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VIDEO -The Person the Illuminati Don’t Want You to Hear!
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Moti
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 11, 2006 3:45 pm    Post subject: VIDEO -The Person the Illuminati Don’t Want You to Hear! Reply with quote

VIDEO - PRABHUPADA – The Person the Illuminati Don’t Want You to Hear!

View at You Tube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_9pF_JOoYo

View at Google Video http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=6211546987842985201&hl=en-GB

The Illuminati are trying to destroy Prabhupada and his transcendental teachings because he is their greatest enemy and the only real threat to their Demoniac New World Order.

Prabhupada has been sent by Krishna [God] to this world to educate all people in the science of self and God realization. He has come to fulfil the desire and complete the work of all the previous representatives, servants, and incarnations of God such as Jesus, Mohammed and Buddha etc.

Prabhupada’s amazing miracle of translating the essence of the ancient Vedas to the people of the world and thus revealing the clear path to true spiritual realization, free from all religious dogma will bring about the Spiritual World Order of peace, enlightenment and equality for all on the this planet for 10,000 years!

Prabhupada said of the Illuminati:

“It is a fact however that the great sinister movement is within our Society. [ISKCON]”
[Srila Prabhupada Letter to: Hamsaduta 2 September, 1970]
“So there may be attempt like that. And Lord Jesus Christ was killed. So they may kill me also.”
[Room Conversation May 3, 1976, Honolulu]


But he also assured us as follows:

Therefore our movement is being checked in the Western countries that this is a brainwash movement. Brainwash movement, that we are injecting some ideas by psychology, mental control, and our people they are taking to it, and it is spreading like epidemic. How to check it? Therefore they are now taking action how to stop this Hare Krsna movement in Europe and America. They are trying. Of course, we are not afraid of this attempt. They will never be successful, rest assured, because we are pushing Krsna consciousness. Krsna was attempted to be killed from the very beginning of His life. That is the nature of this material world, "How to kill God," "God is dead." This is their attempt. So from the life of Krsna we can understand that so many attempts were made by the demons and the raksasas to kill Krsna, but actually Krsna killed them all. So if you are sincere, if you follow the principles and push on this Krsna consciousness movement, nobody can kill you. You'll go forward, rest assured. We are not going to be killed. That they are perceiving, that this movement is spreading like epidemic, and the young men of Europe and America, they're taking seriously. Professor Stillson Judah already has given his conclusion that "This movement is not going to stop. It will go on." That's a fact. Krsna cannot be killed, neither His movement cannot be killed. Rather, those who are attempting to kill, they will be killed. But we must be very sincere, serious, follow the regulative principle and chant Hare Krsna mantra as you have been taught. Follow this principle boldly, and there is no fear.

[Srila Prabhupada Lecture from Srimad-Bhagavatam 5.5.32, Vrndavana, November 19, 1976]


So let’s put aside our Illuminati indoctrinations of religious dogma, Darwin monkey brained evolution, and the evil ideology of communism. Due to complete frustration let’s not take shelter of impersonal or nihilistic philosophy. Rather let’s take shelter of Srila Prabhupada, a fully God realized saint who can enlighten us about our real nature of eternity, knowledge and bliss through our personal relationship with Krishna [God].

Hare Krishna! Jaya Prabhupada!!!


Web site www.prabhupada.or.uk
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iro
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 11, 2006 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

this has nothing to do with 9/11
hare hare my arse
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xmasdale
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 11, 2006 9:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

iro wrote:
this has nothing to do with 9/11
hare hare my arse


My view is that posts should be hidden when they are both off-topic and detremental to our cause.

Arguably it is on-topic because a lot of our supporters believe the 9/11 attacks happened because they were orchestrated by a small powerful criminal cartel they call the "illuminati". I prefer to call this cartel "the upper echelons of the capitalist class.

I do not think this post is damaging to our cause; it is merely a devout follower of a particular religious group expressing his faith that his religion has something to teach us.

Let's be tolerant.

Noel
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Moti
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 11, 2006 10:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

xmasdale wrote:
iro wrote:
this has nothing to do with 9/11
hare hare my arse


My view is that posts should be hidden when they are both off-topic and detremental to our cause.

Arguably it is on-topic because a lot of our supporters believe the 9/11 attacks happened because they were orchestrated by a small powerful criminal cartel they call the "illuminati". I prefer to call this cartel "the upper echelons of the capitalist class.

I do not think this post is damaging to our cause; it is merely a devout follower of a particular religious group expressing his faith that his religion has something to teach us.

Let's be tolerant.

Noel


Well said Noel.

Actually it is very relevant indeed. It just requires a little insight to understand things. We have all been brainwashed by the Illuminati. They have fed us false religion so we can't discriminate and recognise real spiritual truths. THAT IS THE REAL WAR, THE ILLUMINATI WANT TO CHECK ANY REAL SPIRITUAL AWAKENING IN THE PEOPLE. ENLIGHTENED SPIRITUAL PEOPLE ARE DANGEROUS TO THEIR AGENDA BECAUSE THEY ARE ON THE PATH OF FREEDOM FROM ALL ILLUSION!

Please check this also:

VIDEO - What The Anti-NWO Movement NEED TO UNDERSTAND!

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=1929385033177041180&hl=en-GB

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5MdVhMFd-hk
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 5:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have nothing against some peolpe spreading thier belief but it has nothing to do with 9/11 whatsoever, and I personally don´t care what some guru has to say, what matters is fact and evidence.

For all we know all the religions may be some made up fairy stories, created by the NWO to keep people busy thinking and fighting about these subjects and distracting from the true subversion going on.

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Disco_Destroyer
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 6:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

9/11 is a wakeup call that makes people realise what a nasty world us humans create, I am becoming tired of peoples intolerance to views and ideas that go beyond a mere crimescene. While people are digging in the rubble of 9/11 it is also right that people ask the bigger questions as to why this * is going on and the best ways to prevent it from happening again!!
9/11 is but a small jigsaw piece in the larger scheme of things, if you want to be able to prevent the next attack it is more important to ask the whys rather than the hows Razz

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Light Infantree
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 11:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bang on target DD. Even G Dubya needs loving and probably more than most.

