Challenge: Truthers, debate us in PalTalk

[Bushwacker]

Louise, you seem to think that I am relying on the word of the US Government about 9/11, this is not so. The responsibility of al Qaeda is shown by the videos sent to al Jazeera, the leading independent Arabic TV channel, and accepted as genuine by them. Many intelligence agencies of other countries picked up information about the impending attacks and warned the US about them; that could hardly have happened if the US was responsible for them.

That the impact damage together with the fires was sufficient to cause the towers to collapse is accepted by all structural engineers who have publicly commented on it, not only in the US, but worldwide. The impossibility of using explosives to cause the towers to collapse as they did has been shown by the demolition experts of Implosion World. No one has managed to explain how occupied buildings could be rigged for demolition without the occupants noticing. No plausible explanation of how the planes could be flown into the towers, apart from by suicide hijackers has been put forward. The calls made by passengers confirm hijackers.

The areas in which parts of the US Government machine have been shown to be suppressing information or misrepresenting the truth over 9/11 all relate to their failure to prevent the attacks, nothing suggests they initiated them. Many "truthseekers" on the other hand are constantly misrepresenting the truth in any number of areas, and the theories put forward grow ever more fantastic to account for all the anomalies in the earlier theories.

[Louise]

Why don't you put these questions about the cell phone calls and the other things you mention in your post to the other people on this forum Bushwacker.

I'm sure that they will be able to explain these things to you.

i'm a bit like an investigator trying to solve a crime.

I do know however that on the run up to 9/11 there were a multitude of various powerdowns and evacuations of BOTH twin towers and building 7.

During these "power down" events all security systems in the building were renderd inoprative whilst workmen enter the building to lay what was said was "New broadband cables".

Bomb sniffing dogs were removed abuptly from patroling the buildings about 1 week i belive before the event.

WHY??????????.

The company that was responsible for security of the WTC was a company called Securicom, one of the people runnning that company was Marvin Bush, George W. Bushes Younger Brother.

The company is now called Stratasec i belive.

What about the pod on the bottom of flight 175 that slammed into the second tower?.

This is NOT a reflection or illusion.

There is something there, to me it looks like some sort of torpedo, and of course there is the very bright Flash that happens IN BOTH COUNTS when both planes are about to hit the buildings but before they actually do hit the buildings.

Some people said that they were with the FBI when they recoved the black box flight recorders from the planes that crashed into the twin towers and they were threatend not to say anything, one man did have the courage to speak out.

The others who saw the FBI are to frightend (probably for their lives) to speak out.

The FBI said that the black boxes from the planes that hit the WTC were all destroyed.

Black boxes are made very robustly to survive just such an impact so that they can be recoverd afterwards to examine what went wrong.

Why would the FBI remove them and NOT want anybody to know about them?.

Also the FBI has camera footage of what hit the pentagon but is refusing to release it because of "national security", how convenient.

If what crashed into the pentagon is what they said it was, whats the problem in releasing all of them to the public if there is nothing to hide?.

Anyway i think considering the importance of this case, i don't think that there "national security" excuse holds any water or truth.

WE WANT TO SEE THOSE VIDEOS, but they will have to be obtained from them immedately, on the spot without any warning or notification that people are going to collect them........why?.

Because, by doing the way i've said, it gives them NO chance or oppotunity to alter, doctor, fabricate, move or destroy those videos.

A lot of other people in the USA are frightend to genuinely speak out about what they think about 9/11 as well.

[Louise]

As to your question as to how the planes could have been flown into the towers OTHER than by the hijackers is this.

Have you heard of something called F.L.I.R

This stands for Forward Looking Infrared.

Some more info on this technology can be found here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FLIR
http://www.flir.uk.com/assets/about.htm

You Then Combine this peice of technology with an aircrafts electronics and most importantly the AUTOPILOT systems of an aircraft.

It may well become possible to programme the destination into the autopilot computer system, engage autopilot and just let the plane fly itself using autopilot and F.L.I.R to fly the plane wherever you want the plane to go.

F.L.I.R technology is used a lot by the millitary.

