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Killtown
9/11 Truth critic
Joined: 06 Oct 2006
Posts: 438
Location: That Yankee country the U.S.
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Witchfinder General
Moderate Poster
Joined: 14 Apr 2007
Posts: 134
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 Posted: Fri May 04, 2007 6:20 am Post subject: |
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Hi Killtown
I get the impression the entire footage is faked (not just the plane being added in)
You have produced a lot of credible evidence to prove fakery, My Witchfinder vibes tell me you are thinking of producing a video
"The 911 planes how you were conned"
As you know there are lurkers on most 911 sites who's primary objective is to poo poo no planes, the main protaganists in that department here are Chek, Fallious, John White, Snowygrouch & Emptybee.
Let's see what pathetic attempts they come up with to debunk your posting. |
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marky 54
Mega Poster
Joined: 18 Aug 2006
Posts: 3293
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2007 7:56 am Post subject: |
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no honestly i agree it is certainly fake and i cannot hear sirens once the plane has hit....
ill only be called a shill etc if i disagree so no point adding my opinon. good luck convincing others though as i noticed on thing you mention about the video that isnt true, however having an opinon or pointing that out makes me a shill so i wont, good luck. |
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marky 54
Mega Poster
Joined: 18 Aug 2006
Posts: 3293
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2007 8:23 am Post subject: |
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| Witchfinder General wrote: | Hi Killtown
I get the impression the entire footage is faked (not just the plane being added in)
You have produced a lot of credible evidence to prove fakery, My Witchfinder vibes tell me you are thinking of producing a video
"The 911 planes how you were conned"
As you know there are lurkers on most 911 sites who's primary objective is to poo poo no planes, the main protaganists in that department here are Chek, Fallious, John White, Snowygrouch & Emptybee.
Let's see what pathetic attempts they come up with to debunk your posting. |
nice post, talk about make what these people say void before they have a chance to say anything.
dont listen to these people.............
so basically anyone who disagree with the evidence or no planes is a shill?
it has nothing to do with honesty right?
then you wonder why no planers are called no brainers.
NOTE TO PEOPLE: dont post here unless you fully agree.
this thread is not allowed dissenters to this evidence or else you are all shilly types 
just nod your head and agree even if you do see problems or have evidence to the contray. |
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marky 54
Mega Poster
Joined: 18 Aug 2006
Posts: 3293
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2007 8:40 am Post subject: |
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| killtowns logo is very fitting to how no planers think. rather than an american sleeve it should just read no planes. |
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Micpsi
Moderate Poster
Joined: 13 Feb 2007
Posts: 505
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2007 12:32 pm Post subject: Re: Scott Myers vid: No people heard & sirens stop after |
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OK. So the sound track is altered in some way after the plane crashes. Does that necessarily spell "fabricated"? Of course not. Why would someone hoaxing a video leave out the genuine, initial sound track containing the sirens as soon as the plane had crashed? Would that not be inviting suspicion? Of course! So why would he do it? After all, he didn't have to, did he? Answer: he wouldn't, unless he was stupid. But then what is more reasonable: asking someone to believe that a hoaxer would leave a clue that he had hoaxed his film, or had been sloppy in how he stuck together different sound tracks (!), or asking someone to disbelieve that the masking of the sounds of the sirens after the plane crashed is merely the result of corruption of the sound track at this point?
As for the lack of sound of screaming people, this suggests to me that some sound track borrowed from another recording has been added later to the video footage because the person who took the film did not have his microphone switched on at the time. Call that fakery if you wish. But it is hardly SINISTER fabrication, is it? It certainly does not call into question the authenticity of the video recording, which is consistent with similar recordings from numerous other sources.
No evidence that Scott Myers exists? But there is no definite evidence he doesn't exist! Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
Next, my comment on your statement at your linked webpage: "Other things to notice is that the sound of the explosion is greatly delayed from when the explosion happens and there is no deceleration, crumpling and/or breaking of this alleged aluminum plane as it is seen crashing into the side of this steel skyscraper."
Oh, come on! "Greatly delayed"? Not at all. Pure hyperbole. Allowing for the speed of sound of 340m/sec and the distance of the point of impact (several hundred metres), the sound delay is entirely consistent with the event. As for the lack of deceleration, do you really expect us to believe that any such effect would be detectable by the human eye? That's completely ridiculous. Even NPTers like Morgan Reynolds don't argue that. And it is disingenuous to argue that the absence of crumpling or breaking apart of the plane is a sign that the film is hoaxed. Firstly, the angle at which the film is taken is such that any such disintegration would be difficult to notice because it would be seen sideways. Secondly, at the moment of impact, a natural plume of dust and debris IS visible coming away from the impact area. This is excellent evidence that the footage is genuine. Thirdly, anything that broke away from the plane could have likely been carried forward by its own momentum into the hole made by the plane. Parts of the plane that instantly broke off would only have remained visible if they had rebounded off the building and then dropped to the ground instead of penetrating the gap made by the wings and fuselage of the plane. I am not getting into the argument whether it was impossible for the whole plane to penetrate the tower. All I am saying is that it is not at all obvious that such broken-off pieces would be visible in a film that was taken at such an acute angle to the north wall of the South Tower that the impact area was completely obscured.
