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John White
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 Posted: Sun Oct 21, 2007 12:17 am Post subject: Will critics respond to sinking of the 9/11 Commission? |
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I've not seen a peep in here about Keane and Hamilton sinking the commission they apparently ran beneath the waterline
| Quote: | Even the Chair of the 9/11 Commission now admits that the official evidence they were given was "far from the truth"
By Peter Tatchell
The Guardian – Comment Is Free – 11 September 2007
Six years after 9/11, the American public have still not been provided with a full and truthful account of the single greatest terror attack in US history.
What they got was a turkey. The 9/11 Commission
http://www.9-11commission.gov/
was hamstrung by official obstruction.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/08/04/AR2006 080401026.html
It never managed to ascertain the whole truth of what happened on 11 September 2001.
The Chair and Vice Chair of the 9/11 Commission, respectively Thomas Kean and Lee Hamilton, assert in their book, Without Precedent,
http://www.amazon.com/Without-Precedent-Inside-Story-Commission/dp/030 7263770
that they were "set up to fail"
http://www.cbc.ca/sunday/911hamilton.html
and were starved of funds to do a proper investigation.
They also confirm that they were denied access to the truth and misled
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/08/01/AR2006 080101300.html
by senior officials in the Pentagon and the Federal Aviation Authority;
and that this obstruction and deception
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/08/05/terror/main1868087.shtml
led them to contemplate slapping officials with criminal charges.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/08/01/AR2006 080101300.html
Despite the many public statements by 9/11 Commissioners and staff members acknowledging they were repeatedly lied to, not a single person has ever been charged, tried, or even reprimanded, for lying to the 9/11 Commission.
From the outset, the Commission seemed to be hobbled. It did not start work until over a year after the attacks. Even then, its terms of reference were suspiciously narrow, its powers of investigation curiously limited and its time-frame for producing a report unhelpfully short - barely a year to sift through millions of pages of evidence and to interview hundreds of key witnesses.
The final report
http://www.9-11commission.gov/report/911Report.pdf
did not examine key evidence, and neglected serious anomalies in the various accounts of what happened. The Commissioners admit their report was incomplete
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/08/04/AR2006 080401026.html
and flawed, and that many questions about the terror attacks remain unanswered. Nevertheless, the 9/11 Commission was swiftly closed down on 21 August 2004.
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But I'm interested to know how critics now justify not supporting the campaings call for a fresh investigation: If critics are "rational"
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pepik
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| Posted: Sun Oct 21, 2007 2:20 pm Post subject: |
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If you could get any of these people to say that they thought there was a cover up of an inside job, this would be interesting. But this is just truthers quoting people for whom there isn't a shred of evidence that they believe in your conspiracy theories.
Also, you are acting as if large government commissions are normally free of dispute and controversy, and everyone happily arrives at a consensus opinion.
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James C
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| Posted: Sun Oct 21, 2007 2:36 pm Post subject: |
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| pepik wrote: | If you could get any of these people to say that they thought there was a cover up of an inside job, this would be interesting. But this is just truthers quoting people for whom there isn't a shred of evidence that they believe in your conspiracy theories.
Also, you are acting as if large government commissions are normally free of dispute and controversy, and everyone happily arrives at a consensus opinion. |
So what are these people saying?
Regardless of whether they believe 9/11 was an inside job, they are still hinting that the investigation was a cover up.
If the truth is presented accurately, then consensus opinion need not matter. Are you suggesting that all investigations, including those into transport crashes, natural disasters and so on are only concluded when everyone agrees? The facts should speak for themselves regardless of individual viewpoints but alas the full facts were not represented at all in the commission report. I suggest that your comments prove more about how you are happy to accept petty bureaucracy than let truth be given a chance. You sound like one of those people who loves sitting in boring meetings, arguing points to death with their colleagues and slapping each others backsides in approval whenever they succesfully manipualate reality to fit their own nefarious desires! |
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pepik
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| Posted: Sun Oct 21, 2007 9:22 pm Post subject: |
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Let me repeat.
If you could get any of these people to say that they thought there was a cover up of an inside job, this would be interesting. But this is just truthers quoting people for whom there isn't a shred of evidence that they believe in your conspiracy theories.
Get some real witnesses. Some people who actually support you.
