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chek
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Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 3889
Location: North Down, N. Ireland
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 Posted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 7:51 pm Post subject: |
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| aggle-rithm wrote: | | chek wrote: |
Yes it is all very interesting.
Maybe it had cooled down to that temperture from something even more shocking than planes in buildings?
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Maybe you're right!
Now can you explain how the VAPORIZED steel stayed in the rubble instead of rising up through the rubble and floating off with the wind? |
Good point, but once the vapourisation stage cooled, then it's molten from 5000F to 2500F.
I wonder who could perform reliable calculations for that hypothesis, taking a realistic guess at heat loss through the dust insulation? |
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aggle-rithm
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Joined: 22 Aug 2006
Posts: 557
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| Posted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 10:11 pm Post subject: |
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| chek wrote: | | aggle-rithm wrote: | | chek wrote: |
Yes it is all very interesting.
Maybe it had cooled down to that temperture from something even more shocking than planes in buildings?
|
Maybe you're right!
Now can you explain how the VAPORIZED steel stayed in the rubble instead of rising up through the rubble and floating off with the wind? |
Good point, but once the vapourisation stage cooled, then it's molten from 5000F to 2500F.
I wonder who could perform reliable calculations for that hypothesis, taking a realistic guess at heat loss through the dust insulation? |
I haven't figured out the exact calculation (You would use Newton's law of cooling), but it would take some awesome insulation to keep the cooling rate low enough to last a few weeks. As far as I can tell from a rough estimate, the cooling rate constant would have to be much lower than that of either steel or concrete. |
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Ignatz
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Joined: 14 Sep 2006
Posts: 918
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| Posted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 6:53 am Post subject: |
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| aggle-rithm wrote: | | chek wrote: | | aggle-rithm wrote: | | chek wrote: |
Yes it is all very interesting.
Maybe it had cooled down to that temperture from something even more shocking than planes in buildings?
|
Maybe you're right!
Now can you explain how the VAPORIZED steel stayed in the rubble instead of rising up through the rubble and floating off with the wind? |
Good point, but once the vapourisation stage cooled, then it's molten from 5000F to 2500F.
I wonder who could perform reliable calculations for that hypothesis, taking a realistic guess at heat loss through the dust insulation? |
I haven't figured out the exact calculation (You would use Newton's law of cooling), but it would take some awesome insulation to keep the cooling rate low enough to last a few weeks. As far as I can tell from a rough estimate, the cooling rate constant would have to be much lower than that of either steel or concrete. |
And - it would need to be a pool of liquid metal at the time it was blanketed by the debris. Liquid steel from a supposed CD would be separated and falling between layers of debris, and cooling while falling.
p.s. did anybody take a sample to test what metal it was ?
_________________
So remember - next time you can't find a parking spot, go to plan B: blow up your car |
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chek
Mega Poster
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 3889
Location: North Down, N. Ireland
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| Posted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 2:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Ignatz wrote: | | aggle-rithm wrote: | | chek wrote: | | aggle-rithm wrote: | | chek wrote: |
Yes it is all very interesting.
Maybe it had cooled down to that temperture from something even more shocking than planes in buildings?
|
Maybe you're right!
Now can you explain how the VAPORIZED steel stayed in the rubble instead of rising up through the rubble and floating off with the wind? |
Good point, but once the vapourisation stage cooled, then it's molten from 5000F to 2500F.
I wonder who could perform reliable calculations for that hypothesis, taking a realistic guess at heat loss through the dust insulation? |
I haven't figured out the exact calculation (You would use Newton's law of cooling), but it would take some awesome insulation to keep the cooling rate low enough to last a few weeks. As far as I can tell from a rough estimate, the cooling rate constant would have to be much lower than that of either steel or concrete. |
And - it would need to be a pool of liquid metal at the time it was blanketed by the debris. Liquid steel from a supposed CD would be separated and falling between layers of debris, and cooling while falling.
p.s. did anybody take a sample to test what metal it was ? |
I have not yet seen any evidence that anyone did, but who knows what the EPA were up to in their hazmat suits (apart from telling those less well equipped to keep their paper fibre masks on).
While looking into the King paper I did discover this:
Aluminum burns at over 4100 K (6920°F), which is two-thirds the temperature at the surface of the Sun.
http://www.aerospaceweb.org/question/propulsion/q0246.shtml
by which time the steel would be in aerosol form.
However to achieve these temps (used in solid rocket motors) the aluminium needs to be in fine particle form (in the 20-100 micron range).
In a thermite burn, the burning aluminium dissipates as vapour, while the denser iron component does the cutting work, so at present I believe the heavier metal to be a more likely candidate.
Also, photos showing the rusty orange-brown colours on 'the meteorite' indicate oxidised iron. |
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