Posted: Sun Sep 24, 2006 7:07 pm Post subject: Chavez : The NWO Asset
Right then, where to start?
Well There was me, browsing the GNN forum when i came across this little nugget of gold. Some people have obviously been doing their homework on chavez recently as hes become so much more of an influentual player on the international scene, and boy, have they dug up the dirt.
In a nutshell, we have been duped. Chavez is the one to watch.
Read the whole article and all of the posts on the forum. need to know info this......
Disinformation. Look round on the internet and you can find plenty of anti-Chavez propaganda as he has upset a hell of a lot of rich Venezuelans. I noticed Sumante are mentioned a couple of times in the 'expose' eg
'The opposition’s suspicions are based on three things. First, an exit poll supervised by Penn, Schoen, and Berland Associates (PSB), an American polling firm, and conducted by volunteers from Súmate, an opposition civic group, showed the opposition winning by 18 points.'
Have a look on Wikipedia for Sumante. -
The group is funded in large part by private Venezuelan interests, but also reportedly received up to 6% of their funds via a grant from the U.S.- backed National Endowment for Democracy.[11][12] According to CBS News, Chávez branded the leaders of Súmate, a vote-monitoring group, as "conspirators, coup plotters and lackeys of the U.S. government".[
Juan Forero of The New York Times referred to Súmate as an anti-Hugo Chavez election-monitoring organization, and an antigovernment group. The BBC has referred to Sumate at least three times as an "opposition group". Venezuela’s El Universal consistently refers to Súmate as an NGO, but has called it an opposition NGO in the past
I love the Sumate pyramid logo though!
This report by Greg Palast is also quite revealing, especially on links between the Bushies and Venezuelan opposition groups.
Joined: 04 Apr 2006 Posts: 489 Location: Manchester
Posted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 5:02 pm Post subject:
i really don't think chavez is part of any nwo conspiracy.
he is clearly opposed to the current american agenda of global domination. _________________ "During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act"
Joined: 10 Aug 2005 Posts: 395 Location: La piscina de vivo
Posted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 7:28 pm Post subject:
I agree with TimG. I don't think that Chavez is a tool of the NWO either;
that is just horseshit meant to dis him after his remarkable speech at the UN.
See this video for a history of the Venezuelan struggle & where Chavez fits in to it all. He was a military man who staged a coup against the right wing government led by President Perez who was President of Venezuela for the second time. (The first time around was during the oil boom of the 1970s in which Venezuelan people expected great prosperity but the country ended up deeply in debt. Upon Perez's being elected for the second time in 1989 he also promised the people that he would bring prosperity to Venezuela.
But, instead he instituted an austerity program which in February of 1989, led to the most violent and the most massive popular protests against IMF policies in Latin America with results that the state ended up repressing the popular sectors and leading to several hundred people being killed.
Chavez's coup against Perez has to be seen in that kind of context, in the context of a country in which the people have expected improvement in the living conditions for many years, tremendous frustration and then he attempted a coup against a government who had lost significant legitimacy.
Chavez was very popular as a result of the coup, but the coup failed & he was imprisoned, but the people still supported him. The next Prime Minister set him free & he then began his carrer as a politician for the Venezuelan people, trying to build Venezuela for its own people & not for the benefit of extranjeros americanos. He still rules with massive support, despite a number of US backed/funded coups against him
Venezuela Bolivariana: People and the Struggle of the 4th World War.
Posted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 8:43 pm Post subject: My understanding of the situation...
In semi-colonial countries ie those that aren't independent from the transnationals the army some time steps in if the ruling elite their collectively cannot govern in its own name.
Chavez is from the army. Faced with total meltdown the Venezuelan elite (its most enlightened sections) has been forced to defend itself against the USA.
Behind the scenes they are pushing him to fight in the UN. Chavez was totally anti-american and Ahmedinajad was playing the John Lennon card, in love with all, even his enemies.