Tolerance is a good thing. At least the post was placed in the General forum.

Unfortuately many of us do not have the patience or life experience to embrace ideas and beliefs such as the ones Moti has posted. Perhaps we should. Most of what I had learnt about spiritual/religios at school, like the official story of 911 left more questions than it provide answers.

It has not been since the last 10-15 years of my life that I have begun to understand that I am part of the whole and everyone reading this post (and anyone who is not) is another myself or as the Maya say: 'In l'akesh' or I am aonther yourself' . You see we are all one consciousness experiencing itself subjectively (yeah, I know its Bill Hicks and The Ickebergs favourite line - but its the truth).

When we have gotten the 911 case opened and sorted and we are all down the pub celebrating there will be many who are going to require serious clensing of mind body and spirit. And I don't just mean the perpitrators. I am talking about everyone. 911 is not just a wake up call for freedom, its going to shatter much of the way the world is collectivley operating - The 911 debate and dealing with it, is a rising tide that will leave much debris. There will be, I am certain, a whole lota shaking goin' on Shocked We would do well to support one another through this. Thats why there is nothing wrong with posting anything like this here. Lets embrace good people this is not a union meeting - we are breaking out of the prison and moving on to a world where you will be able to smoke at the bar. Now thats freedom.

A good spiritual grounding can be a powerful life skill to have. Once you understand that the power of creation (or what ever you wish to call he/she) is within you AND everything else (call it the force if you prefer), it awakens the experience of being in the NOW and listening to your heart. Connecting with spirit, being at one with the universe, feeling good about yourself...it only comes with practice unless you are one of the lucky ones and not been got at since birth.

The mind is a powerful computer but without the heart giuding it, the mind becomes over-logical leading to por judgement, sickness and imbalance.

Very Happy Bowing to Moti & DD

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Moti
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2006 1:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Light Infantree wrote:
Bang on target DD. Even G Dubya needs loving and probably more than most.

Tolerance is a good thing. At least the post was placed in the General forum.

Unfortuately many of us do not have the patience or life experience to embrace ideas and beliefs such as the ones Moti has posted. Perhaps we should. Most of what I had learnt about spiritual/religios at school, like the official story of 911 left more questions than it provide answers.

It has not been since the last 10-15 years of my life that I have begun to understand that I am part of the whole and everyone reading this post (and anyone who is not) is another myself or as the Maya say: 'In l'akesh' or I am aonther yourself' . You see we are all one consciousness experiencing itself subjectively (yeah, I know its Bill Hicks and The Ickebergs favourite line - but its the truth).

When we have gotten the 911 case opened and sorted and we are all down the pub celebrating there will be many who are going to require serious clensing of mind body and spirit. And I don't just mean the perpitrators. I am talking about everyone. 911 is not just a wake up call for freedom, its going to shatter much of the way the world is collectivley operating - The 911 debate and dealing with it, is a rising tide that will leave much debris. There will be, I am certain, a whole lota shaking goin' on Shocked We would do well to support one another through this. Thats why there is nothing wrong with posting anything like this here. Lets embrace good people this is not a union meeting - we are breaking out of the prison and moving on to a world where you will be able to smoke at the bar. Now thats freedom.

A good spiritual grounding can be a powerful life skill to have. Once you understand that the power of creation (or what ever you wish to call he/she) is within you AND everything else (call it the force if you prefer), it awakens the experience of being in the NOW and listening to your heart. Connecting with spirit, being at one with the universe, feeling good about yourself...it only comes with practice unless you are one of the lucky ones and not been got at since birth.

The mind is a powerful computer but without the heart giuding it, the mind becomes over-logical leading to por judgement, sickness and imbalance.

Very Happy Bowing to Moti & DD


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Hare Krishna brother.

Jaya Prabhupada!!!
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Emmanuel
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2006 10:45 pm    Post subject: Love and light Reply with quote

"We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light."

Plato
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Moti
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 12:39 am    Post subject: Re: Love and light Reply with quote

Sophocles wrote:
"We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light."

Plato


Plato: Goodness and Government

In 1972 and 1973, Srila Prabhupada held a series of philosophical discussions with his personal secretary, Syamasundara, while traveling around the world. These sessions were recorded and published to provide an understanding of Western philosophy, psychology, and science from the viewpoint of the timeless teachings of India's Vedic literature. In the following conversation, the striking similarities between Plato's ideal state and that outlined in the Bhagavad-gita prompt one to ask, "Could Plato have gotten his ideas from India's ancient Vedas?"

