ReferendumNOW: EU petition now DOWNING STREET LIVE

[Reflecter]

After 16 days of being ignored, delayed, blocked and 2 rants later, my EU Referendum petition has finally gone live on the PM's site.

Please consider signing, as we now have just 9 days until Blair signs us over to a federalised EU.


http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/ReferendumNOW

Email this to everyone: http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/ReferendumNOW/

We only need 200 signatories to guarantee Blair's forced public response.

Please spread the word regardless of your particular stance . Many people dont know what's entailed by this and a referendum is the only fair way to get the pro's n CON's of this issue, debated in the public eye.

Regards
Rufus Middleton
The Peoples United Collective


Details:

"We the undersigned petition the Prime Minister to hold a
referendum to consult the nations opinion on your proposed
signing of the 'Declaration on the Future of Europe' which will
sign Britain over to a Federal Europe and strip British people
of their rights FOREVER."

On MARCH 25th in Berlin, Mr Blair will sign a 50 page
‘Declaration on the Future of Europe' without consulting the UK
people. A binding treaty that embodies "basic laws" for 490
million people in 27 countries based on a despised
constitution, rejected by voters across Europe. Nine countries
with over 150 million people turned it down or, decided not to
put it to the vote. Blair alone has decided the UK will not
vote. If you don’t want to be controlled by a European
Federation, we must demand a national referendum NOW. It will
create:

• A PERMANENT, unelected, EU president. A sole voice
for Europe serving a 5 year term.

• FULL-TIME foreign and
defence ministers for Europe meaning powers like China and
America will by-pass Britain to speak directly to them.

• A REFORMED European parliament drawing up its own laws. Britain
couldn’t veto its decisions and each member states government
loses the right to "opt out" of EU laws & treaties.

ACT NOW or be slaves to the EU forever

"THE REAL FACE OF THE EUROPEAN UNION"
http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=2699800300274168460&q=The+Re al+Face+of+the+European+Union

Whilst being a 2006 documentary, this gives some idea of potential drawbacks

[uselesseater]

I've already signed this but am encouraging everyone else to do so too, unless you like the idea of having all the police state measures we are experiencing PUT IN STONE and being ruled by a central unelected Commission.

I’m very disappointed in the way the fascist EU gets ignored by large swathes of the left and a large section of the truth community.

We should all know by now that the Number 1 goal of the New World Order is to destroy national sovereignty. That’s what you have to do to create a one world government.

Whatever you think on this you must agree that we should have a referendum.

Only 7 days to go!

[Mark Gobell]

Blair signs us up to the EU superstate on 25.3.2007 on the 50th anniversary of the Treaty of Rome.

[Leiff]

[uselesseater]

Great Image. Where did you fins that?

The Petitions up to 2500! Keep forwarding guys.

[Leiff]

[Rory Winter]

Look, if you can stop being a Little Englander for five minutes and look at the real world. Britain has already been swallowed up by the USA. The shame of Iraq simply underlines that, the fact that two-thirds of the House of Commons recently voted for a Trident replacement (thus ensuring the UK taxpayer's massive subsidy of the US Arms Industry) shows up our banana republic status.

Behind this Al Murray style Brit anti-Europeanism exists a strong streak of an Anglo-Saxon superiority complex which would rather allow itself to be buggered by the US on a constant basis than have any truck with Continentals, or as ex-Ambassador Christopher Meyer recently put it, "To get up the arse of the Americans and to stay there."

One day, after getting over its imperialistic hangover, Brits will wake up to the fact that they are geographically, ethnically and culturally Europeans. That's the day when they'll stop referring to Europe as something 'over there' and realize that they, too, are and live in Europe.

If you don't like the EU as it is at present (who does?) then help transform it from within and not behave like US fifth-columnists.

[Rory Winter]

Reflecter: I watched 5 minutes of your Google video, The Real Face of Europe, before switching it off. This is pure, emotional propaganda meant to play on Brits' deeply-held xenophobia.

I would really like to know just who the makers of this video are, their connections with the fascist UKIP, and just who is paying them to turn out this kind of low propaganda.

This kind of stuff panders to the obsolete imperialistic thinking among Brits. It accuses 'Europe' of taking away our freedoms but does not dare look at the truth: ie that "our freedoms" are being taken away by the great white father in Washington, DC whom we'd rather screw with (well, they speak English don't they?)