[Louise]

Read This:

http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_dave_lin_051220_fbi_lied__the_ wtc_bl.htm

http://www.americanfreepress.net/html/black_box.html

http://summeroftruth.org/groundzero.html

[pepik]

The problem here Louise is that you are extremely gullible. Also, you seem to repeat things from memory, a memory which doesn't seemt to be 100% reliable. Many of the things you claim are bog standard conspiracy theories except with an accumulation of little embellishments, something very typical for troofers. You also demonstrate the ability to immediately forget anything which is proved wrong. It doesn't make you stop and wonder for one second why people are feeding you garbage.

[TmcMistress]

[pepik]

And yet you won't criticise anything Louise says, you'll just whine about me.

[TmcMistress]

I do! Constantly. Maybe not Louise in particular at this point, but I assume you're not blocked from even looking at the other forums... Take a look at my last post in the Poll- What brought down the twin towers thread in "9/11 Truth Controversies" section.

[Louise]

Pepik Wrote:

"And yet you won't criticise anything Louise says, you'll just whine about me."

Is this your attempt to turn us against each other Pepik?.

A common way to disrupt and derail an organised group is to get into that group and try to turn them against each other.

You also said about one of my comments:

"Why not speak out anonymously? Why not do it from abroad? You do realise that all kinds of people speak out against all kinds of things all the time. People testify against the mafia in Italy, yet you think this blanket "everyone is too afraid" somehow negates the need for a single one of the thousands in the know to say a word."

Pepik if you were paid "a little visit" by a couple of people and warned that if you start speaking the truth in anyway you or members of your family (including your children if you have any) might not live to see their next birthday, woudn't you be afraid to speak out even anonymously in case they found out it was you.

Although i do have to conceed to you Pepik that some things that are put forward do seem to be a bit absurd like the NPT.

I mean planes were captured slaming into the towers on cameras and also there were loads of eyewitnesses as well.

So i do find certain things that are said a bit strange.

But you MUST take into account the US goverment and millitarys track record of repeated lying over a multitude of different issues.

[Bushwacker]

[Louise]

What i really hope Bushwacker is that all you crtics ARE NOT being paid by anyone to defend the US goverment.

Or you are not being paid to divert, mislead, disrupt, or in anyway stop the truthers on here from getting to the truth.

For if any of you are, that means that you think more about money than human life, you consider money more important than human life.

And it also proves if you are that you have no morals, princibles or decency and are just as evil and vile as those who carried out the attacks.

Some people would do anything just so long as the right amount of money is waved in front of their face even if it is immoral.

My partner says that people with morals and princibles are very few in todays society.

There is no way that the twin towers could crumble and fall apart like that in just 10 seconds (and it happend twice by the way) without additional help, or WTC 7 in just 6.5 seconds and in such an orderly fashion.

Like you i looked at WTC 7 and thought immediately that it was controlled demolition.

Don't you think that some key members of the US goverment should undergo interrogation by an independant group of people trained in extracting information out of people, and that person should be linked to a lie detector machine or/and have truth drug put into them?.

You seem to totally dismiss the possibility that the US goverment are involved in anyway,

Why?.

Because of the position that they hold?.

Do you think it's impossible for people who hold authority and "power" to be corrupt and evil?.

Maybe that's what they want you to think.

Is it right for one man (dick chaney) to be able to decide upon the destruction of the entire human race?.

Those who carried out these attacks should be exterminated, but i suppose if that happened they woudn't suffer as they should.

I do feel that you underestimate the ability of the goverment to manipulate and fabricate information to throw people off the real scent or track.

The US has attacked two countrys Iraq and Afganistan, they said about Iraq that they had leathal WMD's that could be deployed in 45mins, that was all BS wasn't it.

So what country are they going to invade next under the banner of the "war on terror" (with the UK in tow of course).

Iran?, Syria?, Pakistan?, India?.

And i wonder what "evidence" they are going to find to justify attacking those countrys?.

Don't you see whats happening here?.

I really do recommend you read Rebuilding america's defences by PNAC if you haven't already.