Syamasundara: Plato believed society can enjoy prosperity and harmony only if it places people in working categories or classes according to their natural abilities. He thought people should find out their natural abilities and use those abilities to their fullest capacity--as administrators, as military men, or as craftsmen. Most important, the head of state should not be an average or mediocre man. Instead, society should be led by a very wise and good man--a "philosopher king"--or a group of very wise and good men.
Srila Prabhupada: This idea appears to be taken from the Bhagavad-gita, where Krsna says that the ideal society has four divisions: brahmanas [intellectuals], ksatriyas [warriors and administrators], vaisyas [merchants and farmers], and sudras [laborers]. These divisions come about by the influence of the modes of nature. Everyone, both in human society and in animal society, is influenced by the modes of material nature [sattva-guna, rajo-guna, and tamo-guna, or goodness, passion, and ignorance]. By scientifically classifying men according to these qualities, society can become perfect. But if we place a man in the mode of ignorance in a philosopher's post, or put a philosopher to work as an ordinary laborer, havoc will result.
In the Bhagavad-gita Krsna says that the brahmanas--the most intelligent men, who are interested in transcendental knowledge and philosophy--should be given the topmost posts, and under their instructions the ksatriyas [administrators] should work. The administrators should see that there is law and order and that everyone is doing his duty. The next section is the productive class, the vaisyas, who engage in agriculture and cow protection. And finally there are the sudras, common laborers who help the other sections. This is Vedic civilization--people living simply, on agriculture and cow protection. If you have enough milk, grains, fruits, and vegetables, you can live very nicely.
The Srimad-Bhagavatam compares the four divisions of society to the different parts of the body--the head, the arms, the belly, and the legs. Just as all parts of the body cooperate to keep the body fit, in the ideal state all sections of society cooperate under the leadership of the brahmanas. Comparatively, the head is the most important part of the body, for it gives directions to the other parts of the body. Similarly, the ideal state functions under the directions of the brahmanas, who are not personally interested in political affairs or administration because they have a higher duty. At present this Krsna consciousness movement is training brahmanas. If the administrators take our advice and conduct the state in a Krsna conscious way, there will be an ideal society throughout the world.
Syamasundara: How does modern society differ from the Vedic ideal?
Srila Prabhupada: Now there is large-scale industrialization, which means exploitation of one man by another. Such industry was unknown in Vedic civilization--it was unnecessary. In addition, modern civilization has taken to slaughtering and eating animals, which is barbarous. It is not even human.
In Vedic civilization, when a person was unfit to rule he was deposed. For instance, King Vena proved to be an unfit king. He was simply interested in hunting. Of course, ksatriyas are allowed to hunt, but not whimsically. They are not allowed to kill many birds and beasts unnecessarily, as King Vena was doing and as people do today. At that time the intelligent brahmanas objected and immediately killed him with a curse. Formerly, the brahmanas had so much power that they could kill simply by cursing; weapons were unnecessary.
At present, however--because the head of the social body is missing--it is a dead body. The head is very important, and our Krsna consciousness movement is attempting to create some brahmanas who will form the head of society. Then the administrators will be able to rule very nicely under the instructions of the philosophers and theologians--that is, under the instructions of God-conscious people. A God conscious brahmana would never advise opening slaughterhouses. But now, the many rascals heading the government allow animal slaughter. When Maharaja Pariksit saw a degraded man trying to kill a cow, he immediately drew his sword and said, "Who are you? Why are you trying to kill this cow?" He was a real king. Nowadays, unqualified men have taken the presidential post. And although they may pose themselves as very religious, they are simply rascals. Why? Because under their noses thousands of cows are being killed, while they collect a good salary. Any leader who is at all religious should resign his post in protest if cow slaughter goes on under his rule. Since people do not know that these administrators are rascals, they are suffering. And the people are also rascals because they are voting for these bigger rascals. It is Plato's view that the government should be ideal, and this is the ideal: The saintly philosophers should be at the head of the state; according to their advice the politicians should rule; under the protection of the politicians, the productive class should provide the necessities of life; and the laborer class should help. This is the scientific division of society that Krsna advocates in the Bhagavad-gita (4.13): catur-varnyam maya srstam guna-karma-vibhagasah. "According to the three modes of material nature and the work ascribed to them, the four divisions of human society were created by Me."
Syamasundara: Plato also observed social divisions. However, he advocated three divisions. One class consisted of the guardians, men of wisdom who governed society. Another class consisted of the warriors, who were courageous and who protected the rest of society. And the third class consisted of the artisans, who performed their services obediently and worked only to satisfy their appetites.
Srila Prabhupada: Yes, human society does have this threefold division, also. The first-class man is in the mode of goodness, the second-class man is in the mode of passion, and the third-class man is in the mode of ignorance.
Syamasundara: Plato's understanding of the social order was based on his observation that man has a threefold division of intelligence, courage, and appetite. He said that the soul has these three qualities.
Srila Prabhupada: That is a mistake. The soul does not have any material qualities. The soul is pure, but because of his contact with the different qualities of material nature, he is "dressed" in various bodies. This Krsna consciousness movement aims at removing this material dress. Our first instruction is "You are not this body." It appears that in his practical understanding Plato identified the soul with the bodily dress, and that does not show very good intelligence.
Syamasundara: Plato believed that man's position is marginal--between matter and spirit--and therefore he also stressed the development of the body. He thought that everyone should be educated from an early age, and that part of that education should be gymnastics--to keep the body fit.
Srila Prabhupada: This means that in practice Plato very strongly identified the self as the body. What was Plato's idea of education?
Syamasundara: To awaken the student to his natural position--whatever his natural abilities or talents are.
Srila Prabhupada: And what is that natural position?
Syamasundara: The position of moral goodness. In other words, Plato thought everyone should be educated to work in whatever way is best suited to awaken his natural moral goodness.
Srila Prabhupada: But moral goodness is not enough, because simple morality will not satisfy the soul. One has to go above morality--to Krsna consciousness. Of course, in this material world morality is taken as the highest principle, but there is another platform, which is called the transcendental (vasudeva) platform. Man's highest perfection is on that platform, and this is confirmed in Srimad-Bhagavatam. However, because Western philosophers have no information of the vasudeva platform, they consider the material mode of goodness to be the highest perfection and the end of morality. But in this world even moral goodness is infected by the lower modes of ignorance and passion. You cannot find pure goodness (suddha-sattva) in this material world, for pure goodness is the transcendental platform. To come to the platform of pure goodness, which is the ideal, one has to undergo austerities (tapasa brahmacaryena samena ca damena ca). One has to practice celibacy and control the mind and senses. If he has money, he should distribute it in charity. Also, one should always be very clean. In this way one can rise to the platform of pure goodness.
