Wiilliam Rodriguez Invited to Iran

[Andrew Johnson]

This thread has been moved pending moderation, due to accusations etc made. Please keep these sorts of accusations to private messages and e-mails if you feel you need to make them!

Thanks!

[dry kleaner]

"The conquest of the earth, which mostly means the taking it away from those who have a different complexion or slightly flatter noses than ourselves, is not a pretty thing when you look into it too much."
Joseph Conrad, Hearts of Darkness

[Keith Mothersson]

As I see it this needn't be a 'row' or 'dirty linen', but a necessary discussion about how/when to exercise consstructive authority to draw lines to protect this forum as the kind of site where Muslims and non-Muslims can in future continue to co-operate and discuss with respect and in the interests of revealing the truth about 911 which was anti-Islam from inception, incidentally:

Andrew's announcement about the thread being moved pending moderation might inadvertently confuse some people who didn't realise it has been removed to here in the Moderated Zone of the Private Forum (so you need to be logged on):
http://www.nineeleven.co.uk/board/viewtopic.php?t=6015&postdays=0&post order=asc&start=30

With all due respect to Andrew's great contributions to our cause (among other ways by the work involved in moderating parts of this forum), I and others regret that the thread was moved (and a lot of painstakingly written in-depth arguments pro- and con-Iran visit rendered less accessible) rather than have basic forum norms enforced about not using serious accusations and hate-speech metaphors in the course of arguing a political position. I do hope this can now happen if the alleged abuser doesn't apologise sincerely and fully.

[Belinda]

There is no question of treating Iran or any other nation as a pariah nation. Please can we distinguish between governments and people, is that so difficult?

The Iranian people have long wished to vote out their government and have been unable to do so as elections are fixed allowing only pro-clerical regime candidates to stand.

We do the Iranian people no favours if we conflate them with their corrupt government, which goes also for mainstream Islam being conflated with the fanatical and barbaric version operating in Iran.

[blackbear]

Hello Belinda...

Have you ever posted about the people of Israel and the colonised lands their government occupy.

Have you ever criticised the fascist nazi * who control that "democracy".

Have you ever posted about the present day holocaust against muslims.

From Alice....Then, my eye is caught by Avigdor Lieberman, a man who openly and unambiguously calls for ethnic cleansing, and who has been rewarded with a cabinet position by our civilized, democratic friend, Israel, while almost a third of the Palestinian cabinet ministers have been kidnapped and held hostage in Israeli prison, for no damn reason, and with no outcry whatsoever. Avigdor Lieberman, unlike David Irving, is welcomed to the United States, an honored guest, a true privilege to hear him speak.

Ahmedinajad, compared to Olmert, is a saint. As far as I know, he hasn't harmed a fly in his life, let alone invade another country and kill 1,200 civilians, up to a third of them children, using mysterious weapons that cause maximum pain and lingering death. Nor has he admitted to dropping 2 to 3 million cluster bombs that look like toys, in population centres, blowing off the foot, hand or head of people trying to shelter in their own homes or harvest their own crops. Yet we are told over and over again that Olmert: Good, and Ahmedinajad: Bad. Olmert has at least 200 nuclear warheads. Ahmedinajad has none. But the Wise Ones Who Tell Us What To Think, have ordered us to consider Ahmedinajad a terrible nuclear threat, whose country must be bombed by...Olmert (who is NOT considered a nuclear threat).

Love is blind + birds of a feather.....come to mind.

[paul wright]

Slow down Tom. We know the comparativeness of it all In my view
Ahmedinajad is not a saint, but merely asking for it. He seems to be asking for what he gets. Namely an Israeli mininuke attack on his facilities, as posted elsewhere on this forum. We know about patsies, we know about moles. We know about people who invite in NWO attacks on themselves and their countries and escape freely - Afghanistan UBL the upper Taliban, imo Saddam.
Ahmedinajad fits perfectly in the agent provocateur picture, achieving the objective of a nuclear attacked country through his own utterances

[Belinda]

Blackbear - Tom - whoever you are but glad if you've got a proper name! I'm merely trying to redress a blind spot here. Ahmadinejad is by no means the saint his letter to Bush might imply so let's not be seduced by that. He's hurt far more than flies, in fact great numbers of these more-than-flies as any Iranian knows.