If they are preparing the situation for a post-Bush Blair world then the UN may be re-invigorated as a NWO asset.
Anything is possible. Even them uncovering 9/11 and then controlling it as they have already done with the anti-war movement over here.
I know his political pedigree seems to show he is a fierce opponent of US imperialism etc and he seems to be a "man of the people".
However, why didn't he hold up David Ray Griffin's book at the UN rather than Noam Chomsky's?
How did he come to actually make that speech at the UN, rather than in some backwater somewhere?
Maybe I am too cynical and his opportunity to make the speech at the UN came about simply because he is a UN country leader.
But for him to say all that in front of UN delegates makes me wonder what has gone on behind the scenes.
The media already tries to portary Chavez as a madman in order to discredit him. No matter how much progress the 911 Truth movement is making if Chavez went in front of the UN at this stage saying 911 was an inside job he would leave himself a sitting target for ridicule. As things stand though he gave a great speech and highlighted lots of important issues. Will be interesting to see if Venezuela goes ahead with it's own investigation of 911, what the conclusion and impact of that will be and then how Chavez reacts to it. _________________ Only sheep need a leader.
Joined: 09 Jun 2006 Posts: 645 Location: UK Midlands
Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 10:52 am Post subject:
Andrew Johnson wrote:
I know his political pedigree seems to show he is a fierce opponent of US imperialism etc and he seems to be a "man of the people".
However, why didn't he hold up David Ray Griffin's book at the UN rather than Noam Chomsky's?
<snip>
Apparently his closest advisor [this according to greg palast] has a huge bookshelf filled with 9/11 related info and Chavez is *obviously* well versed in the core theories.
I think if you look at South American countries history and opression based on USA/Western/banking greed and dominance then they perhaps have a bit of a *historical* penchant for Chomsky as he gave them a critique of the role of the US around the world.
Ingrained habits are hard to drop! But we would hope soon this will change as the exposure of Gnome continues faster than ever.
As for all the current discussion of Chavez as an agent/tool... the guy has hit the Neo-Con-Madmen where it hurts - used oil funds for many social reason and bailing out other countries that were previously ASSET STRIPPED by the global banking scamsters.
You only needed to see Condi [Borg] Rice's fury at a some [Whitehouse?] press conference over the Chavez situation to realise he is not a CIA asset. Condi may be a liar - but she is not *that* good. Look into her eyes and you see no life, just looping programs. _________________ http://exopolitics.org.uk http://chemtrailsUK.net http://alienfalseflagagenda.net
--
Without even looking at the GNN link, I would say don't dismiss this as a possibility
Sure most of us know Chavez' revolutionary pedigree and about his US puppet enemies and their attempted coup against him.
But if history teaches us anything it is "don't trust leaders, watch your parking meters" especially leaders with a military backgrounds and interesting friends. The PTSWBNM standard modus operandi is to control and influence all sides.
Amongst the PTSWBNM there will be some looking at the leadership figures within the global truth and justice people power movement that has no name and be wondering if there are any that they can turn or play (assuming they are not already in the oppressor-man's pockets).
Let's not forget that the US gains a significant proportion of its total oil imports from Venezuela (almost the same as from Saudi Arabia). They don't like the fact he can use this as a political tool.
Without even looking at the GNN link, I would say don't dismiss this as a possibility
Sure most of us know Chavez' revolutionary pedigree and about his US puppet enemies and their attempted coup against him.
But if history teaches us anything it is "don't trust leaders, watch your parking meters" especially leaders with a military backgrounds and interesting friends. The PTSWBNM standard modus operandi is to control and influence all sides.
Amongst the PTSWBNM there will be some looking at the leadership figures within the global truth and justice people power movement that has no name and be wondering if there are any that they can turn or play (assuming they are not already in the oppressor-man's pockets).
Worth watching[/quote]
ABSOLUTELY.
As much as I want to believe that Chavez is the saviour of the people I cannot help but think that there may be more to it.