There is another process for coming to the platform of pure goodness--and that is Krsna consciousness. If one becomes Krsna conscious, all the good qualities automatically develop in him. Automatically he leads a life of celibacy, controls his mind and senses, and has a charitable disposition. In this age of Kali, people cannot possibly be trained to engage in austerity. Formerly, a brahmacari [celibate student] would undergo austere training. Even though he might be from a royal or learned family, a brahmacari would humble himself and serve the spiritual master as a menial servant. He would immediately do whatever the spiritual master ordered. The brahmacari would beg alms from door to door and bring them to the spiritual master, claiming nothing for himself. Whatever he earned he would give to the spiritual master, because the spiritual master would not spoil the money by spending it for sense gratification--he would use it for Krsna. This is austerity. The brahmacari would also observe celibacy, and because he followed the directions of the spiritual master, his mind and senses were controlled.
Today, however, this austerity is very difficult to follow, so Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu has given the process of taking to Krsna consciousness directly. In this case, one need simply chant Hare Krsna, Hare Krsna, Krsna Krsna, Hare Hare. Hare Rama, Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare and follow the regulative principles given by the spiritual master. Then one immediately rises to the platform of pure goodness.
Syamasundara: Plato thought the state should train citizens to be virtuous. His system of education went like this: For the first three years of life, the child should play and strengthen his body. From three to six, the child should learn religious stories. From seven to ten, he should learn gymnastics; from ten to thirteen, reading and writing; from fourteen to sixteen, poetry and music; from sixteen to eighteen, mathematics. And from eighteen to twenty, he should undergo military drill. From twenty to thirty-five, those who are scientific and philosophical should remain in school and continue learning, and the warriors should engage in military exercises.
Srila Prabhupada: Is this educational program for all men, or are there different types of education for different men?
Syamasundara: No, this is for everyone.
Srila Prabhupada: This is not very good. If a boy is intelligent and inclined to philosophy and theology, why should he be forced to undergo military training?
Syamasundara: Well, Plato said that everyone should undergo two years of military drill.
Srila Prabhupada: But why should someone waste two years? No one should waste even two days. This is nonsense--imperfect ideas.
Syamasundara: Plato said this type of education reveals what category a person belongs to. He did have the right idea that one belongs to a particular class according to his qualification.
Srila Prabhupada: Yes, that we also say, but we disagree that everyone should go through the same training. The spiritual master should judge the tendency or disposition of the student at the start of his education. He should be able to see whether a boy is fit for military training, administration, or philosophy, and then he should fully train the boy according to his particular tendency. If one is naturally inclined to philosophical study, why should he waste his time in the military? And if one is naturally inclined to military training, why should he waste his time with other things? Arjuna belonged to a ksatriya [warrior] family. He and his brothers were never trained as philosophers. Dronacarya was their master and teacher, and although he was a brahmana, he taught them Dhanur Veda [military science], not brahma-vidya. Brahma-vidya is theistic philosophy. No one should be trained in everything; that is a waste of time. If one is inclined toward production, business, or agriculture, he should be trained in those fields. If one is philosophical, he should be trained as a philosopher. If one is militaristic, he should be trained as a warrior. And if one has ordinary ability, he should remain a sudra, or laborer. This is stated by Narada Muni in Srimad-Bhagavatam: yasya yal-laksanam proktam. The four classes of society are recognized by their symptoms and qualifications. Narada Muni also says that one should be selected for training according to his qualifications. Even if one is born in a brahmana family, he should be considered a sudra if his qualifications are those of a sudra. And if one is born in a sudra family, he should be taken as a brahmana if his symptoms are brahminical. The spiritual master should be expert enough to recognize the tendencies of the student and immediately train him in that line. This is perfect education.
Syamasundara: Plato believed that the student's natural tendency wouldn't come out unless he practiced everything.
Srila Prabhupada: No, that is wrong--because the soul is continuous, and therefore everyone has some tendency from his previous birth. I think Plato didn't realize this continuity of the soul from body to body. According to the Vedic culture, immediately after a boy's birth astrologers should calculate what category he belongs to. Astrology can help if there is a first-class astrologer. Such an astrologer can tell what line a boy is coming from and how he should be trained. Plato's method of education was imperfect because it was based on speculation.
Syamasundara: Plato observed that a particular combination of the three modes of nature is acting in each individual.
Srila Prabhupada: Then why did he say that everyone should be trained in the same way?
Syamasundara: Because he claimed that the person's natural abilities will not manifest unless he is given a chance to try everything. He saw that some people listen primarily to their intelligence, and he said they are governed by the head. He saw that some people have an aggressive disposition, and he said such courageous types are governed by the heart--by passion. And he saw that some people, who are inferior, simply want to feed their appetites. He said these people are animalistic, and he believed they are governed by the liver.
Srila Prabhupada: That is not a perfect description. Everyone has a liver, a heart, and all the bodily limbs. Whether one is in the mode of goodness, passion, or ignorance depends on one's training and on the qualities he acquired during his previous life. According to the Vedic process, at birth one is immediately given a classification. Psychological and physical symptoms are considered, and generally it is ascertained from birth that a child has a particular tendency. However, this tendency may change according to circumstances, and if one does not fulfill his assigned role, he can be transferred to another class. One may have had brahminical training in a previous life, and he may exhibit brahminical symptoms in this life, but one should not think that because he has taken birth in a brahmana family he is automatically a brahmana. A person may be born in a brahmana family and be a sudra. It is a question not of birth but of qualification.
Syamasundara: Plato also believed that one must qualify for his post. His system of government was very democratic. He thought everyone should be given a chance to occupy the different posts.
Srila Prabhupada: Actually, we are the most democratic because we are giving everyone a chance to become a first-class brahmana. The Krsna consciousness movement is giving even the lowest member of society a chance to become a brahmana by becoming Krsna conscious. Candalo 'pi dvija-srestho hari-bhakti-parayanah: Although one may be born in a family of candalas [dog-eaters], as soon as he becomes God conscious, Krsna conscious, he can be elevated to the highest position. Krsna says that everyone can go back home, back to Godhead. Samo 'ham sarva-bhutesu: "I am equal to everyone. Everyone can come to Me. There is no hindrance."
Syamasundara: What is the purpose of the social orders and the state government?
Srila Prabhupada: The ultimate purpose is to make everyone Krsna conscious. That is the perfection of life, and the entire social structure should be molded with this aim in view. Of course, not everyone can become fully Krsna conscious in one lifetime, just as not all students in a university can attain the Ph.D. degree in one attempt. But the idea of perfection is to pass the Ph.D. examination, and therefore the Ph.D. courses should be maintained. Similarly, an institution like this Krsna consciousness movement should be maintained so that at least some people can attain and everyone can approach the ultimate goal--Krsna consciousness.
Syamasundara: So the goal of the state government is to help everyone become Krsna conscious?
Srila Prabhupada: Yes, Krsna consciousness is the highest goal. Therefore, everyone should help this movement and take advantage of it. Regardless of his work, everyone can come to the temple. The instructions are for everyone, and prasadam is distributed to everyone. Therefore, there is no difficulty. Everyone can contribute to this Krsna consciousness movement. The brahmanas can contribute their intelligence; the ksatriyas their charity; the vaisyas their grain, milk, fruits, and flowers; and the sudras their bodily service. By such joint effort, everyone can reach the same goal--Krsna consciousness, the perfection of life.
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Emmanuel
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 8:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I didnt know that, I knew that Plato knew a thing or two.

