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Riaz Ahmed
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 Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 12:12 pm Post subject: Forced to convert to Islam at gun point!!! |
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Its news like this that really make my Blood boil! What propaganda and rubbish they spill to tarnish this peaceful religion. I know there are a few that go to the extrems in all religions. But this!!!
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060827/ap_on_re_mi_ea/gaza_journalists
There are hundreds of verses in the Noble Quran that says "there is no compusion in Islam".
RANT OVER!!!
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celtislam
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| Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 12:22 pm Post subject: |
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Fox news lol what a joke , they will do anything to make muslims look bad , i cannot believe what fox news says as it is blatently pro zionist and anti islam.
There is no compulsion in religion. The right direction is henceforth distinct from error. And he who rejecteth false deities and believeth in Allah hath grasped a firm handhold which will never break. Allah is Hearer, Knower. Al Quraan [ The Cow ; 2:256 ] |
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blackcat
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celtislam
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| Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 1:31 pm Post subject: |
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Dont you mean that man who is mentality insane from afghanistan? anyways we could split hairs al day about people forcing their beliefs onto others , what we say as muslim, is that there is no compulsion in religion and if you force your beliefs you only make people into a life of hypocracy no?
peace and one love |
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Riaz Ahmed
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| Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 1:34 pm Post subject: |
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Blackcat:
| Quote: | | So there isn't a man in Pakistan awaiting execution for the crime of having rejected Islam in favour of Christianity? |
No denying that maybe the case. But its totally against the tenants of Islam!!! As mentioned before - there are people who just take things to extreme. And by the way - Pakistan or any other country in this world is not a Islamic State. Their systems are populated by rituals and customs, and only a fraction is according some Islamic laws.
I have seen the above story - as usual its will milked to the last minute.
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Me
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| Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 1:47 pm Post subject: |
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I'm agnostic in my theological beliefs and opposed to organized religion of any kind. I've found that many of those who condemn Muslims & Islam fail to recognize the voluminous amounts of insanity that can be found in the Bible. It's really a double-standard. Christians must not forget a certain ultra-violent time period known as the Crusades when casting aspersions upon others. I’m against radical faith-based fundamentalism of any kind. The whole "my God is better than yours" debate is ludicrous and drenched in ego.
This is one of my favorite posts and I always show it whenever the topic of religion is brought up.
It makes a statement on over-analyzing the bible.
http://www.davidicke.com/
| Quote: | On her radio show, Dr Laura Schlesinger said that, as an observant Orthodox Jew, she views homosexuality as an abomination according to Leviticus 18:22, and cannot condone it under any circumstance. The following response is an open letter to Dr. Laura, penned by a US resident, which was posted on the Internet.
Dear Dr. Laura:
Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate.
I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some other elements of God's Law and how to follow them.
1. When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord - Lev.1:9. The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?
2. I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?
3. I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness - Lev.15: 19-24. The problem is how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.
4. Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify?
Why can't I own Canadians?
5. I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2. The passage clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself?
6. A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination - Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this? Are there 'degrees' of abomination?
7. Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?
8. Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev.19:27. How should they die?
9. I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?
10. My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev. 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? - Lev.24:10-16. Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)
I know you have studied these things extensively and thus enjoy considerable expertise in such matters, so I am confident you can help. Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging.
Your adoring fan,
James M. Kauffman, Ed.D.
Professor Emeritus, University of Virginia
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Riaz Ahmed
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| Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 2:08 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for your post "Me"
I have studied major faiths and you are quite right in what you say and you are entitled to that.
I wish that I have never started this thread now - because its a major subject which I love to discuss.
But I would like to stress that Islam is not a religion - its simply a set of rules like a Government manifesto and its a way of life. And we do not promote that our God is better then yours. All religions have the same God. The only thing is that scripts have changed to suite kinghoods and agendas at the time. And you're right , because some factions do promote that and it's wronge.
I always say - look at Islamic history and the holy scripts (that have not been changed from day one) , and not the people that follow it. Because I admit myself - that we are not proper Muslims that follow the great Islamic history where Jews, Muslims and Christians lived under mutual law in peace.
