Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2009 1:43 am Post subject: Dissidents
I continue to be baffled by the mainstream dissdents, Chomsky & Co. Why do they support the official theory... I've have/had always assumed these people were so brave, honest, noble... Its seems that is not the case.
I wonder if being a political dissident, is just their way of obtaining some degree of fame and fortune. Perhaps they are not trying to be brave, noble, or honest, they are just trying to make money and being honest about 911 is not good for business.
I noticed in Naomi Klein's last book, whatever it was called, she makes a completely unnecessary throw away remark about 911, that it was not an inside job, end of discussion. As though she was/felt obleiged to support the official theory. Why?
John Pilger has written a slightly more sympathetic essay, but he pulls his punches. Why?
Chomsky, well I'm sure people are familiar with his remarks....
So whats the deal. Were they just in it for the money all along? Could they actually be CIA/MI5 themselves? Are they being lent on? That these people actually think the official story is more or less true, I find too rediculous to concider....
Oh, and I forgot, Private Eye, where is their 911 special report? In fact, when wasa the last Private Eye special report... Ian Hislop I fear has been seduced by the BBC and is now, or has always been a company man...
Joined: 10 Dec 2005 Posts: 2017 Location: Croydon, Surrey
Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2009 8:57 am Post subject: Re: Dissidents
mr freedom wrote:
So whats the deal. Were they just in it for the money all along? Could they actually be CIA/MI5 themselves? Are they being lent on? That these people actually think the official story is more or less true, I find too ridiculous to consider....
Yes, the heart really sinks, doesn't it?
These people KNOW that stepping into the '9/11 was an inside job' fold would be the end of their careers.
They would be expelled from the club and s*at on from a great height.
They would join David Irving as an object of scorn and pitiless derision.
It is a painful business to even try and answer your question about people one would otherwise admire.
I agree with your statement though. They cannot possibly be so stupid as to not know the truth. This raises unanswerable questions about the perfidy of the human heart.
Alex Jones put this very same question to Aaron Russo in this great interview (below). It is somewhere towards the end.
I'm glad you asked that question, mr freedom. I'd like to write a little more about what kbo234 was getting at (thank-you).
If they are not working for the CIA/MI5 etc, or being lent on by other human+beings, then the simple answer is ego.
They have a great intellect but also huge egoes, and would (a) not want to come out in support of something unless they had irrefutable proof so that they would not be ridiculed (which the ego hates) and called "conspiracy theorists" by their peers. And the only ones with the irrefutable proof (all of it) are the perpetrators themselves, who aren't talking. And/or (b) they were taken in at the time it happened and so will not re-consider their position because it would mean having to admit that they were fooled.
So they do nothing about it.
They are not willing to become fools for the truth's sake.
1 Corinthians 3:18
Let no man deceive himself. If any man among you seemeth to be wise in this world, let him become a fool, that he may be wise.
1 Corinthians 2:14
But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually* discerned.
* Not intellectually.
Great intellect + more ego than selfless spirit = men like Chomsky.
You know, Satan has a great intellect too (greater than anyone writing or reading this). It's basically the ability (or DISability as the case may be) to persuade yourself and others, of your chosen position. Regardless of whether it's the truth.
A kid can be called as witness in a murder case, and the defence might ask him what is your proof? The kid replies I saw him do it. The defence says is that all? What was his motive? The kid says I don't know, I just saw him do it. Then the defence calls a psychologist, who goes on to provide a lengthy intellectual argument as to why the suspect couldn't possibly be the murderer and that he is a high-standing person in the community etc.
A third of the jury is convinced by the obviously far more intellectual argument from the psychologist. Another third doesn't understand many of the words the psychologist used but are really impressed with how clever and authoritative he sounds. The last third is able to spiritually discern that the kid is simply telling the truth and is not taken in by the greater intellect of the psychologist.