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"could it be that ww2 and the extermination of jewish people was planned as a way of creating a race of people who it would be difficult to blame for anything, a cover race for the illuminati?" - a quote NOT from the 'controversial theories' section. |
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James C
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| Posted: Sun Oct 21, 2007 9:53 pm Post subject: |
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| pepik wrote: | Let me repeat.
If you could get any of these people to say that they thought there was a cover up of an inside job, this would be interesting. But this is just truthers quoting people for whom there isn't a shred of evidence that they believe in your conspiracy theories.
Get some real witnesses. Some people who actually support you. |
I don't think you need to worry yourself about what actions the truth movement is taking to reinforce its case. Besides, as a critic, it's not your role. Just try and stick to picking holes in what we believe. I for one support your actions as it helps our theories to develop with more rigour thus preventing complacency.
Keep up the good work and we'll worry about the rest. |
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Alex_V
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Joined: 24 Sep 2007
Posts: 515
Location: London, England
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| Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 11:02 am Post subject: Re: Will critics respond to sinking of the 9/11 Commission? |
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Do Keane and Hamilton think a fresh investigation is required? They don't seem to - in his interview Hamilton seems reasonably happy with what the commission achieved despite the problems they had.
Indeed, Keane and Hamilton's apparent 'honesty' in owning up to the shortcomings of any such investigation lends credibility at least to the intentions of the people involved. Far from being a cover-up, they at least offer evidence that the commission sought to have real teeth, and had two presidents running scared to some extent.
It's important also to clarify where Keane and Hamilton feel they were misled, and this was specifically in terms of the explanations given by NORAD. Although eventually the actual audio tapes of their actions on the day were released, so it was an issue that was eventually resolved.
In terms of inside-job conspiracy, I consider this whole issue a red herring.
And in terms of a fresh commission, I don't see that the information here supports the idea. The NORAD issue was resolved, the people involved seem happy that they did their best, and though it's clear that a commission could sit for eternity looking into every tiny detail of the 9/11 attacks and their aftermath, without clear leading evidence for them to examine I don't see that it would benefit anybody. And that is before you even get to the impossibility of making a commission independent enough to suit the truth movement. |
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Bushwacker
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Joined: 07 Sep 2006
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| Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 7:55 pm Post subject: Re: Will critics respond to sinking of the 9/11 Commission? |
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| John White wrote: | I've not seen a peep in here about Keane and Hamilton sinking the commission they apparently ran beneath the waterline
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A metaphor as strangely confused as your reasoning! I suppose you meant to say holed beneath the waterline. However, you are of course quite wrong, the main conclusions of the enquiry are unaffected, 19 hijackers took command of four planes, and three were crashed into buildings. As critics have always said, the foot-dragging of the Bush administration was clearly because of a wish to avoid their failures to put together the intelligence they had and act on it being looked at too closely, and where the commission may have been misled is over the ineffective response to the attacks.
Nothing has come to light to support the truthseekers, who of course are not interested in the truth, only desperately casting round without success for something, anything, to support their belief in an inside job. |
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pepik
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| Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 9:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | I don't think you need to worry yourself about what actions the truth movement is taking to reinforce its case. |
It has been six years of smug nonsense. When are you going to come up with something?
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"could it be that ww2 and the extermination of jewish people was planned as a way of creating a race of people who it would be difficult to blame for anything, a cover race for the illuminati?" - a quote NOT from the 'controversial theories' section. |
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James C
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| Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:03 am Post subject: |
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| pepik wrote: | | Quote: | | I don't think you need to worry yourself about what actions the truth movement is taking to reinforce its case. |
It has been six years of smug nonsense. When are you going to come up with something? |
And with all the support and funding which NIST receives, it still cannot answer WTC7 in this same time period. |
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pepik
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| Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 8:53 pm Post subject: |
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yes but the NIST report will eventually come out, and you will still have nothing.
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"could it be that ww2 and the extermination of jewish people was planned as a way of creating a race of people who it would be difficult to blame for anything, a cover race for the illuminati?" - a quote NOT from the 'controversial theories' section. |
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James C
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| Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 9:42 pm Post subject: |
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| pepik wrote: | | yes but the NIST report will eventually come out, and you will still have nothing. |
I won't be holding my breath.
This sticks and stones stuff is very boring don't you think? |
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