Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 10:30 am Post subject: Sending 9/11 videos to UK soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan
Dear friends,
Why not send free Loose Change or other 9/11 videos to soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan, in order to make them aware of the powers they are serving? Give it a thought.
Joined: 03 Aug 2006 Posts: 431 Location: North East England
Posted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 1:36 am Post subject:
Well that's really going to do wonders for their morale.......... many of them are fully aware of the kind of regime they serve anyway, just take a peek at any forces forum.
Joined: 25 Jul 2005 Posts: 1959 Location: South London
Posted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 11:23 am Post subject:
wepmob2000 wrote:
Well that's really going to do wonders for their morale.......... many of them are fully aware of the kind of regime they serve anyway, just take a peek at any forces forum.
Surely "doing wonders for their morale" is what is needed to end this illegal and immoral war of agression. What brought the US troops home from Vietnam? Should we be perpetuating the cover-up of a lie and mass murder in order not to damage the troops' morale?
Was not the same principle applied to the German troops in WW2? Don't let them know that they were not really attacked by Poland; that was just a false flag operation named Operation Himmler. Don't let them know about the extermination camps. Never mind about unimportant things like truth, legality or morals. The most important thing is to keep up the troops' morale.
Joined: 03 Aug 2006 Posts: 431 Location: North East England
Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2007 12:29 am Post subject:
xmasdale wrote:
The most important thing is to keep up the troops' morale.
Well yes, actually it is, you're quite right. There's a world of difference between the British Army and the Wehrmacht, to which you disingenuously compare it (not so sure about the American's).
Contrary to urban myth, the British Army is doing as professional a job as possible in trying circumstances, and the vast majority believe the politicians lies as much as we do. Instead they are trying to make the best of a bad situation and improve the lives of the ordinary Iraqis as much as they can (again check out any forces forum for evidence of this). If wounded they are treated like second class citizens (e.g. not allowed to wear uniform in hospital, in case they cause offence). Its little wonder the British Army has a recruitment crisis of unprecedented proportions.
The troops would probably appreciate some entertainment DVD's (movies, comedy, etc), but definitely not political material, which at best would be used as drinks coasters.............
The troops in Helmand should know they are there to protect bumper crops year on year of opium to be processed into heroin to appear cheaper and cheaper on the streets of the west
That's their whole purpose there, and the failure of their supposed mission has once again been announced as more bumper harvests are planted
The British Army in Helmand are promoting chep heroin on the streets of Britain. That is their sole purpose for which they are getting killed and maimed
Worthy purpose _________________ http://www.exopolitics-leeds.co.uk/introduction
I just don't get the whole issue of "Supporting our troops"... these people chose killing other human beings as a career FFS
Maybe if all the troops chose other 'constructive' careers rather than choose to be cannon fodder, then maybe we wouldn't have bloody wars for governments to fight.
I don't support any troops or any army, no matter where they come from.
Joined: 03 Aug 2006 Posts: 431 Location: North East England
Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 1:07 am Post subject:
paul wright wrote:
The troops in Helmand should know they are there to protect bumper crops year on year of opium to be processed into heroin to appear cheaper and cheaper on the streets of the west
That's their whole purpose there, and the failure of their supposed mission has once again been announced as more bumper harvests are planted
The British Army in Helmand are promoting chep heroin on the streets of Britain. That is their sole purpose for which they are getting killed and maimed
Worthy purpose
Agreed, and once again if you have a read of any forces forum, many of the troops are aware of this, and this is yet another reason why the British Army faces a recruiting crisis of unprecedented proportions. Its definitely not what most of them joined the forces for.......... (and thats why they're leaving in droves)
In fact most servicemen and women hate the present government more than most of the posters here, and by and large they seem to strongly disagree with the true reasons they are out in Iraq and Afghanistan. Having said that, the troops are generally committed to doing as good and proffessional a job as possible, despite the circumstances they're in.
Joined: 03 Aug 2006 Posts: 431 Location: North East England
Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 1:22 am Post subject:
Brian McHugh wrote:
I just don't get the whole issue of "Supporting our troops"... these people chose killing other human beings as a career FFS
Maybe if all the troops chose other 'constructive' careers rather than choose to be cannon fodder, then maybe we wouldn't have bloody wars for governments to fight.
I don't support any troops or any army, no matter where they come from.
The whole thing is bloody primitive.
I think your argument is somewhat naive, although well intended. You know as we all do that many troops are 'cannon fodder', and they're often kids who have very few prospects bar the army.
Sadly, and often through no fault of their own, many people don't have a 'choice' of career, nor many options outside the dole queue, why do you think theres a direct correlation between poverty levels and recruitment levels? (In fact the Army is now increasingly recruiting in poorer commonwealth nations).
Its also pretty obvious that the Government would just coerce people through conscription if no volunteers were forthcoming, so its a no win situation. As it is the Army does offer a 'leg up' to many people who would otherwise remain unemployed (thats if they're not killed or maimed first).