In conclusion, your evidence does not prove your claim that this film is faked. Certainly, the sound track changed after the plane crashed. But that does not prove fakery beyond reasonable doubt. There is a perfectly natural explanation for it that proves nothing more sinister than that either the sound track became degraded after the explosion or whoever took this film may have added bits of soundtracks from other videos because his microphone had been switched off at the time the plane hit the tower. Big deal! |
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Martin J
Minor Poster
Joined: 19 Mar 2007
Posts: 18
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2007 1:08 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for the great research man  |
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Banish
Moderate Poster
Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 250
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2007 2:44 pm Post subject: Re: Scott Myers vid: No people heard & sirens stop after |
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| Micpsi wrote: |
OK. So the sound track is altered in some way after the plane crashes. Does that necessarily spell "fabricated"? Of course not. Why would someone hoaxing a video leave out the genuine, initial sound track containing the sirens as soon as the plane had crashed? Would that not be inviting suspicion? Of course! So why would he do it? After all, he didn't have to, did he? Answer: he wouldn't, unless he was stupid. But then what is more reasonable: asking someone to believe that a hoaxer would leave a clue that he had hoaxed his film, or had been sloppy in how he stuck together different sound tracks (!), or asking someone to disbelieve that the masking of the sounds of the sirens after the plane crashed is merely the result of corruption of the sound track at this point?
As for the lack of sound of screaming people, this suggests to me that some sound track borrowed from another recording has been added later to the video footage because the person who took the film did not have his microphone switched on at the time. Call that fakery if you wish. But it is hardly SINISTER fabrication, is it? It certainly does not call into question the authenticity of the video recording, which is consistent with similar recordings from numerous other sources.
No evidence that Scott Myers exists? But there is no definite evidence he doesn't exist! Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
Next, my comment on your statement at your linked webpage: "Other things to notice is that the sound of the explosion is greatly delayed from when the explosion happens and there is no deceleration, crumpling and/or breaking of this alleged aluminum plane as it is seen crashing into the side of this steel skyscraper."
Oh, come on! "Greatly delayed"? Not at all. Pure hyperbole. Allowing for the speed of sound of 340m/sec and the distance of the point of impact (several hundred metres), the sound delay is entirely consistent with the event. As for the lack of deceleration, do you really expect us to believe that any such effect would be detectable by the human eye? That's completely ridiculous. Even NPTers like Morgan Reynolds don't argue that. And it is disingenuous to argue that the absence of crumpling or breaking apart of the plane is a sign that the film is hoaxed. Firstly, the angle at which the film is taken is such that any such disintegration would be difficult to notice because it would be seen sideways. Secondly, at the moment of impact, a natural plume of dust and debris IS visible coming away from the impact area. This is excellent evidence that the footage is genuine. Thirdly, anything that broke away from the plane could have likely been carried forward by its own momentum into the hole made by the plane. Parts of the plane that instantly broke off would only have remained visible if they had rebounded off the building and then dropped to the ground instead of penetrating the gap made by the wings and fuselage of the plane. I am not getting into the argument whether it was impossible for the whole plane to penetrate the tower. All I am saying is that it is not at all obvious that such broken-off pieces would be visible in a film that was taken at such an acute angle to the north wall of the South Tower that the impact area was completely obscured.
In conclusion, your evidence does not prove your claim that this film is faked. Certainly, the sound track changed after the plane crashed. But that does not prove fakery beyond reasonable doubt. There is a perfectly natural explanation for it that proves nothing more sinister than that either the sound track became degraded after the explosion or whoever took this film may have added bits of soundtracks from other videos because his microphone had been switched off at the time the plane hit the tower. Big deal! |
bs. |
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marky 54
Mega Poster
Joined: 18 Aug 2006
Posts: 3293
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2007 3:12 pm Post subject: |
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in your opinon.
i hear sirens before and after the plane strike, admitidly the sirens are harder to make out due to the noise of the plane explosion and crackling kind of noise(maybe debris or glass hitting the building on the way down and the ground) but if you listen you can just make out sirens.
the reason its harder to hear them is because the gap inbetween each siren tone is filled in with all the noises of plane crash explosion and debris.
anything else said about the video is correct, however some of it i'd have no way of knowing for example the person who made it not exsisting.