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Me
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| Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 2:27 pm Post subject: |
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No problem Riaz.
I was involved in a similar discussion a while back and it inspired me to write the following. It sums up my views fairly well.
| Quote: | What conclusive proof is there that the Bible (or any other alleged “Holy” book for that matter) was written by God or even divinely inspired by God through man? I might just as well believe in the existence of the tooth fairy, Easter bunny or Santa and his jolly little elves prancing about at the north pole. We now know thanks to the wonders of science that the planet isn’t flat nor is it only 5,000 years old and the earth really revolves around the sun and not the other way around. Of course Galileo had to die for proving this because the ever so tolerant church at the time deemed it blasphemy to speak of such things. Essentially he died just for telling what we now know to be the truth. This of course begs the important question, if the church was so utterly wrong about that, what other major errors could there be hidden within its teachings?
It most certainly doesn’t end there, there is a multiplicity of other falsehoods to expose. The story of Noah’s Ark for one is an absolute impossibility (it’s comical really) and there’s no such thing as talking snakes as described in the imagined garden of Eden. When many of these claims aren’t demonstrably outright false, they’re completely unsupported by any sort of corroborating evidence. That’s where the ever so convenient concept of faith comes in to the rescue. In other words cross your fingers, close your eyes, make a wish and hope that all or at least some of the contrived fantasy that you’ve bought in to is actually true. Not exactly the most reliable basis and foundation for structuring your entire way of life around I must say. As a self-proclaimed secularist I choose to remain focused on reality and that which is provable rather than being lost in an Alice In Wonderland type enchanted world of hopeful theory and unrealistic speculation. It’s about as tangible as a delusional dream land or a drug induced hallucination. Not that I have anything against the latter (but that’s another topic entirely).
To get right down to the crux of the matter, the Bible I believe was the greatest and most successful book of mind control that was ever written. In that sense it absolutely served it’s purpose of brainwashing its unaware subjects and guiding them like miniscule chess pieces. The same way that Santa Clause was and still is used to regulate young children’s behavior, the perceived imminent threat of hellfire and brimstone controls the adult, God fearing, rock n’ roll protesting, sign picketing holier than thou zealots of religion. I often conflate Osama Bin Laden with Lucifer and the similar boogeyman, “watch out, he’s out to get you” threatening roles that they play. There’s not much difference between the two methods of behavior modification. Bill Maher said it best, “God is like an imaginary friend for adults”. At least when a child finally matures enough he eventually learns through experience that no fat man in a red suit has been sliding down his chimney at night and dropping off presents. His parents were really the ones eating the milk and cookies. If only we could say the same for the ardent Bible thumpers who keep on believing in their irrational fallacy.
All evil (or what we think of as evil) is usually rooted in either one of two things, fear and/or ignorance. The Bible imho was written by man (‘not God‘) as a powerful manipulative tool intended to feed in to and exploit these undesirable negative qualities of man. It wasn’t meant to enlighten its followers, but rather to hold them down and force them in to a perfect state of obedience and homogenized conformity. It’s so much easier to manipulate large groups of people when they all believe the same thing, especially with cult-like fervor. Thus, Christianity was born and the plot was implemented.
Have you ever noticed that every follower of every religion no matter how different they are feels just as strongly and passionately as the next that their dogmatic beliefs are the only true and correct ones? Despite the obvious arrogance and self-centeredness of such claims it also speaks to a much more important fact. Most religious fundamentalists also believe in literal interpretations and absolute truth. For this reason alone, only one of all the world’s vast religions can be the one authentic version. This of course by default makes all of the rest them false. This also means that regardless of what is or isn’t true, there are undoubtedly millions of devout followers of various religions worldwide that are unwittingly worshipping a faulty belief system. I’ll even take this one step further and surmise that it’s actually far more likely that none of them are completely correct (or even close). Again, to reiterate what I said earlier, all that we have to refer to for proof of any of this is faith which really amounts to nothing more then credulous, unsubstantiated opinion. Each person’s personal God is only as real as his/her overly active imagination. My conclusion… holy books such as the Bible are works of fiction, a steadily aging compilation of allegorical fables chronicling the so-called lives of characters that never really existed and never will. The perfect ruse to keep the sheeple in line as I‘ll explain in further detail.