What does this have to do with Chomsky and 911? Well, if you have a big ego, and you know that here on Earth, one third is always going to fool another third... and that the majority of intellectuals (like you) are NOT to be found in the remaining third... and a great part of what motivates you to get up in the morning is wanting to impress your peers to strengthen the ego image*... and finally, if you FEAR the thought of having fallen for the same con that "lesser minds" than yours fell for at the time it took place... what would you do?
* "The bigger the trick, and older the trick, the easier it is to pull. Based on two principles - they think it can't be that old, they think it can't be that big, for so many people to have fallen for it. Eventually, when the opponent is challenged or questioned, it mean's the victim's investment, and thus his intelligence, is questioned. No-one (if they have a big ego) can accept that. Not even to themselves..... and they will protect (who they THINK is) their best friend (the ego) with everything they've got." - (Part 1 of 4) Lessons about destroying the ego "self", from the film "Revolver" by Guy Ritchie.
An enemy with a greater intellect than yours can only be countered with an even greater humility and love for the Truth, from you.
Luke 10
21 In that hour Jesus rejoiced in spirit, and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes: even so, Father; for so it seemed good in thy sight.
Matthew 18
3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.
4 Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child, the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven.
Why as a little child? Because they know they know nothing. Satan will always control you as long as you keep believing him, that "you" are clever, and do not humbly recognize that you have been deceived and ask God for help.
The ego is also present and growing in the minds of those who know and say 911 was a false-flag (because they were "smarter" and didn't fall for it). It will use any arrogance (weakness in the spirit-being) it finds. As long as the ego rules us, Satan rules this planet, for what we call the ego is no other than his image. So what does it matter if the humans who carried out Satan's plan for him are punished, if they are merely replaced by others also controlled by the ego... controlled by him?
Don't the Protocols of Zion indicate that the politicians will be shamed and done away with, to be replaced with their false king and his pals? Well that seems to be their plan anyway, to mimic and thwart God's Plan of His Son, the REAL King, taking power and ruling fairly instead.
God made our spirit-beings in His image, Satan deconstructs them and re-builds them in his image.
Time to reverse that fall. Time to stop believing that voice telling you this is nonsense or crazy, and that you are so much cleverer, if you haven't stopped listening to it already.
Thanks for the replies. I have not had time to watch the Aaron Russo interview yet, but maybe later! I can't entirely agree with you Danny, in that, I'm sure these people would describe themselves as conspiracy theorists. Chomsky certainly has. Also, these people do not require irrefutable proof, they are willing and able to join the dots and reach damning conclusions, but not on this issue.... However, I do agree that it is perhaps about ego, and as kbo234 said, they would become objects of scorn and pitiless derision. Although I can buy that about Chomsky, I struggle with the idea that Pilger's concern is ego, but perhaps... Oh how depressing. I am slowly succeeding in deChomskyfying a friend of mine, but Chomsky has such a reputation, that it is taking years!
"I mean, for one thing, they would have had to be INSANE to try anything like that."
There's no doubt they are exactly that.
"First, if they had, it's almost certain that it would have leaked."
It hasn't for the same reason that he refuses to entertain the possibility, seriously.
"... and the belief that it could have been done (Bush admin behind 911) has such LOW CREDIBILITY."
What would his peers think of him?
"Anybody who knows anything about the sciences would instantly discount that evidence."
Just totally wrong.
"Afterward you can put them (events) into some kind of pattern, but beforehand you can't."
Project for a new American century? We need a new Pearl Harbour? Problem, reaction, solution?
"So, the evidence that's been produced (by others), in my opinion, is totally worthless."
But he didn't do any research himself. Why not? Why didn't he ever investigate the possibility that it was a false-flag, before arriving at his opinion?
Ego. No need to. He would "know". No way could he have been fooled.
"Even if it were true, who cares?"
His ego does if he was fooled. And so cold-blooded. No feelings there, which is a clue. He's like one of THEM in this instance, even though he often speaks against them. Who cares about the truth?? Wow.
