A few comments that have been added to this original post may clarify what I am explaining, so take a look if you have the time.
I am copying that original post here. Please review the information and post your comments. Share this information with everyone!
Let me know if anything like this has been considered, or is even possible.
I'm not an engineer but I've been looking at whatever information I can find - especially on the floor to core connections. I haven't been able to find out how accessible they would have been.
Here are my observations and theory on the tower collapses:
I will use the word “They”, as I do not know who “They” are. I hope we will all know very soon…
They separated the top 10 floors from the inner core columns simultaneously using multiple, small, thermic charges. When the combined weight of the detached floors hit the trusses of the next lower floor, they knew that the impact would be enough to initiate catastrophic building failure.
They counted on the strength of the outer load bearing walls to concentrate the mass, directing the energy downward and inward. When this focused, destructive force encountered the damaged, plane-impacted sections of the towers it ripped through the remaining intact core columns, tearing them apart. This severing of the inner core columns marks the beginning of the visible collapse for each of the towers.
The mass tumbled forcefully within the confines of the outer walls, “snow-balling” in effect as the remaining internal structures failed in rapid succession contributing additional mass and energy to the cumulative destructive force. Eventually, the pressure became too great for the outer walls to contain. This failure of the outer walls resulted in the mushroom-like ejection of debris.
Additional small charges intended to further weaken the structures may have been dispersed throughout the towers to foment catastrophic failure and collapse. This would explain the visual phenomenon of “squibs”, out jetting of air and eye-witness accounts of explosions and other anomalies throughout the buildings.
Gravitational, not explosive force was used to pulverize the buildings from the inside-out, and from the top down. This use of kinetic energy and gravitational forces is a fundamental controlled demolition principle. To all outward appearances, the collapses seem to initiate at the point of impact on both buildings, but audio and visual evidence clearly indicates otherwise. Seismic records may also be an indicator of the true sequence of destruction once they are synchronized correctly to the specific collapse events.
This explanation accounts for both the existence of explosive residue found in the rubble and the lack of any irrefutable evidence that massive explosive force was used to compromise the integrity of the core columns.
I have used 10 floors in my description as an arbitrary number. As long as the 11th floor could not survive the impact, the number is adequate for illustrative purposes. The actual minimum number of involved floors necessary to propagate the simultaneous failure of all inner core attachments can be calculated precisely.
Please watch & listen to the following video. The times I have given are approximations based on casual observance only.
Note the increased smoke appearing at approximately 0:21, the audible rumble at 0:41, as well as the lack of any discernable physical changes of the towers appearance. At approximately 0:51 seconds, the antennae array begins to drop straight down – a sign that the core columns have failed on all sides of the building simultaneously. At 0:57 the audible rumble increases then remains constant throughout the rest of the collapse. The video was shot from some distance. The sound waves generated by the events in the video travel slower than light, and arrive after what is seen, or as demonstrated - unseen.
In this next compilation video, we hear the sounds of collapse almost at the same instant we see it occur in both towers. This is impossible given the distance from which these clips were taken. Whatever event created the sounds that appear to coincide with the collapses actually occurred a few seconds before, and again, there is no discernable movement preceding the visible collapse event.
Seismic records show markedly similar patterns for each of the collapses. The interpretations of the data have been erroneously correlated to visible signs of collapse and do not take into account the collapse initiation event which precedes the visible structural failures.
NorthTower Seismic Graph
SouthTower Seismic Graph
This video appears to visually demonstrate the initial tremor caused by the actual collapse initiation event that I have described:
WTCTower 1 Collapse
Review videos of the tower collapses, and you will find evidence that the mass of material inside the towers at the moment of visible collapse is already moving rapidly. The debris that is ejected out at the plane impact sites is also traveling at velocities much higher than would be expected due to a single floor “pancake” event occurring at the moment of visible collapse. Within a few seconds, an estimated 30 story “zone of debris” can be clearly seen traveling down the inside of the tower walls.
Both towers collapsed in remarkable similar fashion, because in fact, both towers were intentionally collapsed in exactly the same manner. Large amounts of explosives were not used to accomplish this feat, nor were they necessary.
Addition:
Please note that I am not talking about completely destroying the floors - only the inner-core to floor connections. This "tips" the floors and aims all of the weight and energy directly toward the next lower core to floor connection.
I do not think the intent was to directly destroy either the inner core columns or the outer wall structure - that was just an added bonus for whoever did this.
Joined: 13 Sep 2006 Posts: 2568 Location: One breath from Glory
Posted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 11:13 pm Post subject:
Sounds a bit like the original pancake theory which didnt really address the fact that had the floors pancaked the 47 massive central core columns would have been left standing to some degree like the spindle on your old record deck when the records had fallen.
Also a bit of what you suggest might not account for the speed of collapse which indicates that floors below did not offer any resistance to falling debris.
Another arguement is if you drop the top 10 stories onto the structure below then that structire has been designed to carry the weight of the 10 stories above it anyway, although I understand the floor slabs and metal decking below were not carrying loads of the structure above
The huge volumes of dust would IMO not be possible with just gravitational forces hence the 2 different thoughts of explosives or directed energy weapon.