The Americans are looking for enemies, this much is evident. Is it not possible that it is much easier to handle your enemies if you create your own?
Given the nature of this forum, this is a possibility that cannot be rejected without reason?
If you are to read the GNN article it is very revealing and highlights some facts which were unbeknown to me beforehand, and they can all be verified. GNN is famous for its investigative journalism and this article is no definately no exception.
I mean, seriously, if you had ambitions like America and the Globalists, i.e. World Government. Would you NOT put in place/create a government to create an opposition to this? People cannot say that this is not an option they would have at least considered.
The most important thing that this would create is hope, a hope that we can leave it to chavez and his allies to get us out of this mess; It keeps the 'left' happy for the meantime, and when he is no longer needed, he will just be disposed of, just as slobodan milosevic and saddam have been dispatched after they have fulfilled their needs of the international financial agenda.
If you have not read the article, please do.
another thing you should read is the 48 Laws of Power.
i do not put anything past these people, theyre 10 times smarter than us, and at least 100 moves ahead.
"In politics, nothing happens by accident. If it happened, you can bet it was planned that way."
Franklin D. Roosevelt (1882-1945), 32nd US President _________________ the real world never fails to amuse
i really don't think chavez is part of any nwo conspiracy.
he is clearly opposed to the current american agenda of global domination.
the argument about chavez being nwo is an extension of the argument that noam chomsky is a shill. theres no concrete evidence for either just an assumption that they fit a pattern of convenient and controlled opposition.
Most things are a possibility. It's just the likelihood of this one being a possibility is about the same as Cynthia McKinney being G W Bush's long lost twin sister. _________________ Only sheep need a leader.
Joined: 09 Jun 2006 Posts: 645 Location: UK Midlands
Posted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 4:28 pm Post subject:
IronSnot wrote:
ian neal wrote:
Chavez being a NWO tool.
Without even looking at the GNN link, I would say don't dismiss this as a possibility
It's not a possibility. I'd be ruder, but you'd possibly ban me.
Heheh.
Look - we all know black is white and white is black in this field. But please... can we have some kind of vague balance.
Not EVERYONE is a tool of the satanic NuWO. The two Chavez's currently under discussion here and elsewhere are just people that dare to poke their head up.
'Truthseekers' want to revel in their world of paranoia where the bigger picture goes AWOL beacuse we're to busy defending our 'scene' from 'infiltrators' and 'agents'.
I really like what I know of Chavez, but I was disturbed to find out from a Venezualan friend that things aren't what they seem in that country. He said that there was a fair proportion of discontent in the country, just that it was being hushed up.
Being polite I didn't press him any further (religeon and politics in the pub - never in a group more than two!) and it could be that he's from the "other side of the tracks" - the wealthy side of the country. I haven't followed it up with any research either, not much good I know but thought it worth chipping in.
We know that the US lot are horrible, so we can't really believe anything they say. It may just be a hard fact-of-life that Chavez has his sharp corners too.
Joined: 07 Jul 2006 Posts: 595 Location: Australia
Posted: Sat Sep 30, 2006 4:50 am Post subject:
Yes, well that's still quite different than being a "tool of the nwo".
To be honest I even have problems with these acronyms. NWO and PTB don't do it for me I'm afraid. It sounds like something that CBSs would come up with.
I quite agree, being a "tool of the NWO" means we already know what the "NWO" is. It seems to play into the mind of those who occupy a distinct area of the political culture, and not Chavez's main demographic in the West, who probably can't stand talk of "NWO" and suchlike.
The chances are it might have been done as a joke, just to really twist the limits of what a conspiratorially-minded person could get their head around!
Without even looking at the GNN link, I would say don't dismiss this as a possibility
It's not a possibility. I'd be ruder, but you'd possibly ban me.
I wouldn't ban you. If it was even considered, it would be for rudeness not disagreeing with me.