I watched the film clip. he seems like a fair guru, fairer than most. I like the birds and insects soundtrack too.
. I wouldnt rule out reincarnation, though i have no firm concrete beliefs.

However. Wheres the
Quote:
prosperity and harmony
in society if the INDIVIDUAL cant even do the courtesy of LISTENING to one another, RESPONDING to what they are saying and making some PROGRESSIVE SOLUTIONS??? Isn't basic RESPECT and a CAPACITY TO COMMUNICATE EFFECTIVELY part of every religions teaching? Or are you an automatic quote machine? Confused
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 10:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The Illuminati are trying to destroy Prabhupada and his transcendental teachings because he is their greatest enemy and the only real threat to their Demoniac New World Order.


If I recommend this site to a friend and this is what they find, can I blame them if they write us off as a bunch of loony conspiracy theorists?

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 6:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

suspecta wrote:
Quote:
The Illuminati are trying to destroy Prabhupada and his transcendental teachings because he is their greatest enemy and the only real threat to their Demoniac New World Order.


If I recommend this site to a friend and this is what they find, can I blame them if they write us off as a bunch of loony conspiracy theorists?

Suspecta


That's because you and they are completely ignorant about the teachings of His Divine Grace A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada.

Anyway my point to you is:

What is this nonsense idea that we protest a police state and strongly support another, THIS IS HYPOCRISY!!!

You make your bed, now lie in it.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 6:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sophocles wrote:
I didnt know that, I knew that Plato knew a thing or two.

I watched the film clip. he seems like a fair guru, fairer than most. I like the birds and insects soundtrack too.
. I wouldnt rule out reincarnation, though i have no firm concrete beliefs.




There is concrete proof for reincarnation. We've experienced in our practical lifetime that we were very tiny, youth, we had a small body, child's body: kaumaram yauvanam. Then youthful body, then we're having old man, old woman's body, like this. So practically speaking, this body is constantly changing. Although Krsna gives this example because He is trying to explain a very fine point of understanding, namely transmigration of the soul: that in reality the body that we have is changing at every moment, at every instant. But we can not see that because our consciousness is not so sharp to pick up when there's change of body. But Krsna explains, "You can see that you had a small body, now you have a youthful body, now you have an old man's body." Actually there is a continuum of change at every moment. So this is the changing material body, and the mind likewise is changing, but the soul, the living entity, is not changing. And this is experienced practically by the fact that in spite of so many changes of body that we had we've still the same person. Just like we can remember when we were young children playing in the park or at the streets, and then older, older, older; going to school; older, family life; older, now retired; now like this. So like this the body is changing in so many ways but still I'm the same person. This can be practically experienced. Everyone has this understanding: different bodies but you're still the same person.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 6:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sophocles wrote:


However. Wheres the
Quote:
prosperity and harmony
in society if the INDIVIDUAL cant even do the courtesy of LISTENING to one another, RESPONDING to what they are saying and making some PROGRESSIVE SOLUTIONS??? Isn't basic RESPECT and a CAPACITY TO COMMUNICATE EFFECTIVELY part of every religions teaching? Or are you an automatic quote machine? Confused


For someone who's contribution to this forum is 50% quotes, that's a bit harsh, don't you think?

Your first offerring to this discussion was to quote. I thought it was an excellent quote myself. You expressed yourself wonderfully by quoting from a wise an learned man. You communicated to the group at large how their own fears and illuminati indoctrinated spiritual aversions were checking them looking at spiritual truths with an open mind.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 7:44 pm    Post subject: Re: Love and light Reply with quote

Sophocles wrote:
"We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light."
Plato


Yep thats it quote some ancient chap in a way that has nothing to do with the subject.

Just because I don´t follow some guru or any other human leader, or thier beliefs doesn´t mean I can´t see the light. Those who follow these people are the ones with blinkers on tunnel visioning thier way through life.

Find your own path don´t follow someone else´s!
Thats why your unique and thats why your here!

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 8:20 pm    Post subject: Re: Love and light Reply with quote

Bicnarok wrote:
Sophocles wrote:
"We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light."
Plato


Yep thats it quote some ancient chap in a way that has nothing to do with the subject.

Just because I don´t follow some guru or any other human leader, or thier beliefs doesn´t mean I can´t see the light. Those who follow these people are the ones with blinkers on tunnel visioning thier way through life.

Find your own path don´t follow someone else´s!
Thats why your unique and thats why your here!


How did you come to the conclusions you did on 911? Did you do the research yourself or did you hear from Icke, Jones etc. ?

When you drive your car do you follow your own road [path] or the road by others? In so many ways you follow the path of others in your life but when it comes to the spiritual path back to God, you want to make your own. This is nonsense talk. If you want to go to God then you have to follow the path that God gives us, you cannot speculate your own path, just like you could not speculate your own path from one city to another, you would need to follow the authorized path marked out by the government.

Please tell me one original philosophy or path you have followed my friend, can you do that?

Here is God'd path for us:


TRANSLATION

Just try to learn the truth by approaching a spiritual master. Inquire from him submissively and render service unto him. The self-realized soul can impart knowledge unto you because he has seen the truth.