It may come as a shock to you but there are Brits who would like to break up the accursed Union as well: they're called Scots. And many Scots would rather go to bed with Brussels than with Washington. We would rather break away from the real problem (ie Westminster) and stake our future with the Continent.

[Leiff]

Calling anti-EU campaigners xenophobic is the same tactic as the ADL calling everybody 'anti-semetic'.

I used to be quite pro EU until I started looking into the details.

The EU has 110,000+ regulations - do you know them all?
The politicians, civil servants and police etc will all be immune from prosecution - a recipe for abuse of power!
The EU hasn't balanced its books in over a decade - a sure sign of endemic corruption.
80% of the new laws passed in the UK parliament come from the EU including ID cards and road pricing - so if we are to be rid of these things, the only way to do anything about them is to leave the EU.

I think you will find that Cameron is advocating staying in the EU and encouraging reform. If you know anything about the EU you will know that it will never reform...

Here's a question for you: Does Norway or Switzerland want to join the EU?

[Rory Winter]

I would rather join an imperfect European Federation than remain as a slave to Washington DC which is the real threat to freedom. And, as a Scots, I would rather see the 'United Kingdom' dismantled as soon as possible as it only serves to perpetuate a sense of imperialism which is long gone.

Why, in this day and age, are the US and British armies the only imperialist aggressors on the face of the planet?

PS: Are you seriously suggesting that British popular culture is not inherently xenophobic?!?!

[Leiff]

I know what you mean but we will have even less control over foreign policy directed from an autocratic, undemocratic Brussels...

[Rory Winter]

Given a choice between Europe or "getting up the arse of the US", I choose an independent Scotland in a European Confederation.

[Leiff]

I'd give the Scots a referendum and I think we deserve one regarding the EU. Have you seen a map of the 'regions' where the UK is divided up - that is the EU's plans for Britain, I don't think the US is planning on splitting up our country!

[Rory Winter]

The US doesn't need to split up Britain as it controls it totally through Westminster.

First, give us our referendum and let us decide for ourselves about our relationship with the EU. We don't want to be swamped by an English anti-Europeanism.

Hopefully, the first step to our independence will be the overwhelming defeat of Labour in our local and parliamentary elections next May.

If 'Europe' wants to split Britain into regions is that really so bad? If its effect is to finish off the 'United Kingdom' and its imperialist longings then many like me will cheer from the rooftops!

[Leiff]

I think that you will fit in perfectly in the EUSSR!

[Rory Winter]

Better EUSSR than Amerika Ueber Alles!

Anyway, leaving aside all the anti-Soviet propaganda which I assume you accept unquestioningly there were many things about the USSR which are now severely missed by a poverty-stricken, jobless, starving 'privatized' Russia.

If you seriously examine how our relative freedoms have been taken away from us you will see that the real damage has been done by the Atlanticist neocons in Washington and London, not by bureaucrats in Brussels concerning themselves with the flavour of cheese.

BTW, here's a clipping from today's Granma, a Cuban newspaper and great supporter of the old USSR:

500,000 people literate via Cuban method
http://www.granma.cu/ingles/2007/marzo/juev22/13alfabet-i.html

MORE than 580,000 people in 16 countries are learning to read and write using the I Can Do It literacy method developed by Cuban professor Leonela Inés Relys Díaz.

The innovative Cuban cooperative program in this sphere is benefiting citizens of Venezuela, Paraguay, Argentina, Mexico, Ecuador, Bolivia, Brazil, Peru, Honduras, Colombia and Guinea Bissau, Foreign and Education Ministry sources informed the AIN.

Work is ongoing to implement this system of teaching literacy in just 65 days utilizing audiovisual methods in Grenada, Equatorial Guinea, South Africa, French Guyana, Timor Leste and Haiti.

There are Spanish, Portuguese, English, Creole, Quechua and Aymará teaching versions, among other languages.

To date, more than 2.16 million people from 17 nations have become literate, thanks to application of I Can Do It, with which program they acquire knowledge essential for daily life and their participation in the 21st century societies and economies.

According to UNESCO figures, 861 million human beings, or 20% of adults in the world, do not know how to read or write.

