" (.doc file) http://tinyurl.com/epp82 or view the HTML version http://tinyurl.com/jnfp8

For a strong taste of the things the "Loose Change" creators say in interviews, see my compilation "Loose Change" Creators Speak": http://tinyurl.com/s8ouv

Thanks.

[Abandoned Ego]

[kbo234]

Uh-o people, people, here's another one.

Gravy says he has written this stuff (see links). I very much doubt it. An absolute mountain of depressingly familiar rubbish. Expect him to fill this site's posts with shedloads of this garbage in the coming months.

Like the last 'sceptic' or two he will not be interested in engaging in detailed argument about any particular scientific aspect of 9/11. He will be concentrating on messing us up and putting off newcomers to the site.

I will not be engaging with this creep. Will you? We know the game by now, don't we?

[scar]

[scar]

[Gravy]

[Gravy]

[Abandoned Ego]

[Gravy]

[Gravy]

[chipmunk stew]

[Abandoned Ego]

[gypsum]

[chipmunk stew]

[chipmunk stew]

[Ally]

How is anyone supposed to take a troll who apologises for mass murder seriously? You may as well join Rangers FC forum to tell them how good Celtic are, do you like wasting your time and other people's? Makes you wonder if they're getting paid for it.

[blackcat]

[blackcat]

Something like this...

Omissions:

The Report fails to mention the total collapse of 47-story steel-framed skyscraper Building 7 at 5:20 on the day of the attack.


The Report contains no mention of the interview in which the owner of Building 7 states that he and the Fire Department decided to "pull" Building 7 -- an apparent admission of a conspiracy to destroy the building and its contents.


The Report fails to mention the rapid removal and recycling of the structural steel from the collapsed World Trade Center buildings, even to make excuses for it.


The Report makes no mention of a statement by then-Mayor Rudolph Giuliani to Peter Jennings indicating he had foreknowledge of the collapses: "We were operating out of there when we were told that the World Trade Center was gonna collapse, and it did collapse before we could get out of the building."


The Report contains no mentions of eyewitness accounts of explosions preceding the collapse of South Towers.


The Report fails to mention that George W. Bush's brother, Marvin Bush, and his cousin, Wirt Walker III, were principals in the company that had the contract to provide security for the World Trade Center, Stratesec, nor does it mention the company.


The Report repeats the list of 19 suspects identified by the FBI within days of the attack, while failing to mention that six of them reported themselves alive after the attack.


The Report fails to mention any of the reports of behavior by the alleged hijackers before the attack that belie the official story that they were devout Muslims on a suicide mission for Allah.


The Report fails to mention that the published passenger lists contained no Arab names -- a fact publicized by skeptics of the official story.


The Report fails to ask why the plane that crashed into the Pentagon was not stopped by anti-aircraft missile batteries that presumably ring the building.


The Report fails to mention that no credible footage of the Pentagon attack has been made public, despite public knowledge that the FBI seized footage of the attack from nearby businesses.



The Report does not ask why the Secret Service did not obtain air cover for the President's motorcade from the Sarasota school to the airport, nor for Air Force One, which took off at about 9:54, until about 11:10.


The Report avoids mentioning several reports that government officials and business leaders received warnings and avoided targets of the attacks, including:

A warning by the FBI advising Attorney General John Ashcroft to avoid flying on commercial airlines.
The report that Pentagon officials suddenly canceled travel plans the evening before the attack.
The cancellation of plans by Ariel Sharon to attend an event in New York City on 9/11/01.
A warning to San Francisco Mayor Willie Brown to avoid flying.
The grounding of Salman Rushdie by Scotland Yard.


The Report avoids mentioning a warning received by employees of Odigo hours before the attack.


The Report does not mention that letters with weaponized anthrax were sent to the two most powerful senators attempting to slow the passage of the 9/11/01 attack-predicated USA PATRIOT Act.


The Report states that the Commission was "chartered to prepare a full and complete account of the circumstances surrounding the September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, including preparedness for and the immediate response to the attacks," but fails to mention that it makes no attempt to meet its charter.



Falsehoods


The Report's Notes state: "the interior core of the [Twin Towers] was a hollow steel shaft, in which the elevators and stairwells were grouped." In fact, the core structures were composed of bundles of steel columns numbering 47 and having outside dimensions, in most cases, of 36 by 16 inches and 54 by 22 inches.

The Report states that the "South Tower collapsed in ten seconds," when it actually took about 15 seconds. While one might expect that the Commission would overstate rather than understate the collapse time, the fact that the Commission did not even consider a collapse time within one second of the vacuum free-fall time of 9.2 seconds a problem for the official explanation is evidence that the Commission would endorse that explanation no matter what the facts.