In fact i've found the link for you to read this 90 page document:

http://www.newamericancentury.org/RebuildingAmericasDefenses.pdf

It talks about american global domination.

Also it talks about keeping defence spending high, to transform the US military into a world dominant force.

One way to justify high defence spending is by keeping the troops out in the middle east and not bring them home and to ensure that there are always problems out there to justfy keeping them out there.

Look at the Core objectives and compare that with whats happening in the world today.

Pages 4, 5 and 7 by the way are blank pages.

[John White]

[Louise]

Thanks for your support John and TmcMistress .

I was starting to feel as if i was all alone .

And another thing George Bush and Dick Chaney should NEVER have been allowed to testify to the 9/11 commision together.......NEVER.

Why do police when they arrest more than one suspect for a crime seperate them and question the suspects individually?.

Because they get together afterwards and compare the two storys of the two (or more suspects) and compare their statements for contradictions whitch could indicate involvement.

Why did George Bush and Dick Chaney want to appear together which should NEVER have been allowed.

To cover each other?.

To feed of each others story?.

And why did they refuse to do it under oath?.

Why wasn't it allowed to be recorded?, i wish someone would have done it in secret.

[Bushwacker]

[Bushwacker]

What I really hope, Louise, is that you are not quite as naive and gullible as you appear from your postings here. If you are, I am afraid that you are going to be exploited and taken advantage of again and again and suffer some severe disappointments in your life.

[John White]

[Dogsmilk]

When I first joined this forum, I raised the question of why the US govt saw fit to retain the flight 93 recordings and then let the families hear them in some private hearing. I haven't considered this for ages, so please tell me if the situation has changed, but last I heard the US govt still held the recordings as their private plaything.

If my loved one died in such a fashion I'd consider such a recording damn well something I should have, not that the government should hold their last known utterances for themselves. Then I'd have the choice as to whether they should be public or not.

At the very least, I always thought that showed the immense arrogance of the govt.

[Louise]

Bushwacker wrote:

"What I really hope, Louise, is that you are not quite as naive and gullible as you appear from your postings here. If you are, I am afraid that you are going to be exploited and taken advantage of again and again and suffer some severe disappointments in your life."

Don't worry Bushwacker, it's already happened to me many times in my life.

I guess i must have cried a river in my life because of "disappointments" in my life.

But i still try to be as honest and helpful to people as i can, that's what the world's about isn't it, being a decent person.

If you can't do someone a good turn don't do them a bad one.

Still i think i've found a little bit of happyness now.

But if the US goverment carried out 9/11, they can't be allowed to get away with it, we must not let them get away with it.

[marky 54]

[marky 54]

people realise there is simply to much at stake for them to just be fobbed off with the first excuse you can think of to try and explain away certain evidence, especially when not backed up or when the evidence given against just raises more questions or can be debunked as a fabrication and has no base of fact.

quite why every documentary on t.v has to be a baised hit piece i'll never know especially when the offical version is suppose to be the truth, yet cannot refute those asking questions without avoiding facts, not being able to show proof of their counter claims, and lumping everyone as a conspiracy theorists and using tactics to discredit.

[Louise]

I totally agree with your last two posts marky 54.

I've just read something that says that we are heading for a police state by the summer of 2009.

Apparently, a treaty is going to be signed next year that will mean we are completely under the control of the EU and they could effectively do away with the British Goverment.

I'm not sure if that's 100% true or not but it's a nightmare if it is.

[Harassed]

[John White]

[Bushwacker]

[Bushwacker]

[Bushwacker]

[Bushwacker]

[Harassed]

[eogz]

Gotta agree with you there Harassed.

Its not just 9/11, this openend my eyes to the fact Governments are complicit in lots of nefarious activities.

Some of us start with 9/11 questions, then look deeper...

Operation Gladio
Central Banks
UK funding terrorists
US funding terrorists
Western gorernment foreign policies to democratically elected governments
Poisonous Drugs
The EU!
North American Union

I konw some of you will say these are conspiracy theories, but the deeper you look the scarier the world becomes.

I wish we only had a few fanantic muslim organisiations to worry about.

[marky 54]