PURPORT

The path of spiritual realization is undoubtedly difficult. The Lord therefore advises us to approach a bona fide spiritual master in the line of disciplic succession from the Lord Himself. No one can be a bona fide spiritual master without following this principle of disciplic succession. The Lord is the original spiritual master, and a person in the disciplic succession can convey the message of the Lord as it is to his disciple. No one can be spiritually realized by manufacturing his own process, as is the fashion of the foolish pretenders. The Bhagavatam says: dharmam tu saksad bhagavat-pranitam--the path of religion is directly enunciated by the Lord. Therefore, mental speculation or dry arguments cannot help one progress in spiritual life. One has to approach a bona fide spiritual master to receive the knowledge. Such a spiritual master should be accepted in full surrender, and one should serve the spiritual master like a menial servant, without false prestige. Satisfaction of the self-realized spiritual master is the secret of advancement in spiritual life. Inquiries and submission constitute the proper combination for spiritual understanding. Unless there is submission and service, inquiries from the learned spiritual master will not be effective. One must be able to pass the test of the spiritual master, and when he sees the genuine desire of the disciple, he automatically blesses the disciple with genuine spiritual understanding. In this verse, both blind following and absurd inquiries are condemned. One should not only hear submissively from the spiritual master, but one must also get a clear understanding from him, in submission and service and inquiries. A bona fide spiritual master is by nature very kind toward the disciple. Therefore when the student is submissive and is always ready to render service, the reciprocation of knowledge and inquiries becomes perfect.

[Srila Prabhupada from Bhagavad-gita 4.34]
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 8:38 pm    Post subject: Re: Love and light Reply with quote

Bicnarok wrote:
Sophocles wrote:
"We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light."
Plato


Yep thats it quote some ancient chap in a way that has nothing to do with the subject.

Just because I don´t follow some guru or any other human leader, or thier beliefs doesn´t mean I can´t see the light. Those who follow these people are the ones with blinkers on tunnel visioning thier way through life.

Find your own path don´t follow someone else´s!
Thats why your unique and thats why your here!


So why are you here to tell us find our own path. That means you are setting the path, you contradict yourself.

You say there is no need of a teacher to show us the path, yet you come along here teaching us to "follow your own path" You are talking foolishly
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 8:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This isn't about being tolerant. It is about being side-tracked into mumbo-jumbo (IMHO)!
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 8:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wokeman wrote:
This isn't about being tolerant. It is about being side-tracked into mumbo-jumbo (IMHO)!


There is no mumbo-jumbo, things are clear:

What is this nonsense idea that we protest a police state and strongly support another, THIS IS HYPOCRISY!!!
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 8:51 pm    Post subject: Re: Love and light Reply with quote

Moti wrote:
Bicnarok wrote:
Sophocles wrote:
"We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light."
Plato


Yep thats it quote some ancient chap in a way that has nothing to do with the subject.

Just because I don´t follow some guru or any other human leader, or thier beliefs doesn´t mean I can´t see the light. Those who follow these people are the ones with blinkers on tunnel visioning thier way through life.

Find your own path don´t follow someone else´s!
Thats why your unique and thats why your here!


How did you come to the conclusions you did on 911? Did you do the research yourself or did you hear from Icke, Jones etc. ?

When you drive your car do you follow your own road [path] or the road by others? In so many ways you follow the path of others in your life but when it comes to the spiritual path back to God, you want to make your own. This is nonsense talk. If you want to go to God then you have to follow the path that God gives us, you cannot speculate your own path, just like you could not speculate your own path from one city to another, you would need to follow the authorized path marked out by the government.

Please tell me one original philosophy or path you have followed my friend, can you do that?

Here is God'd path for us:


TRANSLATION

Just try to learn the truth by approaching a spiritual master. Inquire from him submissively and render service unto him. The self-realized soul can impart knowledge unto you because he has seen the truth.

PURPORT

The path of spiritual realization is undoubtedly difficult. The Lord therefore advises us to approach a bona fide spiritual master in the line of disciplic succession from the Lord Himself. No one can be a bona fide spiritual master without following this principle of disciplic succession. The Lord is the original spiritual master, and a person in the disciplic succession can convey the message of the Lord as it is to his disciple. No one can be spiritually realized by manufacturing his own process, as is the fashion of the foolish pretenders. The Bhagavatam says: dharmam tu saksad bhagavat-pranitam--the path of religion is directly enunciated by the Lord. Therefore, mental speculation or dry arguments cannot help one progress in spiritual life. One has to approach a bona fide spiritual master to receive the knowledge. Such a spiritual master should be accepted in full surrender, and one should serve the spiritual master like a menial servant, without false prestige. Satisfaction of the self-realized spiritual master is the secret of advancement in spiritual life. Inquiries and submission constitute the proper combination for spiritual understanding. Unless there is submission and service, inquiries from the learned spiritual master will not be effective. One must be able to pass the test of the spiritual master, and when he sees the genuine desire of the disciple, he automatically blesses the disciple with genuine spiritual understanding. In this verse, both blind following and absurd inquiries are condemned. One should not only hear submissively from the spiritual master, but one must also get a clear understanding from him, in submission and service and inquiries. A bona fide spiritual master is by nature very kind toward the disciple. Therefore when the student is submissive and is always ready to render service, the reciprocation of knowledge and inquiries becomes perfect.

[Srila Prabhupada from Bhagavad-gita 4.34]



If I may, I think what Bicnarok was saying is that while following a single wise man, guru or teacher, a student might glean great insight, but he is also limiting himself. Surely the combined teachings of all histories philosophers and assorted wise men is a greater resource than a single teacher. True, there is a place for individual guidance through particular ideas, but that guide should always encourage his student to reach beyond prescribed teaching.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 9:04 pm    Post subject: Re: Love and light Reply with quote

Fallious wrote:
Moti wrote:
Bicnarok wrote:
Sophocles wrote:
"We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light."
Plato


Yep thats it quote some ancient chap in a way that has nothing to do with the subject.