Joined: 10 Dec 2005 Posts: 2017 Location: Croydon, Surrey
Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 1:47 am Post subject:
Brian McHugh wrote:
I just don't get the whole issue of "Supporting our troops"... these people chose killing other human beings as a career FFS
As much as I understand what you are saying (I would never join an army and, clearly, neither would you) I think you should go easier on these people Brian.
The whole point of recruiting teenagers is that their thinking and judgemental faculties are unformed and therefore they are easier to brainwash into the desired mindset.
They are a symptom of our collective sickness.
I think these poor kids deserve our sympathy. They mostly don't know what they are getting themselves into.
We train them to be killers, put them into situations that would probably destroy the psyches and happiness of most human beings and then expect them to return to society as normal people, giving them little appropriate support.
Mental illness, broken families, alcoholism and drug abuse are rife among ex-military.
You can say they deserve what they got for making a stupid and wicked decision if you like but....it is surely fairer to say that they are victims of our callous disregard for the lives and rights of all our fellow men including these soldiers themselves.
If we are going to deliberately and systematically make killers out of kids then it is surely right that they get special help and consideration when their lives start falling apart because they cannot live with what they have seen and done on our behalf.
And let's be honest here.....what have those of us who oppose military actions done to prevent the continuance of the glorious tradition of invading one's neighbours and murdering them?
Joined: 03 Aug 2006 Posts: 431 Location: North East England
Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 2:23 am Post subject:
Kbo234, absolutely spot on, and beautifully put.....
As you say, the Army likes to 'grab em' while they're young, at least for 'teeth' arms like the infantry, and the entrance test hardly resembles the test to join MENSA ( 3 squares and 1 circle, which is the odd one out, etc...). Until recently, the MAXIMUM age upon joining was 26.
The brighter recruits end up in non-combat roles, the tests are designed that way, even brighter candidates enter the RAF or Navy, where they mostly never even see an enemy combatant.
The whole system is designed to exploit younger or disadvantaged people, who do end up as the 'cannon fodder'. One thing I found particularly shocking is that the gunners controls in the Challenger II tank is deliberately designed exactly like like a Playstation gamepad!
Another thing to consider is that while the Army pension may seem generous, the number of ex-squaddies who actually live long enough to spend it is shockingly low, some research into the numbers involved here would be revealing to say the least.........
Is there anyone here who, hand on heart, can say they saw things clearly when they were teenagers, and wouldn't have been susceptible to Army advertising, particularly if they were unemployed with few prospects?
Well yes, actually it is, you're quite right. There's a world of difference between the British Army and the Wehrmacht, to which you disingenuously compare it (not so sure about the American's).
an army following orders is an army following orders no matter what they have on their sleeve are you suggesting the average German recruit was any different to anyone else? _________________ 'Come and see the violence inherent in the system.
Help, help, I'm being repressed!'
“The more you tighten your grip, the more Star Systems will slip through your fingers.”
Contrary to urban myth, the British Army is doing as professional a job as possible in trying circumstances, and the vast majority believe the politicians lies as much as we do. Instead they are trying to make the best of a bad situation and improve the lives of the ordinary Iraqis as much as they can (again check out any forces forum for evidence of this). If wounded they are treated like second class citizens (e.g. not allowed to wear uniform in hospital, in case they cause offence). Its little wonder the British Army has a recruitment crisis of unprecedented proportions.
The Iraqi resistance is doing an incredible job given Allied supremacy. They are using daredevil tactics that put themselves in a David/Goliath scenario. No one side or army is better than another, it takes 2 to tango and your view of 'we art better' only compounds the problem, with righteous screams of we're only doing it for Iraq nonsence!! Get over it!! _________________ 'Come and see the violence inherent in the system.
Help, help, I'm being repressed!'
“The more you tighten your grip, the more Star Systems will slip through your fingers.”
Is there anyone here who, hand on heart, can say they saw things clearly when they were teenagers, and wouldn't have been susceptible to Army advertising, particularly if they were unemployed with few prospects?
yep even before I discovered the ole Heavy Metal I viewed it as fighting someone elses war not my own and fully understood Vietnam and the Cold War for the sack of Horse Sh*t it was. We had a trip to Bassingbourne for a Military recruitment day, which I confess I found cool, looking at the hardware and such but that was where the interest stopped. School History was great at least with my teachers, keen as historians to prove the importance of Propaganda on both sides and show that truth normally laid somewhere around the middle ground of the 2 extremes !!
Sir David Attenborough was all I needed as young as maybe 10 to suss out Organised Religion was not a box of chocolates either!! Fellow pupils around that time also proved the truth surrounding Soccer when West Ham started doing badly they all jumped ship and some even chose such local teams as Liverpool!! I now have no time for soccer and the joke that it is! _________________ 'Come and see the violence inherent in the system.
Help, help, I'm being repressed!'
“The more you tighten your grip, the more Star Systems will slip through your fingers.”
Joined: 03 Aug 2006 Posts: 431 Location: North East England
Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 9:18 pm Post subject:
Disco_Destroyer wrote:
Quote:
Well yes, actually it is, you're quite right. There's a world of difference between the British Army and the Wehrmacht, to which you disingenuously compare it (not so sure about the American's).
an army following orders is an army following orders no matter what they have on their sleeve are you suggesting the average German recruit was any different to anyone else?