Translated by Granma International

[Leiff]

[Chaos Warrior]

Well...I signed your petition reflector.
I have nothing but nothing against the ordinary European people..I have many friends from EU countries At one time I was all for joining the EU.
Then I looked into exactly what that entailed.
I have no wish to exchange an American master for an EU one.
The public in Holland and France..founder members of the EU...have also rejected this idea....it's nothing to do with being anti-European.
I would much rather have NO interference in our political scene.
IMO it would be better to remove the American influence than to add the EU one.
The British people should be allowed to make up their own minds.
I am no Little Englander btw....I am from Scotland.

[Rory Winter]

Huh? What do you mean, do I want to? Fact is we already do live in a One-Party State in the Disunited Kingdom!

And that's everything to do with Britain's imperialist past and current pretensions up the Americans' arse than anything else!

[Rory Winter]

Well, Chaos Warrior, you keep your Amerikan massa and let us choose democracy within a European Confederation.

Ask any slave and they'll tell you, better the slavery you know than an uncertain future where you accept your true responsibility as its co-creators.

[Chaos Warrior]

whatever......
You've stated your case....I disagree as do the above posters.
Banging on about it won't change my mind.
We're adults and if you read my post you would know that I would rather see real change..where we have no overlords.

[Rory Winter]

Ok, we both agree on that. Joining an anti-European bandwagon, however, won't improve things. It'll just ensure we stay the Americans' slaves.

[Leiff]

Thanks for the debate!

[Rory Winter]

You too, Leiff & Chaos Warrior. Off for a (typically British) tea break now!

[Chaos Warrior]

[uselesseater]

'If you don't want to share government with the rest of Europe you are xenophobic'

So the people of the EU must be xenophobic against people outrside it.

Tut tut...

Obviously another reason for world government - so glad the NWO are here to save humaninty from thousands of years of bigotry.

[Rory Winter]

Leiff, I tried to watch that Google video right through but after eighteen-and-a-half minutes ran out of patience. Here are my observations on the bit I did manage to watch.

The video definitely seems to originate from the right-wing UKIP group, including the usual suspects like Nigel Farage, Edward Fox and Norris MacWhirter (the last being the co-founder of the extreme right group, the Freedom Association with links with the US neocons and extreme right).

The video is clearly xenophobic in its anti-German and anti-French content. It also starts off with a lot of blimpish clips of the glorious Union Jack (now heartily despised even by the English!) and Battle of Britain shots.

It goes on to describe how the EEC was a Nazi conspiracy to "dominate the peace", done so presumably by the issuing of various EEC Directives on cheese etc, shared by that cowardly Frenchman, De Gaulle, who finally buried the hatchet with Germany.

Of course, it doesn't mention that one condition of Britain's signing of the Treaty of Rome was its requirement to sign the Human Rights Act --which it finally did forty-nine years after the Treaty was first brought about!

At no point does the video dare to look in a critical way at the blatantly unequal Anglo-American 'special relationship'. Indeed, it describes NATO as a "defensive organisation to protect Europe" rather than the truth, ie that NATO is an aggressive, imperialist organisation created to protect US interests in Europe and elsewhere (eg Afghanistan).

So many inaccuracies and twisted facts! I was right in the first place. This kind of propagandistic trash is an insult to one's intelligence. Just the kind of thing that UKIP churns out for its shady extreme rightist financiers.

The sad thing is that by appealing to Little Englander emotions it fools a lot of good folk into thinking that its message is somehow libertarian. It also does a great disservice to democracy by distracting folk from the real culprits who are taking away our freedoms and turning Britain into a totalitarian, corporate state.

Having worked alongside many good European democrats within the European Parliament I am deeply saddened to see the way that the democratic European message is lost among all the other right-wing vested interests both within the EU structure and their right-wing counterparts who rail against it.

This video should have a public health warning: The following lies are meant to get you to vote for UKIP's Colonel Blimps.

[Rory Winter]

Uselesseater, if you think that 'Britain' is free or independent then you are very, very deluded. Try a diet with more vitamins.

[Leiff]

[Rory Winter]

I'm not going to answer your replies in detail because it would be a waste of my time.

Much as he despises the EU, Farage is not above accepting a nice MEPs salary from it. Farage is a joke amongst other MEPs. So's his party.

When Scotland get's itself together and insists on independence, your beloved Union Flag will have to be binned anyway. So better stick with St George if he doesn't object!

St George's Cross. I wonder why?