Just because I don´t follow some guru or any other human leader, or thier beliefs doesn´t mean I can´t see the light. Those who follow these people are the ones with blinkers on tunnel visioning thier way through life.

Find your own path don´t follow someone else´s!
Thats why your unique and thats why your here!


How did you come to the conclusions you did on 911? Did you do the research yourself or did you hear from Icke, Jones etc. ?

When you drive your car do you follow your own road [path] or the road by others? In so many ways you follow the path of others in your life but when it comes to the spiritual path back to God, you want to make your own. This is nonsense talk. If you want to go to God then you have to follow the path that God gives us, you cannot speculate your own path, just like you could not speculate your own path from one city to another, you would need to follow the authorized path marked out by the government.

Please tell me one original philosophy or path you have followed my friend, can you do that?

Here is God'd path for us:


TRANSLATION

Just try to learn the truth by approaching a spiritual master. Inquire from him submissively and render service unto him. The self-realized soul can impart knowledge unto you because he has seen the truth.

PURPORT

The path of spiritual realization is undoubtedly difficult. The Lord therefore advises us to approach a bona fide spiritual master in the line of disciplic succession from the Lord Himself. No one can be a bona fide spiritual master without following this principle of disciplic succession. The Lord is the original spiritual master, and a person in the disciplic succession can convey the message of the Lord as it is to his disciple. No one can be spiritually realized by manufacturing his own process, as is the fashion of the foolish pretenders. The Bhagavatam says: dharmam tu saksad bhagavat-pranitam--the path of religion is directly enunciated by the Lord. Therefore, mental speculation or dry arguments cannot help one progress in spiritual life. One has to approach a bona fide spiritual master to receive the knowledge. Such a spiritual master should be accepted in full surrender, and one should serve the spiritual master like a menial servant, without false prestige. Satisfaction of the self-realized spiritual master is the secret of advancement in spiritual life. Inquiries and submission constitute the proper combination for spiritual understanding. Unless there is submission and service, inquiries from the learned spiritual master will not be effective. One must be able to pass the test of the spiritual master, and when he sees the genuine desire of the disciple, he automatically blesses the disciple with genuine spiritual understanding. In this verse, both blind following and absurd inquiries are condemned. One should not only hear submissively from the spiritual master, but one must also get a clear understanding from him, in submission and service and inquiries. A bona fide spiritual master is by nature very kind toward the disciple. Therefore when the student is submissive and is always ready to render service, the reciprocation of knowledge and inquiries becomes perfect.

[Srila Prabhupada from Bhagavad-gita 4.34]



If I may, I think what Bicnarok was saying is that while following a single wise man, guru or teacher, a student might glean great insight, but he is also limiting himself. Surely the combined teachings of all histories philosophers and assorted wise men is a greater resource than a single teacher. True, there is a place for individual guidance through particular ideas, but that guide should always encourage his student to reach beyond prescribed teaching.


If you deny authority, then why you quote other authority? So you cannot defy authority. This is not possible. From the beginning of your life, when you were child, you asked your parents, "Mother, father, what is this?" Why? That is the beginning of life. You cannot go even a step without authority. You are governed by authority. You are running your car by authority--"Keep to the right." Why? Why don't you defy it? So authority we have to obey. But the difficulty is: who is authority? That we require to learn who is actually authority. So authority means who has no mistakes, who has no illusion, who does not cheat, and whose senses are perfect. That is authority. That is the definition of authority. A conditioned soul who... Just... "To err is human." Any human being is sure to commit mistakes. However learned he may be, however advanced he may be, he must commit mistake. Therefore this word is, "To err is human." And one must be illusioned. And there is cheating propensity of every man. Even a child, he wants to cheat. The mother asks, "Oh, what is in your hand?" Oh, the child says, "No, mother, nothing," although the mother can see he has got something. So the cheating propensity is there. And above all, your senses are imperfect. You are proud of your eyes: "I want to see." What you can see? If the light is off, your seeing power is immediately gone. If there is no sun, your seeing power is gone. Therefore we see under conditions. Therefore imperfect. So you cannot get perfect knowledge by imperfect senses, by speculative knowledge. You have to accept authority. Just like if you want to know who is your father, the authority is your mother. The mother says, "Here is your father." You have to accept. You cannot make research. Mother is the last authority, who is your father. Similarly, we have to accept authority, and if the authority is not a conditioned soul, if he is liberated soul, if he is not a cheater, if his senses are not imperfect, if he does not make any mistakes, if he is not in illusion, if you receive knowledge from that authority, then your knowledge is perfect. That is the process.
So we have got such authoritative, I mean to say, literature, Vedic literatures. You can test it by your reason, by your arguments, by your philosophical talks, everything. Religion without philosophical basis, without scientific basis, is sentiment. That religion based on philosophy and science, that is right. So Bhagavad-gita is that book. Any question, any inquiry, any doubt--all the answers are there, and very nicely.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 10:38 pm    Post subject: its a "free world" Reply with quote

I am not going quote so much now; haha
I also agree with the person who said combined teachings are a better way of getting some understanding.
If I put my hands over my ears shouting "lalalala" anyone elses belief system, experiences will not be heard, understood and taken on board as something valid. Everyone should be able to express themselves and live their life as they want. But patronising people because they may have less knowledge than you is wrong.

Resources are richer if you have a variety of information looking at the same source.
For example: We could see 911 from the same perspective looking at a 10 second clip from cnn news or we can examine other documents, testimonies and evidence which can give a more accurate reading of the event.
Sharing knowledge is what human cicilisation should be doing.
Just this forum proves that.
Keep asking questions methinks............