DH has put his finger on it - wittingly or unwittingly Ahamdinejad is playing his part in an unfolding confrontation scenario of which the ordinary people of the Middle East and of his own country Iran will be the victims. I doubt he gives a fig about the ordinary people of his country, any more than any other fanatical leader. Or cold calculating one such as Olmert and his Zionist mentors.

As I see it our truth campaign is urgently addressed to the PEOPLE of any country not their governments. We must disentangle the two in our minds and simultaneously expose ALL governments that espouse a globalist agenda and are prepared to sacrifice their own people in the realisation of that agenda. By this token Ahmadinejad is on the same wicket as Bush & Olmert. As I said a few posts back we should continue to spread our truth message as widely as possible but as a matter of hygeine steer right clear of the main protagonists in the immediate theatre of war.

[Lynne]

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Is this an arguenent however about Irans domestic policy or it's foreign policy? It is evident that when it comes to press regarding Iran , it is very easy to take snapshots and fail to look at Iran in the proper perspective. It has not not attacked anyone and there is no reason to assume that will. It may hold an opinion of Israel that you do not hold, but it has made clear that any threat to Israli would come about if a threat was made towards themselves.

Ever heard of propoganda?

They do a good Job on Iran

[Patrick Brown]

[Lynne]

You are correct we must distinguish between the people and those in power. However to have this bias when it comes to speaking about Iran in the international context favours and upholds the view peddled by Israel and the American neocons that Iran is a threat to international security. That then fails ALL people. Just as the War in Iraq used the reason of his government as one of their justifications.

Supporting The Iranian governments view regarding international politics does not equate with supporting that government. Just as When Bush Claims that Saddam was a tyrannat, it does not mean i supported his war.

As for holoucast denial, you have to actualy to see the difference between asking questions, is that not what we all should do instead of simply accepting history as it is written , as history is not infaliable.

[Patrick Brown]

[dry kleaner]

Religion, nationality, borders etc are a state of mind. A state of mind that has been implanted in us since the day we were born. It is difficult for anyone to imagine a world with out religion, nationality and borders. That world is possible but unfortunately it looks like someone else is trying to create that world for us, but it'll be a world born out of blood. A few years back I came across an interesting book called 'Pawns in the Game' in which it proposes that WW2 was set up to instate Israel and sow the seeds for WW3 which would be a war between Muslims, Jews and Christians. As we have seen the Israel Palestine issue is such a topic which inspires much emotion and distracts us from what maybe happening and a possible larger picture. The debate that has taken place has now developed into a situation in which we have two camps. One for Iran and one against it. What is Iran? Its a country. What is a country? A piece of land on this planet that has a defined space set out by a political system. The piece of land is real but the political system that is used to define its space is only real if we choose it to be. Now of course if only a few of us decide not to accept the system that defines the piece of land it wont make the slightest bit of difference. If we all, and I mean the whole world tomorrow decided to no longer accept the political systems that define the land on this planet then there would be no more Israel, Palestine, Iran, USA, UK. Bush, Blair etc would all be out of a job and it would be one less thing to defend or distract ourselves with. We instead could all get off this forum and meet each other. We could get to know how great man kind is and what a wonderful planet we live on.

So the choice is ours. Will we let 2007 be the year of another pointless great war or will we make it a year in which peace can be a collective reality?

I leave you with an extract from an interview by Eckhart Tolle that I feel has an important message.

http://www.ecomall.com/greenshopping/eckharttolle.htm

[Keith Mothersson]

[Lynne]