Nowadays it seems that the believers have much faith in God, but no faith in themselves. They’re taught that they’re sinners at birth, inherently unworthy and in dire need of being saved by some invisible man in the sky. This of course means that they’re entirely dependant upon the church (which just so happens to have all of the answers they seek) for salvation and enlightenment (so they’re told). This makes it simple and easy for those that find it too hard to think and formulate rational conclusions about life and the obvious differences between right and wrong on their own. It’s so much easier to be told what to do, say, think and feel by someone else that you‘ve been fooled in to believing knows better then you do. Where they go wrong is that ‘someone else’ amounts to other devious men tenaciously seeking to control and mislead them. They’re indeed being indoctrinated but not with the divine words of the God that they’ve been groomed to believe in, it‘s nothing less then spiritual propaganda. And yet with just the right amount of tithing, confessing and praying for your sins you just might be able to secure your path to salvation if you’re lucky. This means that you’ve now lost control of your mind, body, soul and even your wallet. Quite liberating huh? What a grand amount of power that this places in to the hands of the church and the evangelicals wouldn’t you say? And do you honestly think that this is all by accident? There are no coincidences, it’s all pre-meditated and exacted by design. You’re trained to believe that for some odd reason you need them in order to make it in to heaven. This same exact kind of paranoia can drive a man to literally blow himself up for his creator believing that he’ll actually be greeted with seventy virgins in the after-life as a reward for his gracious sacrifice. The church assumes the role of the middle-man/mediator between you and your God. Secularists cut out the middle-man and head straight for the ultimate source. We don’t need a church, a priest, a proselytizer or anyone else to tell us where to find our own personal truths which are located within. In reality no one does, some just believe that they do because of the long traditions of programming and conditioning that they have endured since the inception of organized religions.
Some notable words of wisdom, “…if you don’t go within, you go without”.
The great lengths for which people are willing to go when sold such a bill of goods is really quite amazing when you really think about it. As I said earlier, this well thought out ploy of chicanery is a masterful and remarkably successful long lasting campaign to subvert the masses. After so many years of so much needles, senseless violence, prejudice, stupidity, ignorance and fear the sheep are still somehow unable to see through the overt veil of deception. When the victims of this game are divided amongst themselves, they’re not united against their oppressive controllers. It’s the self-defeatist “us vs. them” mentality that seeks to magnify our differences and separate us in to quarrelling factions rather then simply allowing us all just to be human realizing that we have more in common than not. For this reason we haven’t been able to co-exist peacefully or organize worldwide to bring about very many major positive paradigm changes. Sure there have been some great steps taken in the right direction but take a broad look at the overall condition of the world and ask yourself just how well we’re really doing? This is the ideal trap that has been set up by the prison warders or the NWO. Each time we think in terms of Christian, Muslim, Jew we play right in to the game that has been rigged in advance against the participants. It’s also no coincidence that our political system in the US is divided in to a “left” and a “right” and then even a third party added for good measure. It’s unfortunate that we must first be republicans or democrats being fooled by ridiculous wedge issues instead of just being Americans seeking the common good. I’m not saying that we shouldn’t acknowledge our differences and individual specialties either. Variety and diversity is what makes the world such a beautiful and unique place. However, me must learn to celebrate our differences rather than use them as weapons to alienate and attack one another. Our controllers have taught us to do this well and they smile each time we do it.
To sum it all up, any religion that in the end results in any degree of dependence, fear, repression, guilt, ignorance, prejudice, discrimination and ultimately violence in society is one of artful deception by design. Don’t be a victim, don’t believe the hype. All human beings are born with an innate understanding of right and wrong via your intuitions and instincts. What you decide to do with that information is up to you. There are people that have never even heard the name of Jesus or the Bible lacking any religion to boot that are as peaceful, kind-hearted, warm and loving as anyone you could ever imagine. They are also those that go to church every Sunday and point their self-righteous fingers in condemnation and judgment of others that live their lives in a way that couldn’t possibly be further from what Jesus would’ve intended were he alive on earth today in the flesh. There is no direct correlation between being religious and being exalted or a better person with a moral high ground to stand upon. I’d even argue that history and all the way up until the present time has proven the exact opposite to be true if anything. |
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Riaz Ahmed
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| Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 2:39 pm Post subject: |
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Good article Me
I always love to look on both sides of this subject.