Don't remember saying there was a difference in recruits (putting conscription to one side), but if you can show me 'real' evidence of the British Army following a policy of genocide, as the Wehrmacht did in Russia and Poland, then please bring it on. Clearly, as you won't be able to bring me such evidence, there is therefore a fundamental difference between the two..................
Joined: 03 Aug 2006 Posts: 431 Location: North East England
Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 9:23 pm Post subject:
Disco_Destroyer wrote:
Quote:
Contrary to urban myth, the British Army is doing as professional a job as possible in trying circumstances, and the vast majority believe the politicians lies as much as we do. Instead they are trying to make the best of a bad situation and improve the lives of the ordinary Iraqis as much as they can (again check out any forces forum for evidence of this). If wounded they are treated like second class citizens (e.g. not allowed to wear uniform in hospital, in case they cause offence). Its little wonder the British Army has a recruitment crisis of unprecedented proportions.
The Iraqi resistance is doing an incredible job given Allied supremacy. They are using daredevil tactics that put themselves in a David/Goliath scenario. No one side or army is better than another, it takes 2 to tango and your view of 'we art better' only compounds the problem, with righteous screams of we're only doing it for Iraq nonsence!! Get over it!!
Hmm, don't remember saying that the British Army was better than anyone else either, or that 'we' were only doing it for Iraq, so what exactly am I to get over??????? It can be safely said that many of the ordinary British squaddies are doing their best for the Iraqis however. As you rightly say, the Iraqi 'resistance' is doing a very creditable job, especially considering the gulf between them in terms of equipment.
Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2007 11:46 am Post subject: a re-buttle of poster - wepmob2000
I highly advise any troops or familys with troops in the Mid-East to watch this lecture.
Eric Phelps is a World renouned professer, although he is a Bible Basher, he presents some ground breaking work.
In the 3rd part, [on the Google vid page, when you click first link] he outlines how all 'Nato' troops will be sacraficed in a blood bath ritual. Same as in the Battle of the Somme, Same as Stalin sacraficed his troops, same as Napolean Sacrificed his, and the Same as Hitler Sacrificed the German Army in Siberia at the end of WW2.
It's all been planned in advance. They don't want healthy young males pissed off at the Government, still in their own Country, Why they might bring it down.
And the other main motivator for sacrificing the Troops is the Troops know first hand the Lies the Blood the Sacrifice, the Murder,' they will not be allowed to come home as our grand-parents did, and tell the grand children what a lie it all was.
My Gramps hated the French Blaming them for the massacre at Dunkirk, but what he could not have known, is the French Underground was run by a Masonic order, taking their orders from the Pope.
They Controlling of both sides of the War is how they do it.
Same as the Politcal Parties, sames as it all.
When are people going to learn??
The winning move in ANY 'game of division' is not to play the game. _________________ The queens real name is: Saxe Coburg Gotha. not Windsor. They were installed in 1915.
Government, Meaning/Translation;
Govern = To Control;
Ment, taken from Latin/Greek, Mente = Mind
Government = Control Mind.
Joined: 25 Jul 2005 Posts: 1959 Location: South London
Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2007 12:56 pm Post subject:
paul wright wrote:
The troops in Helmand should know they are there to protect bumper crops year on year of opium to be processed into heroin to appear cheaper and cheaper on the streets of the west
That's their whole purpose there, and the failure of their supposed mission has once again been announced as more bumper harvests are planted
The British Army in Helmand are promoting chep heroin on the streets of Britain. That is their sole purpose for which they are getting killed and maimed
Worthy purpose
I wish people wouldn't claim they "know" the one and only reason for something. I know that since the Taliban were ousted from Afghanistan their effective ban on growing opium poppy has been rescinded and there is now again a flourishing trade in it, some of which, Paul, probably ends up in syringes you treat your patients with.
My understanding of history is that a whole number of interests have to co-incide to make a war possible. In this case one of them, no doubt, was the profits to be made from the opium industry, but there was also the long sought pipe-line across Afghanistan, the desire of the west to fill the vacuum left by the Russian withdrawal before China started filling it. The desire of the Russian government to see the West's arrogant wings clipped by getting bogged down in Afghanistan as Russia had been previously. The desire of the Neocons to spread their influence northwards into the other -Stans, the desire of the weapons manufacturers to try their latest developments out and to profit from them and the desire of the banks to profit from war - that's just a few of the reasons; though I daresay what I have written will not convince you that the sole purpose was not to restart the country's heroin industry.
Morale and fuzzy thinking about what it means to be a soldier aside, back on topic:
Quote:
Why not send free Loose Change or other 9/11 videos to soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan, in order to make them aware of the powers they are serving? Give it a thought.
There's no need - they have their own feeds eg www.liveleak.com - maybe contribute your offerings there? Then they have a choice whether to 'engage in treasonous behaviour' or not...
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are you suggesting the average German recruit was any different to anyone else?
