David Shayler is a "no planer"

[Mark Gobell]

David Shayler announced last night on his radio show that he is a no planer.

[scubadiver]

I totally forgot about his show last night. What reasons did he give?

[kbo234]

It was rather amusing, as Annie and AndyB were clearly attempting to 'shut him up' as he spoke.

This is a very interesting issue in some ways (many of us, I would guess, don't really care one way or the other....as how the crime was committed is much less interesting than the fact of it being a crime). It seems that on this matter 'truth' potentially comes into conflict with our own mission as propagandists and PR merchants.

[Ally]

[Narinder]

You can download the whole show in mp3 by going to: http://www.nineeleven.co.uk/board/viewtopic.php?t=3567&highlight=

[Mark Gobell]

Excellent point kbo.

And I just love the Ground Zero Nero monicker. Superb.

BTW I was only acting on behalf of my rather surprised conscience in bringing that little bit of news.

I am currently quiet schizophrenic on this issue when I give it any time.

I also had no idea whether David Shayler's views on this wer common knowledge.

Please do not assume that my post was intended to be pejorative in any way.

[Kier]

Well, I am afraid I don't find the 'Ground Zero Nero' monicker superb at all, considering that it is directed at somebody who is doing a lot of constructive work for the 9/11 campaign, along with all you others.

I have just listened to the radio programme and Andyb makes no attempt to get David to 'shut up'; he just gives his opinion that there are easier issues to concentrate on, and get people to take on board, when explaining to those with no knowledge of 9/11 why there are questions to be asked about it. I believe Annie made the point also. I can't see that it's fair to say he's crowned himself 'king of the truth movement' on that basis.

I think there's a fine line to be walked. I get frustrated at certain researchers who only seem to want to question some things and not others, but I also realise that even if only one area is flagged up, it might lead others to look a bit deeper and find their own questions to ask.

Even if there's disagreement about which aspects are best to use to raise awareness of 9/11, it doesn't mean that certain people see themselves as superior to others who use different approaches to campaigning.

EDIT

Just listened again and both David and Annie agreed with Andy's point. David said although he went for the 'no planes' theory, as it can advance understanding of 9/11, it's not the best way to convince 'initiates' when there's such "an embarrassment of riches to mine" for 9/11. Annie said she agreed with Andy that with the plethora of glaring inconsistencies in the official account, it was best not to focus on a slightly tangential issue. They didn't try to shut David up; he asked them for their opinions and the issue was discussed.

[Busker]

[scubadiver]

[Mark Gobell]

Kier

I'm sorry if I have offended your sensibilities by enjoying Ally's terminology.

I did not mean to imply that I enjoyed it's use for this or any particular target.

If you considered what I had posted about my no plane schizophrenia earlier, this may have provided context.

On the point of Ground Zero Neros which I do find very funny. I would argue that all of us, if we are honest have at some time fell into this role.

The underlying need to be the keeper of the keys on this or any other issue is what motivates folk.

That is a psychological issue and one that fascinates me.

[Busker]

[Andrew Johnson]

[Busker]

[scubadiver]

I was informed by Annie that David is a Middlesborough fan and he was slightly annoyed about the Reading result.

[xmasdale]

David Shayler is as free to express his opinions as any one else in this movement is. We need to remember that we operate a policy of "no endorsement". That means that anyone may speak in support of the campaign, but the campaign as a whole does not necessarily endorse their views.

Given that the "no planes theory" has made significant advances within the movement in the US, it was inevitable that it would rear its head here. The important thing to remember is that though we will all differ from each other in areas of speculation about what we think really happened on that fateful day five years ago, we are united in believing that we have not been told the truth and that a thorough independent investigation is needed.

Unfortunately, it is inevitable that, due to his high profile, people will mistakenly assume that David is outlining policy on behalf of the movement. Those who wish to discredit us will seize any chance they can to use David's or anyone else's words. However, that is something I believe we have to live with. I would not dream of asking David to shut up about his opinions. That, after all, is what the government are trying to do to him through court action.

Noel

[xmasdale]

Nico Haupt in New York has sent us this:

see also
http://www.911blogger.com/blog/148
http://www.bloglines.com/blog/ewing2001


http://www.911tvfakery.net

http://911tvfakery.blogspot.com/
Friday, September 01, 2006
NY Villager mentions Haupt and TV Fakery
September 1, 2006
also debated at
http://www.911blogger.com/node/2421
(ed: Note that the Villager confused "9/11 Science and Justice Alliance" with st911.org. I did not found st911.org, neither i am one of their members.
It is correct that i co-established in 2002 a science group, together with Jeff "plaguepuppy" King.
Correction/Update: Apparently TheVillager confused 911SCAJA with team8plus.org, which has over 600 members.
Some other details had been misquoted. I didn't use the words "conspiracy theory" or "missiles".
TheVillager didn't show up again the following week, when i presented an own event on "9/11 TV Fakery".
Guest Speaker was actually Rick Rajter, one of many st911.org members who signed our petition and just distributed this week Pt.1 of a paper to st911)
http://www.thevillager.com/villager_174/5yearslater.html
Volume 76, Number 15 | August 30 -September 5, 2006
5 years later, 9/11 skeptics feel they’re close to truth
By David Spett
"...One 9/11 Truth member, Nico Haupt, believes the conspiracy behind 9/11 extends beyond the government. At the Aug. 6 St. Mark’s meeting, Haupt criticized the mainstream 9/11 Truth movement, saying it has “oppressed” his questions and research.
“I created a science group in 2002, which were working for four years, hard, 24/7, opposed by leaders close to the 9/11 Truth movement,” Haupt told the audience, adding that his science group consists of nine researchers and 600 members.
The group’s findings were surprising.
“I believe that Cleveland is the final smoking gun for the passengers [of United 93]. I believe the conspiracy theory that the F.B.I. and the NASA together killed these passengers, either there or they got already killed on board,” Haupt said, waving several crumpled sheets of paper as evidence. “I don’t need to prove anymore what happens to passengers. I don’t need to prove anymore what happens to planes. All I can bring is fact.”
Missiles, not planes, hit the Twin Towers, Haupt added, and all the footage on television and in newspapers has been edited.
After Haupt’s speech, one man, who declined to give his name, said Haupt represented “the fringe of our movement.” It’s “irresponsible” to say missiles hit the W.T.C., the man said, but “parts of that argument have merit.”
“Still, we should lead with our strongest arguments,” the man added.
Morales, echoing that statement, said he didn’t believe Haupt yet but would listen to a full presentation of Haupt’s research and keep an open mind.
In a telephone interview, Morales defended Haupt’s opinion: “What he thinks is his opinion, but he also makes it clear that he separates opinion from conclusion. He’s not prepared to make a scientific conclusion or at least a quasiscientific conclusion. His strong point, which I tend more to agree with, is that the footage, the various mainstream media footage, seems to have been doctored...”

[prole art threat]

I was sure it was on this site that someone posted a link of one of the 'planes' hitting the towers and then coming out the other end. Can somebody please post it again?

[Annie]

[SHERITON HOTEL]

What about 'REOPEN 9/11' football shirt sponsorship(Shayler the boro' fan tenuous link)?they've had political slogans on shirts before, I recall West Brom' being sponsored by the anti-smoking campaign...and were relegated that season.

[paul wright]

Just to add that I thought David was perfectly right in every particular of what he said including his denial of the blue screen fakery thesis, and had exactly the right attitude as to how this all fits into the committed Truth movement's analysis, agree with him or not
Certainly in no way divisive