May I ask you one question. You said you are an athiest. Am I right?
On what basis did you come to this? Does religion put you off? Does not the existence and the miracle of life itself make you want to belive in a divine entity?
Not even an agnostic ? 
Or do you belive in Evloution of Species and that we are a mere chance?
Sorry - I am curious. Part of my survey.
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Me
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| Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 3:52 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Good article Me
I always love to look on both sides of this subject.
May I ask you one question. You said you are an athiest. Am I right?
On what basis did you come to this? Does religion put you off? Does not the existence and the miracle of life itself make you want to belive in a divine entity?
Not even an agnostic ? Laughing
Or do you belive in Evloution of Species and that we are a mere chance?
Sorry - I am curious. Part of my survey. |
Actually I wrote that I’m an agnostic secularist. My claim is that there’s no proof whatsoever that God wrote any holy book either directly or through the hands of man. This is precisely why the concept of faith was constructed. Faith is nothing more than hopeful, unfounded opinions and wishful thinking. If there were any solid proof, you wouldn’t need faith in order to support your views. It’s a self-defeating belief system. I believe it's dangerous and opens the doors to manipulation. Once you’ve convinced someone of faith, you can then persuade them in to believing just about anything because proof no longer becomes a factor.
| Quote: | | I'm agnostic in my theological beliefs and opposed to organized religion of any kind. |
I believe in being individually spiritual over religious. It’s like rather than labeling people as Jewish or Muslim which divides people in to groups. I’d rather say that we’re all simply part of the same race…the human race. That special day that we can finally be all inclusive spiritually-minded humans rather than being an amalgam of differing exclusive sects and opposing factions will be a great one. Religion is divisive, not unifying as I see it.
I’m not sure if there’s a God or not. If there is, I see ‘it’ as being a
all encompassing yet neutral presence and not an individual being resembling man. It is man I feel who needed to create a God-like figure in his own image so that he could better relate to “him“. That’s where the mistakes originated, man began applying human-like qualities to what is supposed to be a divine/perfect/omnipotent/omniscient being. We now have many devout followers who believe in a jealous, vindictive & vengeful God for which to fear. One that would banish you to hell for making the wrong choices in life. This is not an expression of "free will" as it has been described. I believe it’s bizarre for so many to believe that their perfect God would not be above such negative ego-driven behavioral patterns.
So when you ask if I believe in God I say that I don’t believe in mainstream religions’ versions of God. At least most of them.
I don’t necessarily subscribe to evolution either as there are definitely flaws to be found. I would certainly say the same for Intelligent Design. I feel like we’ve been generally limited to just these two options and perhaps there are others more feasible? The politicians have exploited this division as a wedge issue and used it as a tool to accumulate votes.
I’ve also been interested in the philosophies of the Tibetan Buddhists. I believe they’re the closest to the truth of any of the religions but not all the way there.
The founding fathers of the US were Deists (many of them at least). They had an intriguing understanding of God, one that I've often considered.
| Quote: | The belief, based solely on reason, in a God who created the universe and then abandoned it, assuming no control over life, exerting no influence on natural phenomena, and giving no supernatural revelation.
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In other words, the supreme being simply planted the seeds of life and then walked away, allowing us to bloom without interference of any sort. How else could one explain all the imperfections in the world and believe in perfect God simultaneously? When people thank God when they win a ball game I shudder. Would God really care about the trivial results of your baseball game? Is it then the devil’s fault when you lose? My point is, if there is a God, I don’t see “him” or ’it’ being as integral in our daily activities as many seem to perceive. If God is indeed micro-managing this world then take a look around, “he” can’t be doing a very good job of it.