And how about building 7?
The similarities of WTC1 and 2 collapse would suggest to me that the deployment of any explosive/cutter charges followed a similar plan necessitated by the structure and also perhaps accessibility to steelwork. Whilst CD is an understandable method the secretive logistics of deploying it within an occupied building is not so easy to accept. _________________ JO911B.
"for we wrestle not against flesh and blood but against principalities, against powers, against rulers of the darkness of this world, against wicked spirits in high places " Eph.6 v 12
Here are some of my replies from the thread at the letsroll forum. It addresses most of the issues you have brought up. The weight of the concrete alone in flooring is known to be approximately 600 tons, calculated by volume. That needs to be known so you understand where that figure came from. It does not include the floor pan or truss weights:
Quote:
The effort was not to directly destroy the core columns or the outer walls - only to destroy the floors by letting them "hinge" down toward the center and eventually break off, "knifing" their way down along the core on edge - shearing the lower floor to core connections.
This theory would explain the strange behavior of the top section of the South tower as well. With no floor connections - the outer wall "shell" would've been free to tip toward the direction of the section that was compromised by the plane impact. The core columns would not have had to even bend for it to tip once the floor connections were broken.
I don't think they necessarily expected the core or outer walls to fail, they only needed to break the floor to inner-core connections to, in effect, destroy the buildings.
The catastrophic failures of the core and outer walls that did occur was just gravy. They must have been quite pleased with themselves.
Please show the information I have posted to everyone. When all other possibilities are exhausted, the one that is left is most likely the answer.
It is not necessary to show that what I have described would destroy either the core or outer walls. Only inner-core ends of the relatively weak floor connections needed to be compromised. The entire weight of the floor pans is in this way hinged at the outer end. This ensures that the entire 600+ ton weight of each floor is directed at the inner connections of the floor below.
In a few videos - a tall spindle of core column remains intact for a few seconds after the collapse - do you think they just "forgot" to blow that one up, or did it happen survive for a few extra seconds completely by chance?
Concerning the observable rate of collapse of the outer wall structures:
Quote:
If you use the outer wall structure as your reference [the calculated rate of collapse will be wrong]. What I am saying is that the internal collapse was initiated well before any visible movement of the outer walls.
You would need to be looking at the leading edge of the destruction zone that can be observed moving down inside the outer walls, and even then you may only be observing the "aftermath" of the floor separations - not the actual moment of separation.
It would also need to be shown what kind of weight or impact forces the inner-core/wall connections could withstand. I'm saying - they cannot stand much force at all before they fail.
The inner-core and outer walls were incredibly strong. The floors were not.
Again addressing issues surrounding collapse, resistance and the pulverization of material:
Quote:
The 600+ tons of floor weight was concentrated into a relatively few square feet of area when it was dropped by detaching only 1 end of the weight.
Eventually, the outer wall connections would fail, as I don't think the connections where designed to hold the entire 600+ ton weight plus the added stress of the deformation caused by the floors tilting.
When the outer wall connections eventually gave way - the floors most likely would have slid down along the tilted lower floors that had already had their inner connections destroyed.
As the sliding floors hit the core columns, they would have been directed almost vertically straight down along the core columns, shearing any intact core connections they encountered.
As large sheets, or chunks (broken sections) of flooring fell loose form the outer walls, much of it would tumble as as it fell if it encountered other things like still partially attached floor sections, segments of core column that began to separate, or anything else with enough resistance to withstand the impact without totally breaking free.
The effect would be like a giant gravity-fed pulverizer as things began to bounce around more & more (about half way down the towers).
I don't think the inner core connections could have provided nearly enough resistance to withstand the impact of even 1 600 ton floor, much less a cascade of them as they broke free and all hit in a very concentrated location - right next to the core columns which were actually guiding them to their next target.
Edit: Think of a vertical stack of brittle, but very heavy dominoes with a little space in between them - just as if you stood them up on end on a table top to tip them over in a chain event sequence. Tip one side of your vertical dominoes and they hit in sequence very rapidly until they are all tipped - release the other side just after each one tips, and you've got a stream of falling dominoes all aimed at roughly the same location.
I hope this helps. Some of the information in the quotes may be redundant, but overall I think they give a clearer picture. The actual separations of the inner floor connections happened well in advance of visible collapse and cannot be seen. The observable effect of the failures is misleading when used to determine the speed or actual cause of the catastrophic failures.
WTC 7 may or may not have been intentionally demolished. The only certain targets were the towers, and the only explanation for their failures is intentional demolition. The floor trusses and their connections were the most vulnerable points.
A proper investigation may determine what actually happened to building 7. Proving that the tower collapses were intentional and possible without massive explosive force would make the building 7 collapse a rather mute point.
If intent can be proven in the tower collapses, WTC 7 will most likely be proven to be an intentional act as well. I believe it was intentional, but it may very well have been unintentional (though unlikely) - and has been nothing more than an unsolvable distraction from the true crime - the collapse of the towers.