Of course I'm speculating and merely saying it is a possibility. But it is certainly not a trait of paranoia to suspect that someone in Chavez's position might not be all what he seems. That said I hope my suspicions are unfounded and Chavez is truly a leader of integrity and authenticity.
Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 4:44 am Post subject: Re: My understanding of the situation...
conspirator wrote:
In semi-colonial countries ie those that aren't independent from the transnationals the army some time steps in if the ruling elite their collectively cannot govern in its own name.
Chavez is from the army. Faced with total meltdown the Venezuelan elite (its most enlightened sections) has been forced to defend itself against the USA.
Behind the scenes they are pushing him to fight in the UN. Chavez was totally anti-american and Ahmedinajad was playing the John Lennon card, in love with all, even his enemies.
If they are preparing the situation for a post-Bush Blair world then the UN may be re-invigorated as a NWO asset.
Anything is possible. Even them uncovering 9/11 and then controlling it as they have already done with the anti-war movement over here.
i disagree with your anti-american claim. yes he dosnt like what america are doing at the moment, but that dosnt mean he is anti-american. if this were being done differantly he'd proberbly not have an issue with america, the only thing i think he is is anti-bush. its like calling people anti-german because we disagreed with what the nazis was doing in 2nd world war.
Joined: 12 Sep 2006 Posts: 3889 Location: North Down, N. Ireland
Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 9:44 am Post subject: Re: My understanding of the situation...
marky 54 wrote:
conspirator wrote:
In semi-colonial countries ie those that aren't independent from the transnationals the army some time steps in if the ruling elite their collectively cannot govern in its own name.
Chavez is from the army. Faced with total meltdown the Venezuelan elite (its most enlightened sections) has been forced to defend itself against the USA.
Behind the scenes they are pushing him to fight in the UN. Chavez was totally anti-american and Ahmedinajad was playing the John Lennon card, in love with all, even his enemies.
If they are preparing the situation for a post-Bush Blair world then the UN may be re-invigorated as a NWO asset.
Anything is possible. Even them uncovering 9/11 and then controlling it as they have already done with the anti-war movement over here.
i disagree with your anti-american claim. yes he dosnt like what america are doing at the moment, but that dosnt mean he is anti-american. if this were being done differantly he'd proberbly not have an issue with america, the only thing i think he is is anti-bush. its like calling people anti-german because we disagreed with what the nazis was doing in 2nd world war.
That is true - he has a scheme to supply cheap oil to poor Americans, although accepting it is termed 'treason' by right wing fruit loops there.
"Neil Cavuto was livid and about to burst a blood vessel today (September 21, 2006) over Hugo Chavez's plan to sell heating oil at discount prices to low income residents of New York City. (Chavez also plans to donate 100 gallons of heating oil to 12,000 rural Alaskans, which, curiously, Cavuto didn't mention.) Avoiding obvious questions like why U.S. oil companies don't donate oil to our poor, or why it is that people in this country can't afford to heat their homes, Cavuto, wearing an American flag on his lapel, instead targeted his fellow citizens and insinuated that they are committing treason for accepting Chavez's offer."
Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 9:06 pm Post subject: Re: My understanding of the situation...
marky 54 wrote:
i disagree with your anti-american claim. yes he dosnt like what america are doing at the moment, but that dosnt mean he is anti-american. if this were being done differantly he'd proberbly not have an issue with america, the only thing i think he is is anti-bush. its like calling people anti-german because we disagreed with what the nazis was doing in 2nd world war.
Maybe I didn't explain it properly.
Chavez accused the US for planning a world dictatorship.
This is a severe anti-american statement for americans. Not me. Ie he is verbally against the US government, not its people.
The question at hand is if he means what he says or he is playing a NWO game when the neo-cons time is up.
Just to be pedantic: America stretches from Alaska to Tierra del Fuego and many Canadians and central and southern Americans object to the term America just being used to refer to the US of A.
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