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 10:47 pm    Post subject: Re: Love and light Reply with quote

Moti wrote:

If you deny authority, then why you quote other authority? So you cannot defy authority. This is not possible. From the beginning of your life, when you were child, you asked your parents, "Mother, father, what is this?" Why? That is the beginning of life. You cannot go even a step without authority. You are governed by authority. You are running your car by authority--"Keep to the right." Why? Why don't you defy it? So authority we have to obey. But the difficulty is: who is authority? That we require to learn who is actually authority. So authority means who has no mistakes, who has no illusion, who does not cheat, and whose senses are perfect. That is authority. That is the definition of authority. A conditioned soul who... Just... "To err is human." Any human being is sure to commit mistakes. However learned he may be, however advanced he may be, he must commit mistake. Therefore this word is, "To err is human." And one must be illusioned. And there is cheating propensity of every man. Even a child, he wants to cheat. The mother asks, "Oh, what is in your hand?" Oh, the child says, "No, mother, nothing," although the mother can see he has got something. So the cheating propensity is there. And above all, your senses are imperfect. You are proud of your eyes: "I want to see." What you can see? If the light is off, your seeing power is immediately gone. If there is no sun, your seeing power is gone. Therefore we see under conditions. Therefore imperfect. So you cannot get perfect knowledge by imperfect senses, by speculative knowledge. You have to accept authority. Just like if you want to know who is your father, the authority is your mother. The mother says, "Here is your father." You have to accept. You cannot make research. Mother is the last authority, who is your father. Similarly, we have to accept authority, and if the authority is not a conditioned soul, if he is liberated soul, if he is not a cheater, if his senses are not imperfect, if he does not make any mistakes, if he is not in illusion, if you receive knowledge from that authority, then your knowledge is perfect. That is the process.
So we have got such authoritative, I mean to say, literature, Vedic literatures. You can test it by your reason, by your arguments, by your philosophical talks, everything. Religion without philosophical basis, without scientific basis, is sentiment. That religion based on philosophy and science, that is right. So Bhagavad-gita is that book. Any question, any inquiry, any doubt--all the answers are there, and very nicely.


I'm not going to read that.. please use some paragraphs if you want me to. I'd like to.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 10:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sophocles wrote:
"We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light."
(Im not talking about the illuminatus flames light)

This is aimed at those previous posters who laugh nervously at any inkling of spiritual awakening, psychic experience or good natural love.
In these days of increasing illusions filling our minds and television screens, schools and offices, any religious philosophy is shunned.
I am interested in God and theology, though try to steer away from the middlemen. To me this is light.

It makes me think of the analogy of when we are sleeping. We react with fear and contempt when a bright light is suddenly shone in our face.

Although it is at first alarming,you can see all that is dirty and wrong more clearly and then the light is something beautiful and enchanting.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 12:29 am    Post subject: Re: its a "free world" Reply with quote

Sophocles wrote:
I am not going quote so much now; haha
I also agree with the person who said combined teachings are a better way of getting some understanding.
If I put my hands over my ears shouting "lalalala" anyone elses belief system, experiences will not be heard, understood and taken on board as something valid. Everyone should be able to express themselves and live their life as they want. But patronising people because they may have less knowledge than you is wrong.

Resources are richer if you have a variety of information looking at the same source.
For example: We could see 911 from the same perspective looking at a 10 second clip from cnn news or we can examine other documents, testimonies and evidence which can give a more accurate reading of the event.
Sharing knowledge is what human cicilisation should be doing.
Just this forum proves that.
Keep asking questions methinks............


But i doubt you have ever examined the Krishna consciousness science, what to speak on practicing it. So how you can judge it?
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 12:43 am    Post subject: hare rama hare krishna Reply with quote

Yes Moti, i used to visit some ISKON temples. I liked the jumping up and down chanting mantras, the great dishes and general clean living aspects.
Have you been traumatised by ISKON? Theres a lot of anger in your emails. Or are you employed by them to put people off or what?
I think your general lack of respect, and insensitivity
shows you should "take the log out of your own eye before attempting to remove splinters in other peoples..."
Jesus.C

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 10:13 am    Post subject: Re: hare rama hare krishna Reply with quote

Sophocles wrote:
Yes Moti, i used to visit some ISKON temples. I liked the jumping up and down chanting mantras, the great dishes and general clean living aspects.
Have you been traumatised by ISKON? Theres a lot of anger in your emails. Or are you employed by them to put people off or what?
I think your general lack of respect, and insensitivity
shows you should "take the log out of your own eye before attempting to remove splinters in other peoples..."
Jesus.C


From the beginning of this discussion other than your first post which was your best contribution you have simply attacked me rather than deal with the points i raise. That means you have nothing valuable to say.

When i said examine Krishna consciousness i meant; did you read any of Prabhupada's original books? Practice then would mean applying those teaching's practically in life. Of course if you went to the illuminati run ISKCON cult then that is another matter. When did you visit the ISKCON temples. Post 1977 it was no longer ISKCON, but the illuminati cult.

If you preceive anger in my mails you are probably self projecting, although i will admit to been a little frustated that you never address my points but try to attack my character.

What about looking at this one:

What is this nonsense idea that we protest a police state and strongly support another, THIS IS HYPOCRISY!!!
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 10:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Careful Moti I wouldn't like to see you get booted but if you keep banging on I think you may find that you're no longer welcome on this loka!
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 10:48 am    Post subject: Re: hare rama hare krishna Reply with quote

Moti wrote;

Quote:
When i said examine Krishna consciousness i meant; did you read any of Prabhupada's original books?


Prior to becoming a student of Gurdjieff, I studied several of the Swami’s, including Srila Prabhupada. The Vedic principles are highly abrasive with modern western living and I found the concepts of Gurdjieffism far more beneficial.

Plus Hare Krishna is as much a cultural calling as it is spiritual and to shave my head and invest in a pair of tiny cymbals might have upset my relief inspector (being in the police at the time).

Incidentally, I have always thought Mr Prabhupada looks uncannily like Ian Wright (the ex-footballer) in 30 years time. Of course, Srila did nothing to dispel this notion by writing a book entitled 'On Yer 'Ed Buddha'.



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I completely challenge the official version of events - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC -I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC - I AM NOT A 9/11 TRUTH CRITIC
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Post new topic   This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies.    9/11, 7/7, Covid-1984 & the War on Freedom Forum Index -> Other Controversies All times are GMT
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