Joined: 10 Dec 2005 Posts: 2017 Location: Croydon, Surrey
Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2009 5:14 pm Post subject:
Danny wrote:
"Even if it were true, who cares?"
His ego does if he was fooled. And so cold-blooded. No feelings there, which is a clue. He's like one of THEM in this instance, even though he often speaks against them. Who cares about the truth?? Wow.
Yes, he did say this. He also said "If it happened, so what? What difference does it make?"
Absolutely breathtaking......particularly coming from a 'tender heart' like Chomsky.
I suppose it doesn't make any difference, if you believe that your criminal friends who control the media will never allow this particular truth to be acknowledged as such in the public domain.
Chomsky is a stinking hypocrite. A parasite who has played an important part in controlling his host and then, with immeasurable treachery, he betrays the well-intentioned American people for whom he has been allowed to be a figurehead.
I fervently hope a real revolution comes round before this guy passes away and he survives to get his just rewards.
All his lifelong analysis, heartache and proselytising on behalf of the suffering of the abused and oppressed is just so much vicious spit in their eyes.
His ego does if he was fooled. And so cold-blooded. No feelings there, which is a clue. He's like one of THEM in this instance, even though he often speaks against them. Who cares about the truth?? Wow.
I particularly think you are right here, in the sense that this quote is a clue. I can't find it, but I'm sure I have seen him say that he does not like commenting on this publicly, also that he did not like commenting publicly on the Kennedy assasinasion. I want to be sympathetic to this man. He is so absurdly dishonest on this issue. Could that be his only way of telling us that he cannot speak openly about it?
Pilger: Yet, this modest, blue-covered book is a revelation. Like the Butler report in the UK, which detailed all the incriminating evidence of Blair's massaging of intelligence before the invasion of Iraq, then pulled its punches and concluded nobody was responsible, so the Kean report makes excruciatingly clear what really happened, then fails to draw the conclusions that stare it in the face. It is a supreme act of normalising the unthinkable. This is not surprising, as the conclusions are volcanic.
But then Pliger pulls his punches, and does not commit his conclusions to paper. WHY?!?!?!?
Joined: 10 Dec 2005 Posts: 2017 Location: Croydon, Surrey
Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2009 6:53 pm Post subject:
[quote="mr freedom"]Danny, I agree.
Quote:
Could that be his only way of telling us that he cannot speak openly about it?
No one is going to lock him up in a gulag. No one is going to drag him away and shoot him. he has had a long and very privileged life.
If he wanted to "tell us" he couldn't speak openly, why doesn't he just refuse to speak about the issue at all.
That would speak volumes.
Like yourself, I was pretty desperate to believe in this man's integrity.....but no........whichever way you wriggle he attacked truth tellers, declared evidence 'non-existent' and allegations meaningless, even if true.
NO ONE MADE HIM DO THIS.
He could have used words like 'puzzling', 'worrying', 'concerning' or what-have-you.
HE DIDN'T.
Don't try and kid yourself he is secretly on the side of truth.
He is knowingly part of the 'controlled opposition' to American Imperialism and Zionism........which means, in practice, he is an enabler of the things he purports to oppose.
Does he necessarily consciously work in service of the evils of US imperialism and Zionism he speaks out against?
That, one must agree, remains difficult to believe. People do deceive themselves when they sense danger....maybe something like this is going on.
However, that is to take a kind view. One cannot judge another soul.......but it is clear to see the consequence of Chomsky's actions. He is a traitor to truth and to the victims of Zionism and US imperialism, whatever his rationalisations might be.
You take a hard line kbo234, and I'm not unsympathetic to your view...
Another reason I try (if desperately) to give the dissidents the benefit of the doubt, is that they are collectively refusing to get involved. I find that strange. All of them? Not a good apple among them.... I don't want to accept that, but ok, it might be true :-/
I was going to make a post just before kbo234. And say what if kbo234 wrote a book, made a film or just by what he says to people.