if you dont like my opinon tough! i had it. the sirens don't cut off they are just harder to hear. |
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ishaar
Moderate Poster
Joined: 22 Jun 2006
Posts: 232
Location: uk
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2007 3:21 pm Post subject: |
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| Does the smoke coming from the first tower to be hit react the way it should given there has just been a huge inferno / explosion in close proximity? |
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marky 54
Mega Poster
Joined: 18 Aug 2006
Posts: 3293
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2007 3:30 pm Post subject: |
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it appears it does as the smoke and hot air moves up it has an effect on the smoke issuing from the first tower, i say it appears to but i dont know if it should react that way.
but the explosion certainly effects the smoke from the other tower. |
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Dogsmilk
Mighty Poster
Joined: 06 Oct 2006
Posts: 1616
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2007 3:49 pm Post subject: |
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| marky 54 wrote: | in your opinon.
i hear sirens before and after the plane strike, admitidly the sirens are harder to make out due to the noise of the plane explosion and crackling kind of noise(maybe debris or glass hitting the building on the way down and the ground) but if you listen you can just make out sirens.
the reason its harder to hear them is because the gap inbetween each siren tone is filled in with all the noises of plane crash explosion and debris.
anything else said about the video is correct, however some of it i'd have no way of knowing for example the person who made it not exsisting.
if you dont like my opinon tough! i had it. the sirens don't cut off they are just harder to hear. |
Yeah, it seems to me the noise of the hit just drowns out everything else. It's a shame the footage doesn't run longer until after all the noise from the explosion has settled down.
| Witchfinder General wrote: | | As you know there are lurkers on most 911 sites who's primary objective is to poo poo no planes, the main protaganists in that department here are Chek, Fallious, John White, Snowygrouch & Emptybee. |
They're hardly 'lurkers'and post on a wide array of threads. Or has all the work Snowygrouch has done escaped you? They disagree with you. Stop being silly.
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Killtown
9/11 Truth critic
Joined: 06 Oct 2006
Posts: 438
Location: That Yankee country the U.S.
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2007 4:46 pm Post subject: Re: Scott Myers vid: No people heard & sirens stop after |
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| Micpsi wrote: | | In conclusion, your evidence does not prove your claim that this film is faked. |
Where did I claim it's fake?
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killtown.blogspot.com - 911movement.org |
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marky 54
Mega Poster
Joined: 18 Aug 2006
Posts: 3293
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2007 4:58 pm Post subject: |
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| you didnt witchfinder did though, then tried to point out who isnt allowed an opinon on this video clip. |
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gruts
Major Poster
Joined: 28 Apr 2007
Posts: 1050
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2007 5:00 pm Post subject: Re: Scott Myers vid: No people heard & sirens stop after |
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| Killtown wrote: | | Where did I claim it's fake? |
on killtown.blogspot.com
Posted by Killtown at 5/03/2007
Labels: TV-Fakery |
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Killtown
9/11 Truth critic
Joined: 06 Oct 2006
Posts: 438
Location: That Yankee country the U.S.
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2007 5:19 pm Post subject: Re: Scott Myers vid: No people heard & sirens stop after |
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| gruts wrote: | | Killtown wrote: | | Where did I claim it's fake? |
on killtown.blogspot.com
Posted by Killtown at 5/03/2007
Labels: TV-Fakery |
Just checked my blogpost again and don't see where you guys claim I said that video is fake.
[Edit]Oh, the label "TV-Fakery". It's just a subject title.
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ian neal
Angel - now passed away
Joined: 26 Jul 2005
Posts: 3140
Location: UK
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2007 5:52 pm Post subject: |
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Hi Killtown and respect. For those unaware Killtown compiled the 250 smoking guns that is linked on our front page.
Can I just remind people of some ground rules before we continue?
1) First absolute rule is no personal abuse, ad hominems, silly names or the like. Imagine you are having this discussion in front of your elderly grandmothers.
2) No accusations of shill or agent. If you believe someone is not being honest or is something other than what they say they are, check with me before you share your suspicions publicly.
3) Don't start new threads on this topic. Keep it in one place.
4) Focus on the evidence
So no more comments like 'bs' or 'pathetic'.
I didn't intervene early on in the Fred threads because at the time I didn't have the ability to enforce any bans, but that has changed.
Carry on |
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andrewwatson
Moderate Poster
Joined: 14 Feb 2006
Posts: 348
Location: Norfolk
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| Posted: Tue May 08, 2007 9:02 am Post subject: |
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Ian,
As one who has supported Fred and Killtown in the debate over TV fakery at the WTC, I applaud and support your recent intervention in the tangled web of accusations and counter-accusations. I am glad that John White has stepped down.
Whatever our views, we have to say civil to each other or we will all end up in the same dustbin - the utter rejection of our efforts to show up the 911 lie by the public who have been lied to. So let's support each other 's right to disagree but not their right to be abusive. |
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Stefan
Banned
Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 1219
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| Posted: Tue May 08, 2007 10:15 am Post subject: |
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The massive sound of the explosion simply drowns out all the other sound for a split second, after which it returns. There's no mystery there.
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