This is a pretty good documentary that I own and tend to agree with.
http://www.thegodmovie.com/
| Quote: | | "Irreverently lays out the case that Jesus Christ never existed" |
Figures like Jesus and other divine beings from other religions tend to share many of the same exact miracle-like qualities as those from the Greek mythologies which we almost all agree to be just a composition of fables and allegory. I believe that all religions are based in myth. Is there really that much of a difference between believing in a character like Zeus and believing in Jesus? When you get right down to it, it’s almost as if they’re the same invented person only with different names for different holy books. One that exists only in the world of fiction.
Last edited by Me on Sun Aug 27, 2006 4:05 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Riaz Ahmed
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| Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 4:02 pm Post subject: |
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Thats a interesting insight to the way you perceive life 'Me' - Thanks.
And I understand where you are coming from the outside. This is what I love about these type of fourum's.
We can discuss like adults and without being intellectually arrogant. Well - at least some of us
Could you please have a look at this movie aswell. Its about matter - dont worry there is no religious slant to it. It changed the way I look at things now.
PS - YOU can downloadd it.
Its called Secret Beyond Matter.
http://www.harunyahya.com/m_video_detail.php?api_id=1271
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Me
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| Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 4:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Could you please have a look at this movie aswell. Its about matter - dont worry there is no religious slant to it. It changed the way I look at things now.
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Is it a large download? I only have a 56k modem....slow!
I'm usually only able to download short video clips and mp3's online. |
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Me
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| Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 4:16 pm Post subject: |
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| I’d like to know your views on extraterrestrial life and the mysterious creation of elaborate crop formations (crop circles) around the world. Have you looked in to the theories of directed/undirected panspermia? |
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blackcat
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| Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 7:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | I've found that many of those who condemn Muslims & Islam fail to recognize the voluminous amounts of insanity that can be found in the Bible. It's really a double-standard. |
What about those that see them both as insanity? I hear muslims constantly saying that states like Pakistan do not reflect the true values of Islam but there are quite a few of them, and they are organising their societies according to the laws of Shariah. This is apparently because the Koran says for instance to stone people to death because they commit adultery etc etc. A similar fate awaits those who commit the "crime" of homosexuality. Women must be covered head to toe in black and not allowed to work. This hardly sounds like a caring humane religion to me. I have lived in a muslim society for years and it was the most inhumane and intolerant place I have ever been by a long mile. Of course you might say that Saudi Arabia does not reflect "real" Islam but that excuse gets trotted out a lot. I have seen recent videos from Iran of stonings to death and it seems to me there was a lot of enthusiastic audience participation.
All religion is barbaric in my opinion. Yet they all like to stress how caring and sharing they are. Somehow all the people that matter seem to get it wrong in its application that's all. It is the reality that matters not the theory. |
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gypsum
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| Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 8:07 pm Post subject: |
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blackcat,
| Quote: |
All religion is barbaric in my opinion. Yet they all like to stress how caring and sharing they are. Somehow all the people that matter seem to get it wrong in its application that's all. It is the reality that matters not the theory. |
I would have to disagree with you there. It is people's perceptions of religion that is wrong. You mentioned women having to cover themselves from head to foot. In Islam it says women should dress modestly. Different sects of Islam interperate the Quran differently, that is why some Muslim women cover themselves completely and some only wear a head scarf.
All religions are peaceful, but unfortunately people often use religion as an excuse to fight. For example -
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines05/1007-03.htm |
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Riaz Ahmed
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| Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 8:10 pm Post subject: |
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blackcat:
| Quote: | | This is apparently because the Koran says for instance to stone people to death because they commit adultery etc etc. A similar fate awaits those who commit the "crime" of homosexuality. Women must be covered head to toe in black and not allowed to work. |
Its a shame that you willy nilly have quoted and accused the noble Quran of the above statements. But it does not suprise me - because these are all cliche that normally uttered by someone who has no knowledge of the scriptures.
You talk about Covering from head to toe - all false statements. This has nothing to do with what the Quran says. The quran asks the woman to dress modestly. i.e, doesnt wear short skirts etc. There is nothing wrong with that commandemnt. But what is wronge is when I woman is covered from head to toe.
I suggest you do your own research , instead of watching films that show women been stoned to death. Because all that is Barbaric and its nothing to do with Islam.
Islam is the fastest growing religion and do you honestly think that I would belive in Islam - if God had instructed us to stone women or act like Barbarians??