The towers should remain the focus of any investigation, because we know that they did not collapse due to the plane strikes or the resulting fires. There is no evidence of explosive force large enough to destroy the core columns. The only alternative is that gravity, along with the available mass and energy within the structures themselves were used to destroy the buildings. It only makes sense to exploit the weakest "linK" in the structures and use all available forces to their greatest extent.
Building 7 should not distract us from uncovering the truth of the tower collapses, simply because we have been so far, unable to explain their destruction.
Last edited by Wastecase on Wed Mar 10, 2010 3:17 am; edited 1 time in total
The floor trusses which can be seen in the second video look almost ridiculous when you see them next to the massive core and outer wall structures. They were not intended for any purpose other than carrying and distributing their own weight plus the associated live loads expected in a typical office building. The protective shell of the inner core and outer walls was designed to protect them. I'm sure the building designers did not fathom any intentional destruction of the floors when they were designed.
The massively reinforced caps of the towers connected the core columns to the outer walls. Any lateral movement or forces due to wind or storms was transferred from the outer walls directly to the core columns through the caps, not the floor trusses.
WTC 7 may or may not have been intentionally demolished. The only certain targets were the towers, and the only explanation for their failures is intentional demolition. The floor trusses and their connections were the most vulnerable points.
...
Building 7 should not distract us from uncovering the truth of the tower collapses, simply because we have been so far, unable to explain their destruction.
I fundamentally disagree.
WTC7 is the clearest indication of Controlled Demolition - it is a "traditional" CD as opposed to the twin towers that were obviously "staged" to make them appear to be not like a traditional CD - thus looking at WTC7 makes it easier to prove the CD theory.
Then the question arises... why go to all the effort of knocking down WTC7?!
WTC7 is, I suspect, one of the main targets for the plotters of 9/11. And that target is the SEC housd within WTC7. Within that organisation was the physical evidence of countless fraud investigations. The biggest being ENRON. ENRON collapsed a month after 9/11 - so people must have known that it was in a collapsing state sometime before that!!!
Andrew Stephen disentangles the Enron scandal and introduces us to another venture with links not just to top politicians, but also to the Bin Laden family
Which then completely ignores the Bin Laden connection. Editted out? Most Probably! Going to Internet Archive / Wayback Machine - the article has been "erased".
There is enough of the article to confirm that ENRON and the Bush Administration were rather intimately tied together....
Therefore the unlikely destruction of especially strengthened WTC7, whose sprinkler system had been disabled, predicted by the news networks and firemen on the ground, its collapse hidden from view by the BBC, containing incriminating and embarrassing documents, ignored by the 9/11 Commission, covered up (literally since its plot has already been built upon) and reluctantly and incompetently investigated by NIST only 2008 - with one of the key witnesses to events (Barry Jennings) mysteriously dying on the same week as the NIST report is published(!).... is a vital key to unlocking the truth about 9/11.
Wastecase; if you really want comments on a new theory, post your ideas on A&E for 9/11 truth.
Sorry, but this seems to me (without reading your stuff in detail, or pretending to understand it), like more obfuscation, or dare I say it, Black Ops, to further muddy the waters.
Let's face it. The evidence for an inside job has continued to mount for years now and each revelation just makes truthers harder to sideline. The answer is not more theories, but an open investigation (just woke up and my coffee was cold again). _________________ In the end, it's not the words of your enemies you will remember, but the silence of your friends. Martin Luther King
I will do that redadare. I have checked their site a couple of times for a forum, but must have overlooked it. I will look again.
The next best thing I could come up with was to post this to other forums to try and get more people looking at it. I have called ae911truth but was only able to leave a message on their answering machine. I also used their online contact form to direct them to the other forum postings that I have made.
I just wanted to get this out there, because it seemed to me like the most logical way to destroy the towers without large explosions.
Like I said, when I first started thinking about this, I went straight to the debunking sites to see if anything they had to offer would directly contradict what I had come up with for an explanation. All of the reasons they cited for explaining and dismissing previous CD theories did not preclude this one. The debunking information actually supported my idea.
I only hope that people will start looking at this from a slightly different perspective and consider how the limited physical mass and forces available could have been exploited to intentionally destroy the two buildings.
I was a little paranoid when I first came up with this idea because it seemed to explain the events - and no one else has suggested anything like what I have described, unless you consider the bogus NIST pancake theory; which I think was an intentional misdirection. If I am right, I really don't want to be the only one on the planet that has some insight as to how it was done.
I appreciate everyone taking the time to look at what I have presented, and I hope it will get more people thinking realistically about how this could have been done without large explosive force. We know it was intentional, and we know that explosive compounds were used to great effect in some way that is not readily apparent. Within those constraints we are left with only few possibilities. Either they planted 100's of tons of explosives throughout the buildings somehow undetected over the course of several months, or they planted a much smaller quantity in a very specific way over a short time frame (days as opposed to months) which limited their exposure and the possibility of detection.
I'm sure that the ae911 lawsuit seeking an independent investigation will go through because of the evidence of explosive residue they have found which was completely ignored by NIST. I hope that they will consider what I have said and investigate this possibility during any subsequent investigation of the attacks.
It just seemed surprising to me that nothing like this has been suggested before. Maybe it has, and I am just not aware of it.
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