Would he compromise it or just tell it the way he sees it. And the answer is no he wouldn’t he has to much integrity for that. So why is it that some can role of lies like it doesn’t matter. When you follow the consequences of it through, it really is a form of insanity that can only lead to darkness chaos and death.
At times we all lie or have; it is something that all human beings have in common. Most never stop to look at it this way and see it all as normal, a sure sign of insanity.
A hard concept to grasp.
Small children
Innocence. There is not the presence of evil about them until it gains more conscientiousness (soul) (something we have all experienced as we became more aware of our selves when very young) like there is with all people that you can see if you are more awake.
I suppose what I am trying to say is that’s where we have to begin, realising that we know nothing of any real true lasting value until we realise that we are really a soul in a body then and only then can we begin to learn what we may not want to but need to.
Joined: 10 Dec 2005 Posts: 2017 Location: Croydon, Surrey
Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2009 9:16 pm Post subject:
mr freedom wrote:
You take a hard line kbo234, and I'm not unsympathetic to your view...
Another reason I try (if desperately) to give the dissidents the benefit of the doubt, is that they are collectively refusing to get involved. I find that strange. All of them? Not a good apple among them.... I don't want to accept that, but ok, it might be true :-/
The other thing is 'mr freedom' that these are all people of the very highest intelligence. Almost certainly much smarter than you and me.
The problem cannot be that they 'don't get it'. They 'get it' all to well and have done their calculations and made their compromises.
My guess, would be that, like Galloway, they regard the influence they already exert as 'for the good' and they don't want to abandon this ability to 'do good' as they see it. There must be a willful denial and blindness to the greater betrayal that, in my opinion, far outweighs any further positive influence their left-wing outpourings can produce.
My guess, would be that, like Galloway, they regard the influence they already exert as 'for the good' and they don't want to abandon this ability to 'do good' as they see it. There must be a willful denial and blindness to the greater betrayal that, in my opinion, far outweighs any further positive influence their left-wing outpourings can produce.
Yes, that sounds reasonable. Perhaps they fear the truth coming out, and perhaps we all should. I don't spend time imagining what would happen if the truth came out because I don't think it ever will, but also I cannot imagine what would happen to the status quo, perhaps the dissidents can.
That’s an excellent example, if we can’t envision how it should be if we followed the real Laws Covenant for Justice for all then we are really lost and going in circles and that is really the history of mankind that very few, can envision it (nothing personal to you only). And certainly the so called intellectuals can't. If you notice no one here will discuss this, or it seems not willing to learn. Ego!
Joined: 10 Dec 2005 Posts: 2017 Location: Croydon, Surrey
Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2009 10:23 pm Post subject:
mr freedom wrote:
...... Perhaps they fear the truth coming out, and perhaps we all should. I don't spend time imagining what would happen if the truth came out because I don't think it ever will, but also I cannot imagine what would happen to the status quo, perhaps the dissidents can.
......Of course, the truth is already out.
It is just that the criminal international financiers and their allies who control parliament and the media will not let it be spoken 'officially'.
The powerful decide what is true. In this sense lies are truth. Our world is already Orwellian.
However, we are heading for some very big changes very soon. Who knows how the dice will eventually fall.
For me, I believe in God and in the teaching of Jesus Christ. Satan will have his day but the God of Christ, the Creator will triumph.
It is written.
.....can't prove it with words, of course. Faith runs too deep and comes out of extreme and very personal experiences. However, mad though it might sound, I'm sure of this.
Thankfully there are many others that agree. Here's one of them......Ned Dougherty who after having a profound and life-changing near-death experience now believes he gets regular messages from Michael the Archangel, amongst others (sorry, am I hijacking a thread, Tony?)
Anyway, I love this stuff:
The following message is an interior locution received by Ned Dougherty, who attests and represents that he continually receives messages from Jesus, Mary, and St. Michael the Archangel on or about the first day of each and every month since the inauguration date of the monthly messages on August 1st, 2005.