Regarding the failure to promptly move George W. Bush from the known location of the Sarasota classroom, the Report states that "No one in the traveling party had any information during this time that other aircraft were hijacked or missing." Yet, according to evidence assembled by David Griffin, the Secret Service has open lines to the FAA, whose top operations people in the northeast corridor thought that as many as 11 planes had been hijacked. 2

The Report states: "The threat of terrorists hijacking commercial airliners within the United States -- and using them as guided missiles -- was not recognized by NORAD before 9/11." (The Report repeats the assertion three times.) Yet media reports, such as the USA Today article entitled "NORAD had drills of jets as weapons" describe pre-9/11 NORAD drills involving hijacked jetliners crashing into the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. 3

The Report states: "The protocols did not contemplate an intercept. They assumed the fighter escort would be discreet, 'vectored to a position five miles directly behind the hijacked aircraft,' where it could perform its mission to monitor the aircraft's flight path." Yet the order referenced by the footnote for this statement (Order 7610.4J: Special Military Operations), states:

7-2-1. FACILITY NOTIFICATION

The FAA hijack coordinator will advise the appropriate center/control tower of the identification of the military unit and location tasked to provide the hijack escort. The center/control tower shall coordinate with the designated NORAD SOCC/ROCC/military unit advising of the hijack aircraft's location, direction of flight, altitude, type aircraft and recommended flight plan to intercept the hijack aircraft. The center/control tower shall file the coordinated flight plan. 4

To address the charge that Saudi nationals were flown out of the country before the post-9/11 flight ban was lifted, the Report states: "we found no evidence that any flights of Saudi nationals, domestic or international, took place before the reopening of national airspace on the morning of September 13, 2001." In fact national airspace was only open to commercial airliners on a case-by-case basis on September 13, 2001. It was not until September 15th that the skies were opened to general aviation (privately owned aircraft). 5 Yet the Lear Jet that flew Saudi nationals from Tampa, FL to Lexington, KY on September 13th was a private plane


Contradictions


The Report notes that Hani Hanjour's pilot application was rejected, and that he was a "terrible pilot," on the one hand, but asserts that he was "operation's most experienced pilot," and piloted Flight 77 through a 330-degree spiral dive maneuver, on the other.

The Report explains that the suicide terrorists chose not to target a nuclear power plant because they "thought a nuclear target would be difficult because the airspace around it was restricted, making reconnaissance flights impossible and increasing the likelihood that any plane would be shot down before impact." (p 245) It fails to apply the same logic to their targeting of the Pentagon, which, being the heart of the US military, is presumably even better defended than a nuclear power plant.

The Report addresses the question of why George W. Bush remained in the publicly known location of the Sarasota school until 9:35 AM -- a half hour after the second Tower strike -- by relating that Bush "told us his instinct was to project calm, not to have the country see an excited reaction at a moment of crisis," (p38) and that the Secret service "told us they were anxious to move the President to a safer location, but did not think it imperative for him to run out the door." (p39) The Report implicitly accepts these explanations as satisfactory, thereby implying that for Bush to have taken any less than a half hour to leave the school would have required him to display an excited reaction and to "run out the door."

This list only touches on some of the more obvious omissions from the Report. Even Griffin's book -- the most thorough critique of the Report to date -- is far from exhaustive. In 2005, Griffin wrote The 9/11 Commission Report: A 571-Page Lie, which provides 115 points on which the Report lies, either explicitly or implicitly.


Otherwise I have to admit I have no reason to question the official conclusion!!

[chipmunk stew]

[Andrew Johnson]

[realitybites]

[Jay Ref]

Of the 19 hijackers 14 were Saudi nationals. The OS has identified Mohammed Atta as the leader of the hijackers. Mr. Atta was Egyptian.
Of the remaining terrorists; 3 were from the UAE and 1 was Lebanese.

My questions to CT believers:

• Why did the conspirators choose to identify the "hijackers" in this manner?
  
• If the point of 9/11 was a blank check for never-ending war for oil in the ME, why not use Iraqi and/or Afghani's as the perps?
  
• If another point was to foster the creation/expansion of a police state in the USA by scaring the sheeple into giving up their civil rights, why haven't there been more MIHOP/LIHOP events since 9/11?
  
• If the conspirators were so good at fooling the majority of sheeple on 9/11, then why couldn't they help their own cause by "finding" WMD in Iraq?
  

...just asking question...

-z

[MarkyX]

Hey cat, those are not evidence of a coverup. You are merely asking questions on a government report focused on terrorist attacks and not domestic/secondary issues like WTC7 without providing indisputable proof on your side.

Show me proof that those warnings were national terrorist ones and NOT domestic or personal. Show me proof that those explosions were created by bombs and nothing else.

Any moron can ask questions, providing indisputable evidence is another.

[Pete J]

[Abandoned Ego]

[MarkyX]

[Jay Ref]