After 9.11 attacks the sales of the Quran went up in sales and there were lot of converts.
Please sir, I suggest you understand the religion and its history, before you judge. And dont look at the muslims - like I said....they are deluded with man-made laws and rituals!!!
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Riaz Ahmed
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| Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 9:26 pm Post subject: |
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Me?
Unfortunately , its a large file which is a shame. Nevermind. But if you get the facility have a look at it.
I am a big fan of the Nexus Magazine. Some good articles are published in there.
I am not familiar with directed/undirected panspermia, but I shall have a read.
Ever since early age, I believed that there is life out there. It could be in any form what so ever , we don’t know. We just perceive living organism that have structure like ourselves or animals for that matter.
Carl Sagan has talked about the vastness of the Universe –
http://obs.nineplanets.org/psc/pbd.html
I can’t understand why some people don’t believe life out there. Just because we have not found anything/or have we? All you have to do is look at the numbers and the possibilities of conditions that can harbor life.
So lets not be arrogant and think we are the centre of it all. But I love to be around when SETI make contact or when the Government do disclose classified information regarding alleged contacts!
and crop circles...I am just mind boggled with the intricate designs and the conditions they turn up in. From what I have read these things appear within minutes and humanly impossible to create under such conditions.
I am open to suggestion with this one.
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blackcat
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| Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 10:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Riaz Ahmed wrote: | blackcat:
| Quote: | | This is apparently because the Koran says for instance to stone people to death because they commit adultery etc etc. A similar fate awaits those who commit the "crime" of homosexuality. Women must be covered head to toe in black and not allowed to work. |
Its a shame that you willy nilly have quoted and accused the noble Quran of the above statements. But it does not suprise me - because these are all cliche that normally uttered by someone who has no knowledge of the scriptures.
You talk about Covering from head to toe - all false statements. This has nothing to do with what the Quran says. The quran asks the woman to dress modestly. i.e, doesnt wear short skirts etc. There is nothing wrong with that commandemnt. But what is wronge is when I woman is covered from head to toe.
I suggest you do your own research , instead of watching films that show women been stoned to death. Because all that is Barbaric and its nothing to do with Islam.
Islam is the fastest growing religion and do you honestly think that I would belive in Islam - if God had instructed us to stone women or act like Barbarians??
After 9.11 attacks the sales of the Quran went up in sales and there were lot of converts.
Please sir, I suggest you understand the religion and its history, before you judge. And dont look at the muslims - like I said....they are deluded with man-made laws and rituals!!! |
I haven't quoted the Koran as I have never read it and am no more likely to as I am to read the bible. As long as people who claim to be Muslims following the teaching of Islam indulge in barbarism then I will have no time for it. The same goes for Christians or anyone else. The Christians were barbaric in the name of Jesus and murdered thousands completely contrary to the teachings of Christianity. The fact they got it so wrong does not enthuse me for the Christian faith and the reality of Islam leaves me exactly the same way. Organised religions are a system of control and are used by the powerful to enslave the masses - "the opium of the people" as was once famously said. We are in danger in Britain of having hard fought liberties eroded by the creeping intolerance of Islam (do not tell me that Islam has ANY tolerance for homosexuality or women's independence!!). When, after several generations, the infection of Islam has been erased from the current Muslims living here then we will be safe. Until then we must look at the riots and deaths caused by "cartoons" of the prophet or the death threat against Salman Rushdie as REAL evidence of what we have to expect and fear from the REALITY of Islam however perverted you may say it is. |
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Snowygrouch
Validated Poster
Joined: 02 Apr 2006
Posts: 628
Location: Oxford
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| Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 11:46 pm Post subject: Religion |
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All,
All mainstream religions started with the same basic values (more or less).
All our troubles are related to the fact clever people see religion as an easy way to exert influence on others.
Hence the rules start to get bent.
Any man or woman who claims to belong to any religion and advocates violence or intolerance is NOT RELIGIOUS.
Religion isnt a problem per-se, people at the top are the problem. (sound familiar )
Calum
_________________
The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists, and will persist
President Eisenhower 1961 |
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