August 1, 2009 at 11:00pm
Dockside on Boca Ciega Bay, St. Pete Beach Florida
(In response to my discerning and challenging that the source of this evening’s unfolding message truly is St. Michael the Archangel, a bolt of lightning and a powerful wind appears directly before me in the night sky over Boca Ciega Bay.)
Message from St. Michael the Archangel,
Lo and Behold! The winds of time are quickly approaching now upon humanity. The gathering of the galloping herd of the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse is beginning to stir. The time is now when the great confrontation of the Good versus the Evil will take place over and above and around all of humanity.
Many of you have been called upon in these times and specifically now in this particular time in the Universe to sound the alarm of the pending doom to the evildoers of the world, for the time of Great Tribulation will soon begin.
You, who are attuned to the changes that are about to take place, have begun to prepare your plans to do the work of the Father in Heaven, His Son the Redeemer, and the Holy Spirit, since you have been called upon in these times to usher in the Era of Peace. Know this, that the time is now very short, before the great events that are about to take place truly begin.
In the darkness that is gathering around the world in the economies, in the governments, in the militaries, in the bastions of commerce, in all of these areas of power and control, the dark one is rearing his ugly head in a planned attempt that has been brewing for many ages to create worldwide global anarchy. The events to achieve such anarchy are now being put in place by the minions of the evil one, who have been going about their work here on earth covertly and secretly planning events that are loathsome and despicable to bring about the ruin of the God fearing and freedom loving peoples of the world.
Do not fall into this dark and sinister plan to control each and every one of you. Be prepared for the dark events that are about to take place. Do not accept this new world order as the authority over you that it elusively claims entitlement to; for the Father in Heaven will crush any plan that calls for the world to be dominated by the dark order of the ancient and secret occultist societies that are preparing for a control of the world that is intended to bring the world to its knees and in ruins.
The plans of the dark one and his minions will not succeed, for the powers of the Holy Trinity will intervene and smash to smithereens the plans of the dark horse of destruction. From the four corners of the Earth, the Archangels will commence the attack against the dark forces of satan and the beginning of this final conflagration will begin very soon as witnessed by the Great Shaking that will envelope your planet Earth. And it is then that the final battle will take place.
The victor will be the Father in Heaven and the defeated one will be his dark adversary, who had been cast out of Heaven and into the bowels of hell only to be released to torment humanity for thousands of years until now.
But, no, this torment will change, just when the dark one is in pursuit of his final victory. Woe to those who plotted and planned with the dark one in these times to usher in this dark world order that is contrary to the laws and nature of the Father who has created all of you.
You will soon begin to recognize more clearly, who the dark forces actually are, and many of you will be shocked and surprised at the individuals and entities of the world that have been working underground to bring about a dark plan of manipulation and control of the peoples of the world. Their plans will be foiled and they will be exposed, so prepare now for the battle ahead.
Trust only in God the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit to guide you through these times. Do not trust any world or global authority that emerges during this time period to claim the authority to manipulate and control you, for there is no such authority that has been chosen by the Father in Heaven to lead humanity in these times. There is only one authority and that is the Father of All; the Master who has created all that there is. He alone will rule the world in these times, so prepare for His Kingdom to become part of you kingdom and world here on Earth.
For the Father now, in these times, will directly intervene in the affairs of all mankind and bring about an end to the reign of terror that has been perpetrated upon humanity by His enemies in hell and their minions here on Earth.
The Great Battle is about to begin. Do not stand aside and choose only to be an observer, for the Lord and Saviour is calling upon all of humanity to raise your prayers very powerfully now above you toward the Kingdom of the Heavens. Your prayers are now most important to usher in the Era of Peace.
It is up to you now to prepare for the Great Battle, for the time is soon.
And the time of the world continuing to be, as you know it now, will soon come to an end.
And that is only the beginning of the great journey that awaits all of you who answer the call of the Lord!
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